Arrest at the last 1500?

[JettaKnight]

JettaKnight][/B]
... If I buy a gun for a decent price at a show, then get a little buyer's remorse, see something I want more, etc. and someone says, "what got? how much?" (as they always do), I would sell if the price is higher than what I paid. Who wouldn't?

The intent wasn't to make a profit at the outset, it just so happened I was lucky. One profitable quick sale can hardly be considered a pattern. If the feds can show that this scenario is repeated...

I fail to see how taking it home changes intent. Also, how do you catch someone doing this? You have to document both sales. So does the BATFE sell a bunch of firearms at low-ball prices and then follow the buyers to see if they resell for more? Or maybe they use a agent to try to buy it for more it hopes that the suspect is gullible/wise/greedy/entrepreneurial.

personal opinion NOT FACT. i think your on a slippery slope and your best bet is to either get a ffl or not sell guns for profit

Oh no, not another fact/opinion war

This didn't happen to me or anyone I know. I promise. I was just countering the opinion that stated that no one makes a profit at a gun show without the intent of making the profit.

And did anyone witness this arrest/ejection for making a quick buck? This whole thread smells of stinky fish. The only thing missing is the Marine sniper in the gun shop spinning yarns.

As for an FFL, I have one - FFL03, not a FFL01.

 

[jd4320t]

I heard he was trying to buy a Sig 10mm like what the Seals used to kill Osama...

 

[ATM]

...The only thing missing is the Marine sniper in the gun shop spinning yarns.

It was 2000 yards

...at night

...in a stiff wind

...from the back of a moving train.

One shot, 3 kills.


In my opinion.

 

[JettaKnight]

Also, how do you catch someone doing this? You have to document both sales. So does the BATFE sell a bunch of firearms at low-ball prices and then follow the buyers to see if they resell for more? Or maybe they use a agent to try to buy it for more it hopes that the suspect is gullible/wise/greedy/entrepreneurial.

Wait, wouldn't that be entrapment? Does this happen enough that it draws the attention of the BATFE? Does anyone have any details or proof? Brad?

Inquiring minds want to know!

 

[ATM]

^ Are you arguing with yourself again?

 

[KG1]

^ Are you arguing with yourself again?

I hate when I argue with myself. Especially when i'm loosing the argument.

 

[JettaKnight]

I heard he was trying to buy a Sig 10mm like what the Seals used to kill Osama...

Nah, it was Sig in .357 Sig, just like in Counterstrike. He was getting a lot of headstrikes in CS, so he wanted it in real life.


It's been posted before, but always a good laugh:
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxJp-XYPnZI&feature=related[/ame]

 

[snapping turtle]

Most of the private sellers I have seen purchase guns at the gun shows do not place the items on the table at that show. Normally they do take it out to the truck or keep it under the table. That said when a trade is made it normally goes right on the table to replace what was traded. Go to the next show and I bet it is on the table or in the safe. This has been so since my father started taking me to shows in the 1970's.

The FFL sellers buy and place the item for sale I guess as soon as they record it on the book.

The "Walkers" at the shows are most likely to turn and flip at the show.

I will give an example. Last election cycle I knew that the marlin camp 9's and 45's were going up in price. I bought a great camp 9 in the parking lot before the show. I was offered more for it than I paid outside and did not sell. Why because i promissed my cousin that if I found a good one we could do a trade for a savage he had. I was tempted to make a quick 100 but my word to the cousin was enough to stop me from doing so. I will admit i thought of making the quick 100. I guess i did commit thought crime.

Personally if The ATF was to sell you a gun outside and the ATF was to buy a gun inside and the charge a person with making a profit from the sale then some from of entrapment would be possible.

Gun shows are to buy sell and trade firearms and related equipment. 10,000 people attended the last 1500 sat and 10,000 sunday all looking to do so. All paying 10 to get in and 5 to park. That is 200k for entrance fees and 50k parking sat and sun only not including friday half day. It is a business to have a gun show.

Many make a living or extra cash for home expenses buying a table and setting up shop. When it makes econmic sense to sell non firearm related items at the show instead of firearm related stuff then the gun show is going to go the way of the dino.

Personally I will contine to abide by all ATF regulations as I always do. If I take a gun I bought in 1983 and someone tell me I need to sell it for what I paid back then for it so I don't make a profit then the fun for me stops and so does the willingness to spend my 15 dollars to attend a show than most likely I am just going to walk around at and not purchase a thing.

Buy sell and trade. Use ingo to make friends with others that share our passion, The gun show is a 2nd amendment showcase. Without it we all look like back alley runners trading out of the trunk of cars. Not that there is anything wrong with that.

 

[LPMan59]

I hate when I argue with myself. Especially when i'm loosing the argument.

arguing with myself is often the only conversation i can have in real life where the other side is not a brain-dead zombie addicted to vicodin and xanax.

 

[IndyBeerman]

Not for me....my butthurts

Here ya go, fill this out, attach a quarter and send it to....

The search for a better alternative Butt Hurt.
Obama Hope and Change Division 2012 version
1700 Pennsylvania Ave.
Washington, DC

 

[wizard_of_ahs]

Not for me....my butthurts

 

[billmyn]

profit who makes a profit . usually get what i want but profit really , didn't know there was such thing .

