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An OC Guide to Protecting Your Rights: What to do when LEO stops you
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starbreather
Master
Awesome info, there is so much to absorb
firecop9774
Shooter
Why open carry vs. concealed?
I'm sure this will generate many responses, but why openly carry? I've been a police officer for 31 years, 16 years as a detective. I go to GREAT LENGTHS to conceal my sidearm, as many "old-timers" do. Only on the hottest of days do I openly carry, and only with my badge clipped on my belt next to my weapon. I also usually clip my picture I.D. on my shirt when out in public. Off-duty I carry a small pocket gun totally concealed.
So, what's the big deal about OC? Why not CC, and save you and me an unnecessary contact, and perhaps an unpleasant experience? Please explain it to me. And, wouldn't you want us to inquire if someone is openly carrying? Or would you prefer we not, and chance that person goes postal and shoots up your workplace, or your chosen lunch spot, or library, or church, and your family?
And BTW, yes, some cops are rectums, but the vast majority are hard-working, conscientious, and care about the job. I know I wouldn't have 31 years on the job if my head and my heart WERE NOT in the right place.
End of soap-box - bedtime.
I'm sure this will generate many responses, but why openly carry? I've been a police officer for 31 years, 16 years as a detective. I go to GREAT LENGTHS to conceal my sidearm, as many "old-timers" do. Only on the hottest of days do I openly carry, and only with my badge clipped on my belt next to my weapon. I also usually clip my picture I.D. on my shirt when out in public. Off-duty I carry a small pocket gun totally concealed.
So, what's the big deal about OC? Why not CC, and save you and me an unnecessary contact, and perhaps an unpleasant experience? Please explain it to me. And, wouldn't you want us to inquire if someone is openly carrying? Or would you prefer we not, and chance that person goes postal and shoots up your workplace, or your chosen lunch spot, or library, or church, and your family?
And BTW, yes, some cops are rectums, but the vast majority are hard-working, conscientious, and care about the job. I know I wouldn't have 31 years on the job if my head and my heart WERE NOT in the right place.
End of soap-box - bedtime.
Joe Williams
Shooter
- Jun 26, 2008
- 10,431
- 38
Well, there are other threads for that question, where it's been answered. Still, I'm going to answer your question with a question. What business of yours, as a cop, is it how a citizen chooses to carry their firearm?
OK. Here's a thread for you to read:
https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo...lf_defense/71996-the_open_carry_argument.html
No. Liberty is full of chances.
I normally CC, but it really annoys me when people think they have the right to tell me how I should live my life. If you feel obligated to ask me for my permit, fine, I'll show you. Hand it back and keep your opinions to yourself.
I'm sure this will generate many responses, but why openly carry? I've been a police officer for 31 years, 16 years as a detective. I go to GREAT LENGTHS to conceal my sidearm, as many "old-timers" do. Only on the hottest of days do I openly carry, and only with my badge clipped on my belt next to my weapon. I also usually clip my picture I.D. on my shirt when out in public. Off-duty I carry a small pocket gun totally concealed.
So, what's the big deal about OC? Why not CC, and save you and me an unnecessary contact, and perhaps an unpleasant experience? Please explain it to me. And, wouldn't you want us to inquire if someone is openly carrying? Or would you prefer we not, and chance that person goes postal and shoots up your workplace, or your chosen lunch spot, or library, or church, and your family?
And BTW, yes, some cops are rectums, but the vast majority are hard-working, conscientious, and care about the job. I know I wouldn't have 31 years on the job if my head and my heart WERE NOT in the right place.
End of soap-box - bedtime.
You have spent 31 years as an LEO congrats first off.
My personal beliefs on the what weapons should be allowed to be carried would frighten you...
OC/CC who cares just Carry. It is one of the reasons I have spent the majority of my Adult Life stepping clearly into harm's way. From what I have seen in the last 2 decades the 2nd is getting stomped on less than several of the other Amendments...
I'm sure this will generate many responses, but why openly carry? End of soap-box - bedtime.
Just a reminder boys and girls. This is a STICKY post that has info. We should keep the follow-on post related to the information on the STICKY. The discussion of "why OC" should be taken to the various on-going threads we have on this debate.
I ask that this be done so that
1) that discussion of "why OC" be keeping with the rest of the discussion threads we have active
and
2) to make it easier to see/read and update this sticky should new information be given.
Feel free to discuss the "Why OC" or "CC vs OC" but please do it in the proper threads before tempers flare, a flame war starts and the MODs lock or worse unsticky the post and then everyone (new/old) loses the valuable info of the sticky.
Thanks!
If I was being detained as a suspect of an actual crime, I would not talk to the LEO's without legal representation present. However, if I was stopped for a traffic violation and the LEO asked if I was carrying a weapon, I would fully comply.
