a rant that will probably tick quite a few off regarding Military/LEOs

[J_Wales]

People don't realize just how dangerous farming really is. I grew up in North Central Iowa. In a very small rural area. We had one neighbor who's wife had her arm torn off by a grain auger. We had one neighbor who was killed by a holstein bull. And my jr high locker mate was killed when he fell off the tractor and was run over by the disc it was pulling. And his brother (who had been driving the tractor at the time), two years later, was electrocuted when a piece of equipment came into contact with an overhead power line.

No one died in my family, but the list of injuries is long. My grandfather lost a thumb, my brother had his left hand slashed wide open and tendons severed, my dad tore his leg open, and I had a piece of barbed wire driven into my skull (guess that explains a lot).

Indeed.

At 41.4 fatalities per 100K, the occupation of farming is over twice as deadly as that of being a leo.

To add insult to injury, farmers do not even get a shiny badge to help pick up ditzy chicks at the bar when they moonlight as a bouncer!

 

[DCM8513]

The only "issue" i have with military is when ive talked with people that have been overseas at war and they act like theyre something they are not or as if they are better than you. It seems like the people that advertise their service are the ones that went overseas and sat their @** in the sand for a year or so. Not to take credit away from their service but dont act like youre better than everyone else. I guess this is more of an annoyance than a problem though. Aside from that, all military personel have my much deserved and utmost respect for their service to our great country.

LEO on the other hand, i think are a completely different subject. They have too much authority and abuse it all too often. I dont think that all LEO are this way but but the groups integrity is ruined by the rest of them that have none. I have a bad taste in my mouth for LEO and wont give much praise until earned.

 

[jsharmon7]

My thoughts...

I am cool with your attitude. I did not Join the Military or spend the better part of most of my life abroad for your safety nor your security. I joined because I like to break **** other People have paid for and I really like to blow stuff up...

This ^^^.

If I worry about people loving LEOs then I would have to equally worry about them hating us. I don't do it to try to be a hero/hardass, or to have people love/hate me, or to save the world. I do it because it's something that feels "right" to me. It's something I enjoy doing and something I want to continue doing. I feel like I make a little bit of difference every shift I work and I want to continue that, even if nobody else ever notices or cares. I don't expect to be held in higher esteem as the OP mentions, I just want to be given a fair shake.

 

[dom1104]

I believe people wouldnt be asking this question, if our soldiers were defending our neighborhoods, families, and land.

Some people dont see the heroism in Iraq and Afganistan.

It will all be different when the fight comes to our shores.

 

[iChokePeople]

Well... if the OP had expressed resentment for people who EXPECT special treatment because of being a veteran or a LEO or a farmer, I'd be right there with him... but that sure wasn't what it sounded like to me. What it sounded like to me is someone who resents someone else for getting positive attention for something. If that attention somehow took something from the rest of us, I guess maybe I'd understand the complaint, though I still might not agree. As it is, though, I don't see where any kudos or praise given to a soldier or a LEO or to a firefighter or to a school teacher or to anyone else takes anything away from anyone else. Saying soldiers are selfless or brave or something else in no way takes anything from farmers... unless they just have some insecurities that they need to deal with. That's the part I still just don't get -- why do you (plural, those who share this opinion) care? So little Jimmy from Tuscaloosa gets his picture on the news and 5% off at the Tasty Freeze -- why do you care? What does it take from you?

 

[cqcn88]

Something has been swirling around in my grey matter for a while that has really started to irk me.

Why does the general society place such importance on military and LEOs? It is almost as if godhood status has been bestowed on people that have VOLUNTARILY chosen a dangerous profession. It is akin, IMO, to the idiotic idolatry of celebrities. Not any of the above mentioned professions are forced upon a single soul in the USA. We do not have conscription; have not had a draft since the early 1970s; do not force people into jobs that garner the spotlight. These jobs are CHOICES made at the individual level. Pure and simple.

Do not get me wrong. I appreciate most of what military and LEOs do for security purposes. I simply refuse to give them any more credit than "job well done" when it is merited.

Your thoughts?

You are entitled your opinion. I'm assuming you have not served although you did not state this so I apologize if I'm wrong. Many of us have. The job is dangerous, it doesn't pay particularly well, it is indeed voluntary, and it is done to protect your way of life. These are reasons to respect those who do it. I think saying it is akin to idolatry of celebrities is completely over exaggerated, in fact i don't even think it is a valid comparison. I mean really think about it, do you really think the public looks at popular actors and military service members in the same light? Really? That almost seems intentionally inflammatory.

At the end of the day, you can have your opinion. Someone said it earlier, not many service members would really care if a random person has no respect for them, they'd probably just think the person was naive. Personally, I think they deserve much more respect than any celebrity out there.

 

[rambone]

Our society, is a class society, whether we want to admit it or not. It has become more of a class society due to the wars that have been fought continuously for more than a decade.

We elevate everyone in a uniform to "warrior caste" status.

