NWI Click it or ticket (till June 2014)

[Snapdragon]

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[melensdad]

I think it will help. But I suppose there will always be new kinds of stupid that we will have to regulate. The stupid is growing faster than we can keep up.

Legislation always comes AFTER the fact.

I vote for LIBERTY. Allow the free market, via the insurance companies, to work, unencumbered to resolve these things.

 

[Suprtek]

I think it will help. But I suppose there will always be new kinds of stupid that we will have to regulate. The stupid is growing faster than we can keep up.

There's an old saying...I know you've heard it. You can't fix stupid.

 

[Snapdragon]

Or maybe their wives will nag them until they wear a seat belt?

It probably won't happen.

Or maybe they have money in the bank and will have to pay their way?

That probably won't happen either.

Or maybe they have equity in their home and will have to take out a mortgage to pay for their hospital bills?

Or maybe they'll just file bankruptcy, and then everyone is screwed.

Why presume that WE must pay for their actions?

Because that's how insurance works, such that it is.

 

[Snapdragon]

There's an old saying...I know you've heard it. You can't fix stupid.

I know... my comment was rhetorical...

 

[jbombelli]

There's an old saying...I know you've heard it. You can't fix stupid.

No. But you can let it die.

 

[Snapdragon]

But with stupid often dies its children, or friends, or innocent bystanders. Unfortunate.

 

[Bunnykid68]

But people's foolishness does not only hurt them. It raises the insurance premiums of people who are less willing to engage in foolishness.

Dont get insurance then....oh wait...they made that a law that you had to buy insurance didnt they

 

[Bunnykid68]

How about people accept responsibility for their own actions?

Act foolish and pay the price.

Act in a responsible fashion and save a bit of coin.

Life insurance premiums are lower for non-smokers who don't ride motorcycles, scuba dive or skydive. Life insurance is more expensive for those who engage in risky behavior.

How about people who don't use seat belts simply pay higher rates for auto insurance? No penalty for those who wear them, no spreading the costs to all. Just individual responsibility and that preserves individual liberty.

I always support liberty.

I may engage in personal responsibility by wearing a seatbelt, but I don't do it because some silly bureaucrat or some do-gooder representative wrote a law that stripped me of my liberty. I wear a seatbelt of my own choice. If I choose not to wear one at some point it will be because I am free to do so and because I exercise my liberty to choose to be foolish. That is my right!

Why did you start wearing a seatbelt? I started wearing one because I did not want the STATE bothering me with their little enforcers

 

[Bunnykid68]

I think it will help. But I suppose there will always be new kinds of stupid that we will have to regulate. The stupid is growing faster than we can keep up.

Same stupid, different perspective

 

[Bunnykid68]

But with stupid often dies its children, or friends, or innocent bystanders. Unfortunate.

That sucks, but it's part of life, we cannot save everyone and everyone should not be saved.

 

[ModernGunner]

Wearing seatbelts should be a guideline, not a law. Just like motorcycle helmets. The "because it saves lives" simply doesn't wash, whether true or not true. The choice should be left entirely up to the citizen. Everyone already knows it's a revenue generator.

Nor does the "because you MIGHT fly through the windshield". You also might NOT. Speed and impact (or lack thereof) are more of an indicator of what will happen to the occupant(s) way more than wearing a seatbelt, or not.

Typical (street) car seatbelt design isn't even close to 'good enough'. How many race cars do we see with the same seatbelt design used in the common street automobile? None. Nor do we find roll-cages as we do in race cars.

The idea of stopping, perhaps, hundreds of law-abiding citizens at some 'checkpoint' NOT violating the law in the off chance of catching a couple to do should be (actually is) a violation of the right to freedom to go about your business. But that's probably another thread.

Push to change the law, but until then, just wear the stupid thing. It MIGHT save you in a crash, it might NOT. But at least you're not shelling out hard earned cash for something stupid. If ya got too much $$$ on your hands, I can always use more ammunition!

Lastly, anyone actually believing it 'keeps down insurance rates' sure doesn't understand business. If there were NO car accidents this year, anywhere in the country, your insurance rate wouldn't drop by any noticeable amount, if at all. Same with next year. The insurance company would simply find a different 'justification' to raise your rate.