As far as advise for other INGOers goes, I guess that depends on your level of knowledge and what if anything you may or may not have done wrong. If a LEO is not stepping on your civil rights, you know that you have not broken the law (other than speeding, ect.), what do you have to lose by complying and telling the truth?
I understand that the LEO may ask for your weapon after you tell him you have one on your person but, that is your chance to ask the LEO why he "needs" to see your weapon and tell them that it is much safer for everyone involved if your weapon stays right where it is.
I also understand that the second amendment and civil rights are part of the core of this site. However, this site is also about promoting awareness and education. I would prefer to take the time to attempt to build a rapport with the LEO and possibly even educate him/her as to what my rights are and what he/she can legally "seize". If the LEO does not respond in a positive manner, I would most likely fully comply, leave the encounter with my life, and take it from there.
As far as advise for other INGOers goes, I guess that depends on your level of knowledge and what if anything you may or may not have done wrong. If a LEO is not stepping on your civil rights, you know that you have not broken the law (other than speeding, ect.), what do you have to lose by complying and telling the truth?
I understand that the LEO may ask for your weapon after you tell him you have one on your person but, that is your chance to ask the LEO why he "needs" to see your weapon and tell them that it is much safer for everyone involved if your weapon stays right where it is.
I also understand that the second amendment and civil rights are part of the core of this site. However, this site is also about promoting awareness and education. I would prefer to take the time to attempt to build a rapport with the LEO and possibly even educate him/her as to what my rights are and what he/she can legally "seize". If the LEO does not respond in a positive manner, I would most likely fully comply, leave the encounter with my life, and take it from there.
why open carry? This falls back to a basic force of the universe that has existed forever - Deterrence.
it's why a dog shows it's teeth - why little spiders rear - up on hind legs. A crime is better deterred than occurred.
Why does ADT put up signs and stickers? Why do new cars have blinking red lights?
The same reason that the snake has it's rattling hiss. The reason carrying a firearm for self defense is not just a right - it's a key to freedom.
I'm sure this will generate many responses, but why openly carry? I've been a police officer for 31 years, 16 years as a detective. I go to GREAT LENGTHS to conceal my sidearm, as many "old-timers" do. Only on the hottest of days do I openly carry, and only with my badge clipped on my belt next to my weapon. I also usually clip my picture I.D. on my shirt when out in public. Off-duty I carry a small pocket gun totally concealed.
So, what's the big deal about OC? Why not CC, and save you and me an unnecessary contact, and perhaps an unpleasant experience? If I am allowed by law to OC or CC and it becomes an unpleasant situation then you have failed as a police officer, you have become the criminal by harassing a law abiding citizen just because you "don't agree" with how I legally carry my personal weapon. Please explain it to me. And, wouldn't you want us to inquire if someone is openly carrying? Or would you prefer we not, and chance that person goes postal and shoots up your workplace, or your chosen lunch spot, or library, or church, and your family? If you are truly a 30+yr vet of the force then you know that laws mean nothing to criminals, if they did you wouldn't have a job and we would all live in la la land together. To further defeat your logic, I can kill just as many people with my weapon CC'd.
And BTW, yes, some cops are rectums, but the vast majority are hard-working, conscientious, and care about the job. I know I wouldn't have 31 years on the job if my head and my heart WERE NOT in the right place.
End of soap-box - bedtime.
Welcome to INGO and I really hope you learn something here
wrigleycub
Sharpshooter
Thanks for the info.
thoughts
OC is definitely a choice that you can exercise, but considering police officers maintain their employment through the job security known as Stupid People, you have to understand that there are a lot of people who carry guns that should not be (no LTCH, convicted felons, etc). When you choose OC, it is an obvious reason, and I would argue a justifiable one, for a police officer to make contact with that person to verify that they are legally allowed to do so.
Personally, while I see the deterrent nature of OC, which I think is much safer in numbers, I also know that the bad guy is not going to OC, and he is usually going to try to identify his biggest threat before he acts. The whole idea of CC is that you have the upper hand in secrecy if you happen to be present during a bad situation. If you OC, especially without other people to watch your back, you stand a strong chance of being the first person shot in the back of the head...
Oh, and BTW, I do carry every day as I have for years, and I carry concealed almost all the time.
OC is definitely a choice that you can exercise, but considering police officers maintain their employment through the job security known as Stupid People, you have to understand that there are a lot of people who carry guns that should not be (no LTCH, convicted felons, etc). When you choose OC, it is an obvious reason, and I would argue a justifiable one, for a police officer to make contact with that person to verify that they are legally allowed to do so.
Personally, while I see the deterrent nature of OC, which I think is much safer in numbers, I also know that the bad guy is not going to OC, and he is usually going to try to identify his biggest threat before he acts. The whole idea of CC is that you have the upper hand in secrecy if you happen to be present during a bad situation. If you OC, especially without other people to watch your back, you stand a strong chance of being the first person shot in the back of the head...
Oh, and BTW, I do carry every day as I have for years, and I carry concealed almost all the time.
