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Accidental Class III AR
- Thread starter .356luger
- Start date
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IndyMonkey
Shooter
- Jan 15, 2010
- 6,835
- 36
CountryBoy19
Grandmaster
Care to share the dealer info? I'm sure there are a few of us that would like to go have a look for ourselves.
Greenmonsta79
Marksman
Yeah I call B.S. on this one too much 
SavageEagle
Grandmaster
- Apr 27, 2008
- 19,568
- 38
I too would like to know the name of the dealer. 
Sounds like either a sting operation with the FFL cooperating, or the ATF or someone else is setting up the FFL and whoever the idiot that buys it. 
They're getting sneaky and this just wreaks of setup. 
Sounds like either a sting operation with the FFL cooperating, or the ATF or someone else is setting up the FFL and whoever the idiot that buys it. They're getting sneaky and this just wreaks of setup. 
IndyGunSafety
Master
Joe Williams
Shooter
- Jun 26, 2008
- 10,431
- 38
But is it REALLY a first post... or just another sock puppet?
You're wondering if it's legal or not.
Read section 2.1.6 of the National Firearms Act and it will tell you what is considered a "machine gun". From what you say it sounds to me like you have a machine gun based on just the parts that you have. The select fire switch is, of course, a dead give away. However, it is open to interpretation whether or not a select fire switch is a "machine gun" in itself. I tend to think that if the ATF wanted to they could arrest you just for having the select fire lever, let alone the other parts that you claim to have.
Anyways, 2.1.6 of the NFA is the section with the definition of a "machine gun". It should help you out.
Read section 2.1.6 of the National Firearms Act and it will tell you what is considered a "machine gun". From what you say it sounds to me like you have a machine gun based on just the parts that you have. The select fire switch is, of course, a dead give away. However, it is open to interpretation whether or not a select fire switch is a "machine gun" in itself. I tend to think that if the ATF wanted to they could arrest you just for having the select fire lever, let alone the other parts that you claim to have.
Anyways, 2.1.6 of the NFA is the section with the definition of a "machine gun". It should help you out.
VUPDblue
Silencers Have NEVER Been Illegal !
To the OP: I have my doubts about your "facts" in this case. Could you tell me how you came do decide that you could tell from the selector that it was a 3 position? The selector levers are visually identical between the semi and auto selectors. Also, there's nothing to "shave" on a semi trigger group that would yield you the full auto effect. You said you broke it open to see the FCG. Did you see an autosear? Did the hammer have a hook?
In a '16 when you "work the hammer" you won't get any different feel when the hammer drops in "auto" or "semi" on an empty chamber. You will feel the sear catch the hammer when you dry fire and, keeping the trigger held back, re-charge the bolt. The sear will catch the hammer on the rearward travel of the bolt, and release it upon lockup. This is an awkward thing to do on an empty chamber, but it can be done. What did the logo on the lower look like? Was it Oly's crest with the lion? Was there a sear hole above the selector? What gunshop was this in? I can see from your location that you are in the greater Indianapolis area, so it must have been a local gun shop. You can PM me the answers to these questions if you like...
In a '16 when you "work the hammer" you won't get any different feel when the hammer drops in "auto" or "semi" on an empty chamber. You will feel the sear catch the hammer when you dry fire and, keeping the trigger held back, re-charge the bolt. The sear will catch the hammer on the rearward travel of the bolt, and release it upon lockup. This is an awkward thing to do on an empty chamber, but it can be done. What did the logo on the lower look like? Was it Oly's crest with the lion? Was there a sear hole above the selector? What gunshop was this in? I can see from your location that you are in the greater Indianapolis area, so it must have been a local gun shop. You can PM me the answers to these questions if you like...
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VUPDblue
Silencers Have NEVER Been Illegal !
go ahead and get your popcorn, but I really don't expect answers to any of my questions...
this is true that hammer drop has no discerenable diff but when broken open you can operate the hammer manualy in any AR and in postion 3 the "HOOK" does not engage the triger. crest is standard like on all other oly from the 90s. and on a side note people are to scared of "big brother watching" like this is a george orwell book i just want to know if i can transfer this weapon into legal
VUPDblue
Silencers Have NEVER Been Illegal !
Here is where I'm doubting you. You said you broke it open and worked the hammer. If you are familiar enough with a '16 that you know how to manipulate the FCG to replicate full auto fire when the upper is off the lower, then the presence of the auto sear should be blazingly obvious, yet you make no mention of it. Also, you won't mention what shop you found this thing in...
To answer your question, if it is an early '90s gun, then no, it cannot be transferred.
ETA: I'm not 100% certain, but I don't think that any of the transferable Oly guns have the lion crest logo. I'm pretty sure that they are all "stopsign" logos or no logo at all... I'm no expert on the Oly guns, but I have seen my share and done my homework
To answer your question, if it is an early '90s gun, then no, it cannot be transferred.
ETA: I'm not 100% certain, but I don't think that any of the transferable Oly guns have the lion crest logo. I'm pretty sure that they are all "stopsign" logos or no logo at all... I'm no expert on the Oly guns, but I have seen my share and done my homework
CountryBoy19
Grandmaster
I think I'm following the OP now. I think he is saying the M16 FCG parts are all there except the autosear. Therefore, in the 3rd selector position the disconnector doesn't engage the hammer, but only the trigger sear.
I do know that there are some Oly's out there with no logo, so I can affirm that. There was a post on arfcom not long ago with one, it had terrible machining. Come to find out, it was one of the last ones produced and they didn't care about how bad it looked.
My vote is that it's NOT an MG, just a semi gun with an M16 FCG. If you work the hammer and trigger in the auto position on a lower with an M16 FCG without an autosear in it, the hammer won't catch on the disconnector because the disco is held back by the selector to let the autosear do its work. Since there's no sear to catch the hammer hook, the hammer just falls.
No need to hide the dogs. If you want to buy this gun, bring an AR FCG to the shop and have the shop owner change out the shop. Voila, no problem.
All that said, you *COULD* be charged with possession of a machine gun if you have these parts and an AR.
I would be willing to bet this is NOT an actual MG, just a semi AR with naughty parts in it.
No need to hide the dogs. If you want to buy this gun, bring an AR FCG to the shop and have the shop owner change out the shop. Voila, no problem.
All that said, you *COULD* be charged with possession of a machine gun if you have these parts and an AR.
I would be willing to bet this is NOT an actual MG, just a semi AR with naughty parts in it.
SavageEagle
Grandmaster
- Apr 27, 2008
- 19,568
- 38
I thought once a lower was a registered MG it couldn't be converted back? And transfered without a tax stamp... Forgot that part. Sorry.
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