Cease teaching and practicing the Catholic faith or close its doors forever

[AndreusMaximus]

Only if you consider Peter a pope lol.

Can’t posthumously declare someone a Pope and then claim their beliefs for your own…

Well, I would think that would be understood, but it’s been happening for almost 1600 years.

But my point was that Catholics have redefined words of the Bible to agree with their doctrine.

(We get on liberals for doing this…)

The copy and paste from the previous poster showed 3-4 different definitions for Grace.

Who decides which one of those definitions you use when reading verses like Eph 2:8-9?

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

Is this talking about sanctifying Grace, habitual grace, or actual grace?

Again, who makes that determination?

And who determined that there were all these different types and definitions for Grace?

Catholics have redefined words for their own doctrine and turned it into its own religion.

It is not biblical Christianity.

You can’t add works (baptism, sacraments, Eucharist) to “Grace” and define that as salvation, when salvation is literally defined as NOT being by any works…lest any man should boast.

Grace is the graciousness of God. Unmerited favor. Getting what you don’t deserve for free.

That grace enables the ability of men to have faith in the death, burial, and resurrection of Christ as payment for their sins is the Gospel.

Having faith in that is what saves you.

Adding anything to that would make it a false gospel.

Every religion in the world is a works based religion.

Do this, be good, follow these rules, and if you’re good enough, you’ll be saved.

Makes sense. Sounds fair. Is completely wrong.

God is just. He said the payment for sin is a blood sacrifice and faith/belief is the only vehicle to attain the righteousness necessary to not go to Hell, which is where we would all go if God was fair.

Problem is a Catholic would probably agree with that.

But what is your definition of faith?

Could that word’s definition have been changed to suit catholic dogma?

If you don't mind my saying so, I think you're trying too hard to find points of disagreement with the Catholic viewpoint. Have you not noticed just how much you agree with the definition of grace that abnk posted? Watch what happens when I splice your two posts side by side (yours in red, abnk in blue):

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

Grace is the graciousness of God. Unmerited favor. Getting what you don’t deserve for free.

That grace enables the ability of men to have faith in the death, burial, and resurrection of Christ as payment for their sins is the Gospel.

10 Q. What is grace?
A. Grace is an inward and supernatural gift given to us without any merit of our own, but through the merits of Jesus Christ in order to gain eternal life.

18 Q. By the aid of our own powers alone can we do anything available to life eternal?
A. Without the help of the grace of God, and by our own powers alone, we cannot do anything helpful to life everlasting.

So we all agree that Grace is a freely given gift from God, purchased by the blood of Jesus, that allows us to have Faith, and leads us to salvation, not by any power or work of our own, right?

All the other stuff about different types of grace is just a helpful way of talking about different senses in which the word grace might be used when referring to the good works that it helps us do (after all, having Faith and doing good works aren't really different things, right? If you really have Faith in Jesus you aren't going to go around doing bad things all the time, I'd think we agree on that? See James 2:14-26, for instance) it doesn't change the understanding of Ephesians 2:8-9, for which we both seem to agree that the definition of grace is the freely given gift of God that leads to our Faith, and therefore, our salvation.

You can’t add works (baptism, sacraments, Eucharist) to “Grace” and define that as salvation, when salvation is literally defined as NOT being by any works…lest any man should boast.

Those things (baptism, sacraments, Eucharist) weren't added to the definition of "Grace", at least not in the definition quoted by abnk above, not any other I've heard of. But they are things that Jesus did during his life, right? So the Catholic interpretation is that Jesus was using those things as physical ways ("signs", if you will, though we see them as more than mere signs) of conferring God's Grace. Would you agree with that understanding, and if not, what is your understanding?

Having faith in that is what saves you.

Adding anything to that would make it a false gospel.

Every religion in the world is a works based religion.

Do this, be good, follow these rules, and if you’re good enough, you’ll be saved.

Makes sense. Sounds fair. Is completely wrong.

God is just. He said the payment for sin is a blood sacrifice and faith/belief is the only vehicle to attain the righteousness necessary to not go to Hell, which is where we would all go if God was fair.

Problem is a Catholic would probably agree with that.

But what is your definition of faith?

Could that word’s definition have been changed to suit catholic dogma?

Again, I think we both agree that if someone really has faith they're going to do good works, right? I mean, how would you respond to someone who goes around stealing, lying, and murdering, but says he's going to heaven because he believes that Jesus died and saved him?

 

[JettaKnight]

If only we had a thread for Christian discussions.

 

[abnk]

If only we had a thread for Christian discussions.

Nothing has affected our world more than Christianity, no book has been more widely read than the Bible, and no topic has been studied in more depth and breadth over two millenia than Christian theology, and you're suggesting that we contain all of that in one thread?

 

[Shadow01]

If only we had a thread for Christian discussions.

Most software allows the ability for the user to scroll on past if the subject doesn’t fit their current interests

 

[KokomoDave]

Pope Francis announced that homosexuality is not a crime. It is a sin but not a crime. Unless of course, you live in one of the countries where they still execute you for it...

 

[Hkindiana]

Pope Francis announced that homosexuality is not a crime. It is a sin but not a crime. Unless of course, you live in one of the countries where they still execute you for it...

I think that was his way of taking a jab at Muslim countries

 

[JettaKnight]

Nothing has affected our world more than Christianity, no book has been more widely read than the Bible, and no topic has been studied in more depth and breadth over two millenia than Christian theology, and you're suggesting that we contain all of that in one thread?

You know, INGO at one time had it in  no [religious] threads, so yeah, we do have it generally in one thread and have had some really good conversations there.

 

[xwing]

RIP Pope Benedict.

Absolutely. A great man and respected Pope, unlike the current communist in charge.

 

[Route 45]

Pope Francis Hosts Transgender Women for Vatican Luncheon - New Ways Ministry

Pope Francis welcomed a group of transgender women, with whom he has formed an ongoing relationship, to a luncheon at the Vatican last week marking the church's World Day of the Poor.

www.newwaysministry.org

 

[Shadow01]

The pope is unsure of his pronouns

 

[HoosierLife]

Harlot of Babylon as some call it.