We also have the talking heads telling us that, without a large police presense and a war being fought in a foreign land, we'd all be slaves or dead.

I imagine it would be hard to maintain your humility with every Tom Dick and Harry telling you how awesome you are.

It's all just a product of society, and the inevitable progressive march towards Nationalism.

I tend to agree with this.

 

[nemo97]

I believe people wouldnt be asking this question, if our soldiers were defending our neighborhoods, families, and land.

Some people dont see the heroism in Iraq and Afganistan.

It will all be different when the fight comes to our shores.

I would daresay the day the military is "protecting" my neighborhood will be a dire day indeed and I will be on the move. How far removed are we from having our military used to "protect" us from ourselves?

Having bases worldwide does not make much sense if you want to talk about protecting our homeland. That 38th parallel we've been eyeballing for the past 55+ years... yeah, those north Koreans sure are a threat to us. Who in Europe is threatening us now? Were we as a people honestly meant to be a policing power across the globe? I lean toward the answer being "no." Let others learn to love and cherish freedom if that is what they want. Instead, we try to force our brand of freedom upon others; prop up the military industrial complex (hey, you have to have wars to make sure the war machine is being used and upgraded, right?); embolden the political class to continue to convince the people to trade freedom for security, etc.

Security, IMO, boils down to one thing: Keep the borders secure from foreign invasion. A well-armed society will remain a polite society and have little need for a large military.

 

[jamil]

On a different tack, why does volunteering make it more praiseworthy? Specifically, what about people who don't volunteer, but are put in harm's way because they draw the short straw? Does that make them any less admirable?

My bother was in the Navy, was chosen to go to Vietnam, was chosen to be a Gunner's Mate, assigned to a patrol boat on a river where he couldn't tell friends from enemies. He said his job was mostly waiting to get shot at by people who didn't want him there, and then shoot back at them. He spent the last part of his tour in a hospital sick with Malaria.

When he returned home, rather than hearing "thank you for your service" and all the other platitudes we now offer, all he got was harassed. He didn't volunteer for any of that. All of that, the PTSD, the malaria, how he was treated when he got back, changed his life from how it should've been had he chose for himself. So does he deserve any less respect for not volunteering?

At issue here is the automatic respect for people who just choose those occupations, the notion that simply choosing the risky occupation should automate that respect. We like to say that respect is earned and not automatic. So to me, people who do risk their lives to do a job, who actually do the crappy jobs, get shot at, run into burning buildings, etc., regardless of why they do it, or even if they didn't choose to do it, have earned respect.

 

[snowman46919]

Fodder for the machine... just because someone is a veteran doesn't mean they are a combat veteran, they could have spent spent their entire combat duty riding the oak pony and is a REMF

 

[nemo97]

Well... if the OP had expressed resentment for people who EXPECT special treatment because of being a veteran or a LEO or a farmer, I'd be right there with him... but that sure wasn't what it sounded like to me. What it sounded like to me is someone who resents someone else for getting positive attention for something. If that attention somehow took something from the rest of us, I guess maybe I'd understand the complaint, though I still might not agree. As it is, though, I don't see where any kudos or praise given to a soldier or a LEO or to a firefighter or to a school teacher or to anyone else takes anything away from anyone else. Saying soldiers are selfless or brave or something else in no way takes anything from farmers... unless they just have some insecurities that they need to deal with. That's the part I still just don't get -- why do you (plural, those who share this opinion) care? So little Jimmy from Tuscaloosa gets his picture on the news and 5% off at the Tasty Freeze -- why do you care? What does it take from you?

I don't really resent anyone. I have no quarrel with businesses making business decisions. Another poster made an interesting statement calling it a "class society." I think maybe that is a better way of looking at it. We have the political class seemingly above accountability. We have a welfare class leaching from the producing class. We have a warrior class that is used by the political class to (currently) exercise our might around the globe while discussing using some of that might to "watch" the homeland via drones. What comes next? "Oh, it's okay Johnny. Don't worry about the 101st patrolling the streets. They're here to keep us safe.

Even George Washington was offered support by the military to become a monarch at the conclusion of the Revolutionary War. What's to say this sort of support isn't offered again in the future to another leader?

 

[iChokePeople]

I don't really resent anyone. I have no quarrel with businesses making business decisions. Another poster made an interesting statement calling it a "class society." I think maybe that is a better way of looking at it. We have the political class seemingly above accountability. We have a welfare class leaching from the producing class. We have a warrior class that is used by the political class to (currently) exercise our might around the globe while discussing using some of that might to "watch" the homeland via drones. What comes next? "Oh, it's okay Johnny. Don't worry about the 101st patrolling the streets. They're here to keep us safe.

Even George Washington was offered support by the military to become a monarch at the conclusion of the Revolutionary War. What's to say this sort of support isn't offered again in the future to another leader?

OK, and if your original complaint had been about the way our young men and women are used by the politicians to serve their ends, again, I'd be with you. Those soldiers you mentioned in your first post don't decide where we go in the world or what their mission will be. If you have an issue with the politicians we elect who make those decisions, that's a whole different complaint than the one with which you started this thread...

