Any idea what I might have here?

[EddieV]

Hello INGOers,
This has been in my girlfriends family for a long time and we are wondering if it's worth restoring or possibly selling. Any idea what I might have here?

 

[45pro]

My first guess would be a gun.


What type of gun, i have no clue

 

[nipprdog]

Might help if you posted larger pics.

 

[Sylvain]

It looks like a flintlock pistol from the 19's century.
Im not sure I can even read the markings from those pictures.
I think I see a date, 1820 on it, not sure.
Are any parts moving or is it all rusted?
Can you cock it?
Activate the trigger?

 

[EddieV]

The hammer is loose and does not cock, the trigger moves but doesn't engage anything.

 

[wolfman]

I can not tell if it has any value, but do not polish the brass, or do anything other than apply a light film of oil to the steel. In most cases, cleaning and polishing will distroy the value of an older gun. Have it checked out, and if it is valueable, have any repair and/or restoration done by a pro.

 

[Sylvain]

You dont know anything about its history besides that it was in your gf's family for a while?
No date where it could have entered the family, war or special event, no location where it could have been found?

Can you type the markings that you can read on the gun?
I cant even see them from the picture.
I dont even know if it's an US gun or a foreign made gun, maybe those markings could tell us.

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

Wish I could help...but be sure to let us know what you find out.

 

[boogieman]

it not a flint lock but a cap and ball. I cant tell for sure but it looks like an early 1800s and without any real proof marks to me looks american, maybe military since there are serial numbers on it, and it has the skull cracker on the end of the butt. the next to last picture looks like it has a year of 1829 on it?

By no means am I an expert so take what I say with a grain of salt.

 

[EddieV]

You dont know anything about its history besides that it was in your gf's family for a while?
No date where it could have entered the family, war or special event, no location where it could have been found?

Can you type the markings that you can read on the gun?
I cant even see them from the picture.
I dont even know if it's an US gun or a foreign made gun, maybe those markings could tell us.

Her family is from the Vincennes area, so I assume it came from that region, or found it's way there somehow. It has "S! ETIENNE stamped on the wood under the numbers 3598, the same numbers appear on the barrel so it's a match. At the top it says 1829 with some stylized script which appears to read "bis." There is also a stylized "A.R" on the barrel. Those are pretty much the extent of the markings that I can make out.

 

[Sylvain]

it not a flint lock but a cap and ball. I cant tell for sure but it looks like an early 1800s and without any real proof marks to me looks american, maybe military since there are serial numbers on it, and it has the skull cracker on the end of the butt. the next to last picture looks like it has a year of 1829 on it?

By no means am I an expert so take what I say with a grain of salt.

I think you are right, after a closer look it looks like a caplock pistol and not a flintlock.
[STRIKE]Im not really an expert on guns[/STRIKE], I mean the picture is small and my eyes are tired.

I would say it's military too, because of the hook on the stock.

 

[Sylvain]

Her family is from the Vincennes area, so I assume it came from that region, or found it's way there somehow. It has "S! ETIENNE stamped on the wood under the numbers 3598, the same numbers appear on the barrel so it's a match. At the top it says 1829 with some stylized script which appears to read "bis." There is also a stylized "A.R" on the barrel. Those are pretty much the extent of the markings that I can make out.

That's interesting!

Being French I think right away about the Saint Etienne (also written "St. Etienne") Arsenal in the south of France that made military weapons for centuries and still make the weapons of the French military today including the FAMAS (the final "S" meaning St.Etienne").

I dont know if it has anything to do with that but on a weapon that would be my first guess.

 

[EddieV]

Thanks- that is a big help so far! Seeing as how it is from Vincennes makes it even more interesting given the history of the area!

 

[Fullmag]

"S! ETIENNE" Did a Google search and that seems French. 1829 is way to early percussion cap, guessing it was converted. To me the screws look too new and don't match. About what caliber?
No history: like grandpa bought in the depression, came back from a war or picked up at garage sale. No expert, just curious.

 

[Sylvain]

Thanks- that is a big help so far! Seeing as how it is from Vincennes makes it even more interesting given the history of the area!

I may try to do more digging by looking into some gun related French websites that could list the kinds of guns made during that period.
But I could be totally wrong about the gun being made in St.Etienne, idk.

What you see as a "S!" is probably a "St", that would make sense.

After a quick look in some French websites about old guns it appears that the MAS, Manufacture d'armes de Saint-Étienne (Manufacture d'armes de Saint-Étienne - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia), did produce this kind of pistol in 1820/1830 called "pistolets d'officer", or "officer pistol" for the french Navy and Army.

 

[Sylvain]

"S! ETIENNE" Did a Google search and that seems French. 1829 is way to early percussion cap, guessing it was converted. To me the screws look too new and don't match. About what caliber?
No history: like grandpa bought in the depression, came back from a war or picked up at garage sale. No expert, just curious.

I did read something about the guns being converted by the MAS.
I have to find that website again and read better.

 

[scottka]

French gun in Vincennes?... Surely not. /purple Haha.

Very cool piece. Good connection to Vincennes roots. Did her family ever take part in the Rendezvous?

 

[Sylvain]

Look at those pictures, it looks like the same model you have.

1822Tbis NA Rob

 

[EddieV]

"S! ETIENNE" Did a Google search and that seems French. 1829 is way to early percussion cap, guessing it was converted. To me the screws look too new and don't match. About what caliber?
No history: like grandpa bought in the depression, came back from a war or picked up at garage sale. No expert, just curious.

All she can tell me is that her grandfather or great-grandfather may have taken it in trade for dental services in Vincennes at some time. Her family is from there, and apparently that practice wasn't uncommon. Did a quick google search and found something called an "1822 bis" made at one point, which would account for the "bis" marking.

 

[EddieV]

Look at those pictures, it looks like the same model you have.

1822Tbis NA Rob

That sure look slike the exzct same gun all right!