$500 vs $2500 AR-15

[GasTube138]

The reality is, is most budget ARs are, in fact, truly "good enough" for most shooters. Most people aren't going to use them in any serious manner. Some range use. Maybe a few competitions now and then. Nothing crazy.

Just like any gun it kind of comes down to "what are YOU using this for?" As long as it's not an UNSAFE gun, I don't really care what others use or judge them for it.

I only have 3 ARs. An early DPMS, a Bushmaster and a PSA. For my use, those are fine enough. One is a midlength, ones a shorty and ones a dissipator. I do want a nice 20" eventually. I'll probably put more into that.

 

[bdj357]

The reality is, is most budget ARs are, in fact, truly "good enough" for most shooters. Most people aren't going to use them in any serious manner. Some range use. Maybe a few competitions now and then. Nothing crazy.

Just like any gun it kind of comes down to "what are YOU using this for?" As long as it's not an UNSAFE gun, I don't really care what others use or judge them for it.

I only have 3 ARs. An early DPMS, a Bushmaster and a PSA. For my use, those are fine enough. One is a midlength, ones a shorty and ones a dissipator. I do want a nice 20" eventually. I'll probably put more into that.

Exactly

 

[Purdue1991]

The reality is, is most budget ARs are, in fact, truly "good enough" for most shooters. Most people aren't going to use them in any serious manner. Some range use. Maybe a few competitions now and then. Nothing crazy.

Just like any gun it kind of comes down to "what are YOU using this for?" As long as it's not an UNSAFE gun, I don't really care what others use or judge them for it.

I only have 3 ARs. An early DPMS, a Bushmaster and a PSA. For my use, those are fine enough. One is a midlength, ones a shorty and ones a dissipator. I do want a nice 20" eventually. I'll probably put more into that.

Yep, that's right.

I always love overreaction on both sides. One side says budget manufacturers like Bear Creek are "junk". I own an LR-308 with an Aero Precision lower and Bear Creek upper. It shoots MOA with no issue and cycles well. For my purposes of deer hunting with it at less than 250 yards, it's perfect.

Then there's the side that says I'll put my budget rifle up against any competitive shooting rifle. Yeah, right...

 

[GasTube138]

I've seen dudes compete with "trash" and kill it honestly. So there's something to be said for skill and training. But their chances of failure (and then risk of a lousy score) was always there. That's where you need at LEAST something that's not going to have feed issues etc. Like, if you can just get something that generally runs reliably in controlled conditions, that's the bare minimum. Then hope you don't need it for worse situations.

 

[DadSmith]

Yep, that's right.

I always love overreaction on both sides. One side says budget manufacturers like Bear Creek are "junk". I own an LR-308 with an Aero Precision lower and Bear Creek upper. It shoots MOA with no issue and cycles well. For my purposes of deer hunting with it at less than 250 yards, it's perfect.

Then there's the side that says I'll put my budget rifle up against any competitive shooting rifle. Yeah, right...

How hard have you ran it, and would you trust it if a civilization breaking event happened tomorrow morning?

@92FSTech has some very good points.
As I stated above everyone has their idea of reliable and what kind of testing they do to get to that belief. I'd like to hear different opinions on what testing is needed to make people feel confident in their AR-15 or AR-10.

 

[GasTube138]

To me, if you run about 1-2k rounds through it in something like adverse training or a really involved competition (meaning running, shooting from weird angles, getting it dirty, getting it beat up) and it's mostly fine, then that's all MOST people will need to see if it's "reliable" for most situations for them.

I've learned 1k rounds flat, shooting at paper, 1 round every 2-5 seconds is WAY different than 1k rounds, rapid fire or bursts, running, falling, weird angles, getting it dirty, getting it beat up etc. I've had guns that run fine flat, slow etc. Then when I try to do training with them, the flaws come out. FTEs, jams, was it the gun? Was it the dirt and weird angle I shot from? Was it ME? Did I outrun the trigger? Was my hand somewhere stupid? Things like that.

 

[Purdue1991]

How hard have you ran it, and would you trust it if a civilization breaking event happened tomorrow morning?

@92FSTech has some very good points.
As I stated above everyone has their idea of reliable and what kind of testing they do to get to that belief. I'd like to hear different opinions on what testing is needed to make people feel confident in their AR-15 or AR-10.

I'm not using it for a "civilization breaking event". I have many other rifles I can go to in that event. I'm using it for hunting. And it works quite well in that application....

 

[cmdrken1]

How well maintained do you think say state police AR15s are? I recently traded for a Colt AR-15A3 and it functions checks fine, the parts all seem low wear besides what you would expect like the Daniels Defense endplate has a lot of wear on the sling mounting slot for example. The FFL had several of them and a ton of Remington police shotguns all looking straight from service. It's a 1:9 HBar 5.56 NATO barrel. Do I really need to dump 1k rounds through it to be reasonably assured it'll work if needed?

 

[NyleRN]

How well maintained do you think say state police AR15s are? I recently traded for a Colt AR-15A3 and it functions checks fine, the parts all seem low wear besides what you would expect like the Daniels Defense endplate has a lot of wear on the sling mounting slot for example. The FFL had several of them and a ton of Remington police shotguns all looking straight from service. It's a 1:9 HBar 5.56 NATO barrel. Do I really need to dump 1k rounds through it to be reasonably assured it'll work if needed?

No you don't. Go out and shoot 5 or 6 mags worth of quality brass. If no failures then the likelihood of that gun continuing to run well is high. I wouldn't think too much into it. I don't vet firearms as hard when they're a known established brand/platform.