 

[fullmetaljesus]

I hate when I argue with myself. Especially when i'm loosing the argument.

Then perhaps you should tighten up your defense and your arguments wont be so loose.

 

[Lex Concord]

Let me get this straight....a guy wallks into the 1500 with an M1 Garand slung over his shoulder with a dowel rod downthe barell with a sign saying "For SALE: $500". I beat the mob and pay him cash. 1 hour later, I have that rifle slung over my shoulder (no sign) and a person invariably asks "Whatcha got?" and then offers me $900. If I sell it, I'm a criminal???? Why??? Sumpin' done sound right thar.

ol' poke.

Under current law, no, because you are not (at least from the "facts" of the scenario) doing so on a regular basis as a business.

 

[Bradsknives]

Not so. If I buy a gun for a decent price at a show, then get a little buyer's remorse, see something I want more, etc. and someone says, "what got? how much?" (as they always do), I would sell if the price is higher than what I paid. Who wouldn't?

The intent wasn't to make a profit at the outset, it just so happened I was lucky. One profitable quick sale can hardly be considered a pattern. If the feds can show that this scenario is repeated...

I fail to see how taking it home changes intent. Also, how do you catch someone doing this? You have to document both sales. So does the BATFE sell a bunch of firearms at low-ball prices and then follow the buyers to see if they resell for more? Or maybe they use a agent to try to buy it for more it hopes that the suspect is gullible/wise/greedy/entrepreneurial.

Now back to the show.

Doesn't matter if the feds can prove a pattern or not...if they know that you just bought it and then flipped it for a profit they can arrest you. Weather the feds are right or wrong, they are going to make your life miserable and cost you some money to prove your innocence.

One other thing, it is NOT illegal to make a profit when selling a firearm. It is illegal to buy a firearm with the intent of reselling it for a profit which constitutes you being a business which requires you to be a FFL holder. Buying a firearm and taking it home (adding it to your collection) removes the intent of being a business. There is nothing illegal with selling that firearm at a later date for a profit. I only point this out because we all see private collection sellers at the gun shows and we see the same ones just about every weekend. They are buying all of the time, but you will never see them put a gun that they bought that particular weekend back up for sale on their table that weekend. You will see that gun up for sale at the next gun show that they attend. This is how they do it and justify not being a business. which IMO is playing the game in the gray area of the law.

 

[traderdan]

Current Law

Under current law, no, because you are not (at least from the "facts" of the scenario) doing so on a regular basis as a business.

You can rest assured that in the next 4,God forbid,A freedom hating administration will try to limit private sales between individuals...Unfortunately I believe some foolish FFL holders would be in favor of this.

 

[j706]

Let me get this straight....a guy wallks into the 1500 with an M1 Garand slung over his shoulder with a dowel rod downthe barell with a sign saying "For SALE: $500". I beat the mob and pay him cash. 1 hour later, I have that rifle slung over my shoulder (no sign) and a person invariably asks "Whatcha got?" and then offers me $900. If I sell it, I'm a criminal???? Why??? Sumpin' done sound right thar.

ol' poke.

Actually I think the federal law allows what they call an occasional sale. But with eric holders ignorant self being in the position he is in who knows what they are having their guys do.

 

[ruger44srh]

So if I bought a gun 20 years ago and I try to sell it I can't sell it now for a profit without a FFL?

 

[sepe]

Doesn't matter if the feds can prove a pattern or not...if they know that you just bought it and then flipped it for a profit they can arrest you. Weather the feds are right or wrong, they are going to make your life miserable and cost you some money to prove your innocence.

One other thing, it is NOT illegal to make a profit when selling a firearm. It is illegal to buy a firearm with the intent of reselling it for a profit which constitutes you being a business which requires you to be a FFL holder. Buying a firearm and taking it home (adding it to your collection) removes the intent of being a business. There is nothing illegal with selling that firearm at a later date for a profit. I only point this out because we all see private collection sellers at the gun shows and we see the same ones just about every weekend. They are buying all of the time, but you will never see them put a gun that they bought that particular weekend back up for sale on their table that weekend. You will see that gun up for sale at the next gun show that they attend. This is how they do it and justify not being a business. which IMO is playing the game in the gray area of the law.

Met a kid at an auction that bought a bunch of guns with the intent of flipping (said he was a member here but wasn't a fan of the 50 post rule). Not really sure why he'd be going around telling people that was the only reason for his purchases because part of it was that he didn't want to deal with getting an FFL. Purposely playing in the gray area wouldn't be my idea of fun because of what would happen if the wrong (right) people knew your intentions.

So if I bought a gun 20 years ago and I try to sell it I can't sell it now for a profit without a FFL?

If you had it for 20 years, I'm guessing you didn't buy it with the intent of making a profit. Even if it was never fired and still in the manufacturers box, it was part of your collection for 20 years.

 

[KG1]

So if I bought a gun 20 years ago and I try to sell it I can't sell it now for a profit without a FFL?

I think you're safe with this one. Go ahead and sell it for how ever much someone is willing to pay for it.