That 'your rate goes down if you don't have an accident' is a come-on. Since, when you start with your insurance company, you've had no accident for them to pay out, the rate should ALREADY be miniscule. And, if you drive, say 30 years, with no accidents, do you get that money (or most of it) refunded? Nope.

 

[Destro]

In the end the money does benefit the Depts though, since they get their money from those other .gov agencies that are collecting the money.

Local law enforcement gets their money from local tax collections, not from some state slush fund of ticket revenue.

 

[melensdad]

Why did you start wearing a seatbelt? I started wearing one because I did not want the STATE bothering me with their little enforcers

Because I grew up long ago when we drove little two seat rag top sports cars that were small enough to drive UNDER a semi-trailer. That was back in the day when MGBs, Triumph Spitfires and TR6s were common. I owned or rode in all those vehicles and they are, by todays standards, tiny, low slung death traps. When you look up at the underbelly of a semi-trailer you learn to wear a seatbelt.

But with stupid often dies its children, or friends, or innocent bystanders. Unfortunate.

Really? Please explain to me, logically, how my wearing a seat belt saves the life of a child in my car or the life of an innocent bystander.

Conversely, how does me not wearing a seatbelt cause a child, friend or bystander to die?

 

[Gluemanz28]

I started wearing a seatbelt after I survived a severe car crash. I flew 65 ft in the air and jumped over a creek in Owensville, IN. I went through the windshield and almost died. The experts said that if I was wearing my seatbelt I would have died from the impact to my chest. I was driving a 1979 Firebird and fell asleep at the wheel.

Even though I would have died from wearing my seatbelt, I now wear it all the time. I have a wife, four children and five grandchildren that count on me. The odds are in my favor of surviving a crash if I'm wearing my seatbelt regardless of whether it is a law or not.

I was pulled over last year in Shipshewana by a local LE. I asked why he pulled me over (I knew I was about 7 mph over and was expecting speeding) He said I wasn't wearing my seatbelt even though it was on. He said I must have put it on because I didn't have it on when I passed him. I told him my story about the crash and that I wear it all the time. He said that he would wait until he got back to the place where he was sitting and rewind the tape (he couldn't stop it during the interaction with me) and if he could tell I was wearing a seatbelt I was good to go. If it showed no belt then he would send the ticket by mail. I told him if he could show me evidence of no belt I would buy him and his wife a steak dinner because I was positive.

Well I didn't get a ticket in the mail and no steak dinner for the officer.

 

[Snapdragon]

But with stupid often dies its children, or friends, or innocent bystanders. Unfortunate.

Really? Please explain to me, logically, how my wearing a seat belt saves the life of a child in my car or the life of an innocent bystander.

Conversely, how does me not wearing a seatbelt cause a child, friend or bystander to die?

Unless you're stupid, I'm not referring to you here.

 

[melensdad]

I did not think you were specifically referring to me. But the question remains.

How does my wearing, or not wearing, a seatbelt either save the life of, or risk the life of another?

If I don't have my seatbelt on, but my passengers do, I may sail through the windshield and die while they all survive, no matter who caused the accident. Conversely, if I wear my seatbelt, and run over an innocent bystander, they probably will die when the front end of my car causes massive trauma to their body.

So I don't understand how the seatbelt law affects anyone other them ME.

But I do understand how it restricts liberty. I do understand that its a money generator for government. I do understand that its a feel good law.

 

[Snapdragon]

If you go through your windshield and die or turn into a vegetable, it affects more people than just you. We were also referring to helmets earlier; same deal. Some guy riding a bike without a helmet may not care, but his death will affect his spouse and/or kids.

And I mentioned the ever-changing "new kinds of stupid" (texting, for example). There are so many different kinds of stupid (like people holding their kids' hands while they drag them in front of moving vehicles that they assume will see them and stop). I know we can't keep up with them all, but how far do we go? I don't have the answers.

Melensdad, how do you feel about making laws against texting, or other activities that can cause harm to others, not just the driver?

 

[Destro]

So I don't understand how the seatbelt law affects anyone other them ME.

how do you think it affects the people who have to clean up the mess?

 

[actaeon277]

Guess we better stop using cars then. Don't want a mess.