 

[DadSmith]

No you don't. Go out and shoot 5 or 6 mags worth of quality brass. If no failures then the likelihood of that gun continuing to run well is high. I wouldn't think too much into it. I don't vet firearms as hard when they're a known established brand/platform.

I'm just the opposite. I don't care if its LWRCI, LaRue, Daniel D, Colt, BCA, Anderson, etc, etc. It has to prove itself before I consider it reliable.

 

[NyleRN]

I'm just the opposite. I don't care if its LWRCI, LaRue, Daniel D, Colt, BCA, Anderson, etc, etc. It has to prove itself before I consider it reliable.

Then what is your threshold? Is it the same for a Daniel Defense rifle vs a Bear Creek?

 

[blue2golf]

The reality is, is most budget ARs are, in fact, truly "good enough" for most shooters. Most people aren't going to use them in any serious manner. Some range use. Maybe a few competitions now and then. Nothing crazy.

Just like any gun it kind of comes down to "what are YOU using this for?" As long as it's not an UNSAFE gun, I don't really care what others use or judge them for it.

I only have 3 ARs. An early DPMS, a Bushmaster and a PSA. For my use, those are fine enough. One is a midlength, ones a shorty and ones a dissipator. I do want a nice 20" eventually. I'll probably put more into that.

Yup, ask Kyle Rittenhouse.

 

[DadSmith]

Then what is your threshold? Is it the same for a Daniel Defense rifle vs a Bear Creek?

It sure isn't a couple of magazines and calling it good because of name brand.
Each rifle gets the same treatment.
After checking the gas block, gas tube, gas key, gas rings and other parts to be sure everything is put together properly I them clean and lube it.
It then must go 1000rds without cleaning with different bullet weight, brands, and reloads without any problems. I'll lube it as needed.
I've taken some of my AR rifles over 2k rounds without cleaning testing thier reliability. Oh, and one of the rifles that went over 2k rounds had an Anderson upper on it.
If all goes well it's good to go.
These tests are not just sitting at a bench shooting 3, 5, or 10 shot accuracy groups. They get shot fast as well aimed, and on target. I do include a few mag dumps here and there also.

Basically the same tests I do with my handguns including Glock, Smith and Wesson, CZ, Springfield, PSA, etc, etc.

Never trust a firearm because of name brand IMO.
I've seen Glocks fail and you can't get much more reliable than a Glock. It was a G22.
Even the best most reputable companies make lemons from time to time.

 

[Kdf101]

I like high end AR’s, but my opinion only, they are not needed for almost any use that a person would actually do. It is nice to know they can go 1k rounds at a time, but when would that be a realistic scenario? A few hundred, maybe. If you have burned through 1k rounds in a single engagement, you have other options. More likely is a few shots and you either win, or are dead. I still li,e high end AR’s though, but completely trust my lower end ones.

 

[DadSmith]

"Daniel Defense is usually known for quality hard use products albeit somewhat on the expensive side. My current Daniel Defense M4A1 RIS 3 had some problems. I have been a fan of Daniel Defense for years since I was very young and still have my MK18 I built nearly 15 years ago. However, after about 500-600 rounds I started to have repeated malfunctions with this brand new Daniel Defense M4A1 RIS3. The rifle was non functional in the box since they safety was lodged into the lower receiver. I changed it out took it to the range and for the few few hundred rounds it ran fine until it didn't on day 2.. So with my faith restored after day one I took it back out for a few hundred more rounds and my faith was again shaken when it experienced multiple malfunctions. I will continue to diagnose the issue and report back after a couple thousand rounds."


Like I said earlier it doesn't matter what brand, or what price you paid for your AR.
You better give it a good vetting, or you may find out it's junk in a very bad situation.

 

[ed1838]

Fired my budget soft shooting hunting ar. Bca upper is 350 legend. Have used this set up before and worked the bugs out several years ago. I shot 1 round to verify zero at 100. It was dead nuts. Then a friends girl friend asked if she could shoot it. She fired 13 rounds, I had 2 mags loaded with 7. As normal had no malfuctions and very impressed with her shots she only shot 50 yard target. But her group could be covered with a half dollar. All 1/2 to 1 and 1/2 high. This upper was under 200 when bought and is on a anderson lower I threw together, added a 100 dollar scope. She told her BF thats what she wants for Christmas, he said no way them bear creek are junk. I just handed him the target.

 

[Purdue1991]

Fired my budget soft shooting hunting ar. Bca upper is 350 legend. Have used this set up before and worked the bugs out several years ago. I shot 1 round to verify zero at 100. It was dead nuts. Then a friends girl friend asked if she could shoot it. She fired 13 rounds, I had 2 mags loaded with 7. As normal had no malfuctions and very impressed with her shots she only shot 50 yard target. But her group could be covered with a half dollar. All 1/2 to 1 and 1/2 high. This upper was under 200 when bought and is on a anderson lower I threw together, added a 100 dollar scope. She told her BF thats what she wants for Christmas, he said no way them bear creek are junk. I just handed him the target.

I'm not sure I understand the hate for BCA. For the money their products are a great value. Would I take one to war? Probably not. But I feel very comfortable hunting with one.

 

[DadSmith]

I'm not sure I understand the hate for BCA. For the money their products are a great value. Would I take one to war? Probably not. But I feel very comfortable hunting with one.

It's a veteran owned company as well.

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[ed1838]

My son -in -law got a BCA and the ejector was not in bolt carrier. They said return the rifle so could be repaired. I told him no, maybe send just the bolt but after digging thru my parts found what was needed. He also got a 350. After fixing that and checking everything (gas block set screws was not tight) and polishing a few places, lubing well and doing alittle clearing on front of mag his runs great. He has put over 100 rounds thru it with no malfunctions. If he does his part it shoots 1 moa good enough for what it is and his use.