Arrest at the last 1500?

[Dirtebiker]

If you can't go into further detail, then why even bring it up at all? Either it happened and is verifiable, or it didn't and you made it up to try to bolster your point. If it DID happen then we'd all like to know about it since it's pretty important information.

"Some guy on the net said" is pretty poor evidence, and if you are going to take a position then you need to be prepared to back it up in fact if you hope to be believed.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^this^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Glock 19, if your statement is " I know a guy who was arrested ( or escorted out, or whatever) FOR selling an 18 year old a handgun in a private sale" , then are you not saying that it is illegal? And if it happened, tell us the details. Thanks

 

[Dirtebiker]

i read somwhere (this probably is not reliabable) that if anyone buys a firarm with the intention of reselling it then they must have a ffl. if you buy a firarm and take it home, and change your mind you can sell it with no issues.

if a private dealer buys a gun, and sells it for a profit a hour later he obviously has no intentions of keeping it.

im not saying this is right, im saying this is my understanding of the law and what might have occured. im in no way a legal expert. it sounds to me like the private dealer got escorted out for opperating a gun business without a licence not selling to a 18yr old. i could be wrong

If the law is worded " with the intention" then how could they prove you "intended" to resell it? Maybe youjustgot a good deal, someone else made you an offer you couldn't refuse, maybe the "intention" was to take it home, but the offer persuaded you to sell it! I think they would have a hard time proving intention with a single sale!


Edit: I posted before reading the whole thread! My questions were answered earlier!

 

[oldschoolevo]

so help me out here. im just a gun lover that likes to wheel and deal and i buy guns shoot them and then sell and change to something else, so do i need ffl to buy use for awhile and then sell to get different one ? and if i sell to some one that shows indiana driver licencse and the carry permitt, is this legal ?

 

[shibumiseeker]

so help me out here. im just a gun lover that likes to wheel and deal and i buy guns shoot them and then sell and change to something else, so do i need ffl to buy use for awhile and then sell to get different one ? and if i sell to some one that shows indiana driver licencse and the carry permitt, is this legal ?

You buy it, shoot it for a while, decide to sell it, you are good to go, no worries.

The person to whom you sell a gun as a private citizen without going through an FFL must be an Indiana resident, 18 years or older, and not known to you to be a felon. They don't have to have a LTCH or even an Indiana DL, but the latter is a good way to know they are an Indiana resident. As far as being a felon goes, your only requirement is that you not KNOW they are a felon.

 

[MikeA]

Glock guy is silly, and the ATF girls at the last 1500 are paper pushers that go to dealers and check for compliance of paper work.

 

[Tydeeh22]

going from page 1-9 reading every single post has me in a whirlwind of emotions. where to begin.. ah well. maybe later when it gets heated up again.

 

[Udderchaos]

Newbie here so please, bear with me..

Example situation; I buy the Winchester Lever Action 30-30 that I have been wanting for years. I find one at the 1500 that I can finally afford. As I'm walking out with it, some other 1500 patron makes me a really stupid high $$ offer(Not my luck, but just for the sake of an example). I accept that offer within an ATF agent's sight/ear shot. Would I be taken to a dark room and interrogated by three men wearing sunglasses in black suits asking for my FFL.??

Thank you in advance for any information.

 

[shibumiseeker]

Newbie here so please, bear with me..

So, the way I read this is; I buy the Winchester Lever Action 30-30 that I have been wanting for years. I find one at the 1500 that I can finally afford. As I'm walking out with it, some other 1500 patron makes me a really stupid high $$ offer(Not my luck, but just for the sake of an example). I accept that offer within an ATF agent's sight/ear shot. Would I be taken to a dark room and interrogated by three men wearing sunglasses in black suits asking for my FFL.??

Thank you in advance for any information.

They rarely wear black suits, and they probably won't take you into a back room, but possibly. If that was the only time you did that then they might try to put a scare into you, but you won't get charged with anything. Now, if they started looking at you and found you'd done this a few times at every gun show you went to, you might get charged with dealing without a license. You might be able to beat that in court but in the meantime they would most likely have confiscated all of your weapons, searched your house, and made you rack up a lot of lawyer fees. This latter, while perfectly legal for them to do, is a form of regulation through intimidation and is common among many government agencies with regulatory powers. Even more fun is that they may take years to decide to charge you with anything, if ever, and meanwhile you are out your property and are left in limbo wondering if you're facing jail. All perfectly legal.

And for what it's worth, this type of buy-resell happens a LOT at gun shows and it's rare that anyone gets in trouble for it. This not to say it can never happen, but the risk of getting shot accidentally at a show is higher.

 

[JettaKnight]

Newbie here so please, bear with me..

Example situation; I buy the Winchester Lever Action 30-30 that I have been wanting for years. I find one at the 1500 that I can finally afford. As I'm walking out with it, some other 1500 patron makes me a really stupid high $$ offer(Not my luck, but just for the sake of an example). I accept that offer within an ATF agent's sight/ear shot. Would I be taken to a dark room and interrogated by three men wearing sunglasses in black suits asking for my FFL.??

Thank you in advance for any information.

I'm as confused as you. According to one poster it's legal, but according to another you'll be harassed to no end if caught. I still have yet to determine if this happened in a scenario similar to what you describe.

 

[Hoosierbuck]

Under current law, no, because you are not (at least from the "facts" of the scenario) doing so on a regular basis as a business.

Hallelujiah! ^^^This x 100^^^ If you are not "engaged in the business" of selling firearms, you do not need an FFL. "engaged in the business" is defined:

"(C) as applied to a dealer in firearms, . . . a person who devotes
time, attention, and labor to dealing in firearms as a regular course of trade
or business with the principal objective of livelihood and profit through
the repetitive purchase and resale of firearms, but such term shall not
include a person who makes occasional sales, exchanges, or purchases of
firearms for the enhancement of a personal collection or for a hobby, or​

who sells all or part of his personal collection of firearms. . . ."
18 U.S.C. § 921(a)(21)(C).
It doesn't matter if you make a profit on a sale. It doesn't matter if you do a flip once in a blue moon. It begins to matter if it becomes a regular course of business aimed at making $.

Now, we all understand that in this day and age, just because you know and follow the law doesn't mean that you won't have to explain it to those tasked with enforcing it.

HB

 

[85t5mcss]

I just want Glock19 to rejoin the thread. Much more entertaining then.