Arrest at the last 1500?

[shibumiseeker]

It's been well established that both under Indiana and Federal law the age of a private sale of a handgun is 18 and from an FFL it's 21 (federal).

It seems like every time I have a handgun for sale invariably some Good Samaritan will let me know that a sale to a person under 21 (but 18 or older) is not legal and I could get in big trouble.

The latest Good Samaritan was adamant about it after I mentioned that it was a regularly discussed topic here, and he said that a private seller at the last 1500 had been arrested for selling to someone who was 18, but failed to provide details. Since I was at the last 1500 (and the last several), this was news to me, so I was curious if anyone had heard anything substantiated about this and if so what the details were, or if I could just chalk this up to another internet know it all trying hard to make sure I knew he was right.

 

[42769vette]

It's been well established that both under Indiana and Federal law the age of a private sale of a handgun is 18 and from an FFL it's 21 (federal).

It seems like every time I have a handgun for sale invariably some Good Samaritan will let me know that a sale to a person under 21 (but 18 or older) is not legal and I could get in big trouble.

The latest Good Samaritan was adamant about it after I mentioned that it was a regularly discussed topic here, and he said that a private seller at the last 1500 had been arrested for selling to someone who was 18, but failed to provide details. Since I was at the last 1500 (and the last several), this was news to me, so I was curious if anyone had heard anything substantiated about this and if so what the details were, or if I could just chalk this up to another internet know it all trying hard to make sure I knew he was right.

im not saying it didn't happen but this is the first ive heard of it

 

[shibumiseeker]

im not saying it didn't happen but this is the first ive heard of it

Yeah, same for me. I figured if it really happened it would have been big news here.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Was the 18 year old an alleged prohibited person?

 

[Bradsknives]

I don't know if it happened or not, but I do know that the ATF has had a presences at the gun shows this year. They did run a sting on someone who was non FFL at the Valpo who bought a gun and turned around and sold it for a profit a hour later...they took him out in handcuffs. Also, I know several people who set up (private collectors that sell) that have had visits from ATF agents at their tables asking questions and suggesting that they become an FFL holder. This happened at the recent Holt Road Armory show.

Bottom line is, just follow the laws and ask for proper ID to verify who you are selling too and you won't have any problems.

 

[BE Mike]

I haven't heard of this happening. I'm surprised that a few "private" sellers, who show up at many gun shows regularly with a substantial inventory, which is refreshed often, haven't been busted. I won't shed any tears when and if this happens.

 

[williamsburg]

Yeah, same for me. I figured if it really happened it would have been big news here.

yeah i agree, if it had happened the media would have made a big deal out of it. it probably would have been lead story on every station. but i'm not saying it didn't.

 

[shibumiseeker]

Was the 18 year old an alleged prohibited person?

That would be my question if the incident even did happen. I'm sure some guy at a gun shop told him about it...

 

[Glock19]

It was me, and what I said was, I know of someone who was escorted out of the 1500 by the ATF for selling a 18 year old a handgun on a private sale. I am not going into further detail.
I only advised him that posting that you will sell to someone 18 years old is asking for trouble.
Quote "or if I could just chalk this up to another internet know it all trying hard to make sure I knew he was right."
I never tried to say I was right or it was even Illegal. I emailed him once saying its bad to advertise selling to 18 year olds. Then replied to his email. Didnt try hard to do anything. It was my .02 thats it.

 

[Bunnykid68]

It is legal to sell to an 18 year old though.

 

[Glock19]

Im not saying its legal or not...I think the law is written to be sketchy.

 

[SideArmed]

I don't know if it happened or not, but I do know that the ATF has had a presences at the gun shows this year. They did run a sting on someone who was non FFL at the Valpo who bought a gun and turned around and sold it for a profit a hour later...they took him out in handcuffs. Also, I know several people who set up (private collectors that sell) that have had visits from ATF agents at their tables asking questions and suggesting that they become an FFL holder. This happened at the recent Holt Road Armory show.

Bottom line is, just follow the laws and ask for proper ID to verify who you are selling too and you won't have any problems.

Why? Am I missing something here? Surely there has to be more to it than just buying one gun and then selling it for a profit, right?