 

[nemo97]

OK, and if your original complaint had been about the way our young men and women are used by the politicians to serve their ends, again, I'd be with you. Those soldiers you mentioned in your first post don't decide where we go in the world or what their mission will be. If you have an issue with the politicians we elect who make those decisions, that's a whole different complaint than the one with which you started this thread...

Fair enough. As with most discussions, they evolve.

 

[Whitsettd8]

At the end of the day I would rather it be them then me and that's why I respect them.

 

[Wreaver]

I'll give you LEOs. The bad outway the good and that's shown almost nightly on the news or in articles online. You see it daily when they pop their lights to run a red light just because they can, or the traffic stops that turn into much more. They have that attitude and talk down to you because they somehow think they are superior. I apologize to any of you who may be the good guys but there are far too many douchebags in blue.

Soldiers on the other hand I disagree with. I would say most enlist because they believe in America and want to see her prosper. They enlist for that one day they're called on to defend her. I'll give ya that sometimes they are misused by the clowns in Government. But I'm not sure I see this blind support or this "godhood status" you referenced.

Take the last few days for example. It's been nothing but Grammys talk and "omg, Whitney Houston died" non stop. I'm sure during that time someone fighting somewhere they don't want to be away from family and friends has been injured, or killed all because they enlisted for nothing more than the idea of serving and protecting their country.

Yeah, I'm probably one of those guys who blindly support our Military. Do I support some of the wars we've been in? No. But I will always support the men and woman who are willing to put themselves between my family and harms way if that day were to come.

 

[hornadylnl]

Fodder for the machine... just because someone is a veteran doesn't mean they are a combat veteran, they could have spent spent their entire combat duty riding the oak pony and is a REMF

This.

I can't stand the "veterans" that have never met someone that they didn't tell their veteran status to in their first minute of conversation. I served and my service no more makes up who I am than anything else I've done in my life. I don't have vet or service plates or stickers all over my car. I don't wear vet or service clothing. I don't understand the need to make your service known to the world.

It has been my experience that the real combat vets I've talked to, they don't advertise and usually won't talk about it. Those who blather on about their experiences unsolicited are usually full of it.

 

[snowman46919]

This.

I can't stand the "veterans" that have never met someone that they didn't tell their veteran status to in their first minute of conversation. I served and my service no more makes up who I am than anything else I've done in my life. I don't have vet or service plates or stickers all over my car. I don't wear vet or service clothing. I don't understand the need to make your service known to the world.

It has been my experience that the real combat vets I've talked to, they don't advertise and usually won't talk about it. Those who blather on about their experiences unsolicited are usually full of it.

all I know about grandpa is he was a merchant marine until he turned 18 and then a marine, lied about his age to join, and served in china.

 

[jamil]

I'll give you LEOs. The bad outway the good and that's shown almost nightly on the news or in articles online. You see it daily when they pop their lights to run a red light just because they can, or the traffic stops that turn into much more. They have that attitude and talk down to you because they somehow think they are superior. I apologize to any of you who may be the good guys but there are far too many douchebags in blue.

You probably see more of the douche-bags in blue because those are more visible. There are a lot more police than what you see and I think most of them aren't douche-bags. I can only think of two in all of my encounters but then I don't encounter police all that much, which is as it should be.

 

[richardraw316]

My father and uncle both got home from vietnam to be spit on in the airport.
i would rather put a little too much praise now, then risk it ever going back to that.
our soldiers and police are heroes. from the day this country was founded, till today, we should all treat them with the respect they have earned.

 

[Denny347]

I'll give you LEOs. The bad outway the good and that's shown almost nightly on the news or in articles online. You see it daily when they pop their lights to run a red light just because they can, or the traffic stops that turn into much more. They have that attitude and talk down to you because they somehow think they are superior. I apologize to any of you who may be the good guys but there are far too many douchebags in blue.

Wow, you much watch ALOT of TV to see the majority of our 800,000 police officers here in the USA that are "dirty". Your opinion is based on what you see on TV? But hey, there are far too many douchebag gun owners out there but I would never say that the majority of them are "bad"...I would be wrong in ASSUMING that.

Soldiers on the other hand I disagree with. I would say most enlist because they believe in America and want to see her prosper. They enlist for that one day they're called on to defend her. I'll give ya that sometimes they are misused by the clowns in Government. But I'm not sure I see this blind support or this "godhood status" you referenced.

That is an image given too you via recruiting commercials. Knowing former mil friends and family, they signed up for #1...college, #2...they want to kick ass and blow crap up.

But I will always support the men and woman who are willing to put themselves between my family and harms way if that day were to come.

Us LEO's place ourselves between you and chaos on a daily basis...many die for it but so many more are injured. We insert ourselves into the most violent situations that our communities see and we even do it for the communities that even loath our very existence. I'm sorry that you have such a bias. Maybe one day you will mature past them.