 

[Glock19]

Theres two things to that. If you buy a handgun its reccomended to wait 24 hours before selling it, and if your buying it to sell for a profit and admit it, your supposed to have a FFL.

 

[shibumiseeker]

It was me, and what I said was, I know of someone who was escorted out of the 1500 by the ATF for selling a 18 year old a handgun on a private sale. I am not going into further detail.

If you can't go into further detail, then why even bring it up at all? Either it happened and is verifiable, or it didn't and you made it up to try to bolster your point. If it DID happen then we'd all like to know about it since it's pretty important information.

"Some guy on the net said" is pretty poor evidence, and if you are going to take a position then you need to be prepared to back it up in fact if you hope to be believed.

 

[ol' poke]

I don't know if it happened or not, but I do know that the ATF has had a presences at the gun shows this year. They did run a sting on someone who was non FFL at the Valpo who bought a gun and turned around and sold it for a profit a hour later...they took him out in handcuffs. Also, I know several people who set up (private collectors that sell) that have had visits from ATF agents at their tables asking questions and suggesting that they become an FFL holder. This happened at the recent Holt Road Armory show.

Bottom line is, just follow the laws and ask for proper ID to verify who you are selling too and you won't have any problems.

Let me get this straight....a guy wallks into the 1500 with an M1 Garand slung over his shoulder with a dowel rod downthe barell with a sign saying "For SALE: $500". I beat the mob and pay him cash. 1 hour later, I have that rifle slung over my shoulder (no sign) and a person invariably asks "Whatcha got?" and then offers me $900. If I sell it, I'm a criminal???? Why??? Sumpin' done sound right thar.

ol' poke.

 

[Hornett]

If you can't go into further detail, then why even bring it up at all? Either it happened and is verifiable, or it didn't and you made it up to try to bolster your point. If it DID happen then we'd all like to know about it since it's pretty important information.

^ THIS ^

 

[Bradsknives]

Why? Am I missing something here? Surely there has to be more to it than just buying one gun and then selling it for a profit, right?

Let me get this straight....a guy wallks into the 1500 with an M1 Garand slung over his shoulder with a dowel rod downthe barell with a sign saying "For SALE: $500". I beat the mob and pay him cash. 1 hour later, I have that rifle slung over my shoulder (no sign) and a person invariably asks "Whatcha got?" and then offers me $900. If I sell it, I'm a criminal???? Why??? Sumpin' done sound right thar.

ol' poke.

I had the same questions when it happened. It was explained to me that he was operating as a business and to operate as a business that sells any firearms (for a profit) you must be a FFL holder. Apparently he didn't take his newly purchased firearm home and add it to his collection and then take back out of his collection to sell as a "private collector", which would have not required a FFL. He flipped (re-sold) his purchase in a hour and in the eyes of the ATF it was illegal.

, but that was how it was explained to me.

 

[Glock19]

Its not my place to provide details, im not the guy who got escorted out of the show. All I was saying is that Im the one who knew the guy that got taken out of the show. Ask any of the show promoters about selling guns privately at the shows, if the ATF wants to mess with you they will. I told Shibumseeker basically that he could be asking for trouble posting that he sells to 18 year olds. Thats it.. Im not "another internet know it all trying hard to make sure I knew he was right."
Since when did giving your opinion to someone become a bad thing on this site?

 

[SideArmed]

Theres two things to that. If you buy a handgun its reccomended to wait 24 hours before selling it, and if your buying it to sell for a profit and admit it, your supposed to have a FFL.

So like Shibum, I am going to ask for something to back up this assertation.

 

[42769vette]

i read somwhere (this probably is not reliabable) that if anyone buys a firarm with the intention of reselling it then they must have a ffl. if you buy a firarm and take it home, and change your mind you can sell it with no issues.

if a private dealer buys a gun, and sells it for a profit a hour later he obviously has no intentions of keeping it.

im not saying this is right, im saying this is my understanding of the law and what might have occured. im in no way a legal expert. it sounds to me like the private dealer got escorted out for opperating a gun business without a licence not selling to a 18yr old. i could be wrong