How much is an optic worth?

[Areoflyer09]

https://swfa.com/swfa-ss-1-4x24-tactical-30mm-riflescope-kit-111029.html

Check these out for the same money as that Nikon. You can shoot mine sometime

I appreciate that!

 

[Ggreen]

Side by side I'll take the swfa over a vortex viper. Mine is an earlier ffp model and is still rock solid sheet a hard life on multiple ARs. It's on my 300blk carbine right now. My range time is sporadic but if y'all are interested in trying it out in sure we can figure it out. Last Jan when I was at swfa, the new 1-4x looked super good and had better feeling turrets than mine.

 

[breakingcontact]

I've got several Vortex and recently a Primary Arms. The Primary Arms have a lot of features, but the Vortex seem a bit nicer.

 

[KJQ6945]

Side by side I'll take the swfa over a vortex viper. Mine is an earlier ffp model and is still rock solid sheet a hard life on multiple ARs. It's on my 300blk carbine right now. My range time is sporadic but if y'all are interested in trying it out in sure we can figure it out. Last Jan when I was at swfa, the new 1-4x looked super good and had better feeling turrets than mine.

I've never tried a swfa, but I've been pretty happy with the PSTs. Didn't really do much research when I bought them.

 

[Hohn]

I've never tried a swfa, but I've been pretty happy with the PSTs. Didn't really do much research when I bought them.

PSTs are the DeWalt of scopes. MAYBE there's something better for a particular application or price in some cases, but it's never bad or a rip off. If you don't have the time or inclination to do much research, it's tough to go wrong with a PST, and Alan is the place to get it.

I'm curious to try some other SWFA offerings as my 12x is a value that is impossibly good at $299 for the things I was most keen on: 1) accurate turrets 2) good reticle 3) reasonably good glass.

 

[rhino]

Re: SWFA

Do they actually manufacture scopes, or do they rebrand specific models from manufacturers?

Their fixed 10X with mil-dots seems very similar to the Bushnell Elite 3200 10X.

 

[Ggreen]

SWFA controls the manufacturing of their scopes as much as any box brander does. They actually bought the SuperSniper line from tasco, and rebranded it swfa SS (supersniper). They are built in the Phils, like a lot of other midrange good quality optics. Many of these manufacturers (branders) probably use similar supply chains. The real value in SWFA's line are the fixed scopes, they are cheaper because they are much less complicated, and they invest in good clear glass, quality turrets, and solid building techniques. If anyone is in dallas their storefront is south of the city a bit, but worth the drive. They are a full line dealer for nearly every manufacturer and you can compare them side by side. Even browse their used selection online and ask to take a look at them.

Here are a few pictures as best as I could get them quickly while the baby was napping and with my phone camera.
Vortex pst 2.5-10x44

This scope is ok. It will not focus at ranges closer than 15 yards for my eyes. Glass is crisp, but does lack a little in the light transmission. My house is fairly low lit.

SWFA SS 1-4 FFP mil Build quality is outstanding. This is an old scope, one of their early gens and the markings are as clear as they have ever been. Turrets track perfect and the glass is clear as ever. I really like the interrupted illumination control. (1 - off - 2 - off - 3 - off - etc..) Same as my trijicon and it is such a nice feature.

Light transmission is unreal at this cost point. It won't compete with a mark 6 but it is not that level of optic.

And for shi&*s and gigs here is an ACOG TA11 my favorite of the three even tho it is fixed zoom. A most excellent low power optic.

 

[Ggreen]

Re: SWFA

Do they actually manufacture scopes, or do they rebrand specific models from manufacturers?

Their fixed 10X with mil-dots seems very similar to the Bushnell Elite 3200 10X.

It is my understanding they do not rebrand. They own their designs and have them manufactured for them.

 

[Hohn]

It is my understanding they do not rebrand. They own their designs and have them manufactured for them.

Correct, they own the designs and have them manufactured. It started with them buying the rights to a scope design that won a Crane contract for the Navy from [STRIKE]Bushnell[/STRIKE] Tasco. (the original SWFA 10x fixed). TASCO (like many others) also doesn't make most of its own stuff. After buying the design rights, they developed a relationship with the supplier of that Crane scope, and then expanded that scope to a model line of multiple magnifications.

Then they did similarly with another supplier of perhaps higher cost and capability and launched the SWFA HD series. The HD have different knobs and guts and such and are a scope that approach and be competitive with some of the $2k+ class glass.

It's possible the HD series is the same supplier as the original, but I'm told it's a different facility at least if not totally different supplier.

 

[rhino]

Correct, they own the designs and have them manufactured. It started with them buying the rights to a scope design that won a Crane contract for the Navy from Bushnell. (the original SWFA 10x fixed). Bushnell (like many others) also doesn't make most of its own stuff. After buying the design rights, they developed a relationship with the supplier of that Crane scope, and then expanded that scope to a model line of multiple magnifications.

Then they did similarly with another supplier of perhaps higher cost and capability and launched the SWFA HD series. The HD have different knobs and guts and such and are a scope that approach and be competitive with some of the $2k+ class glass.

It's possible the HD series is the same supplier as the original, but I'm told it's a different facility at least if not totally different supplier.

That's actually what I meant by "rebranding," in that they are not a manufacturer, but instead someone else makes them for them and they put SWFA on it.

 

[Ggreen]

That's actually what I meant by "rebranding," in that they are not a manufacturer, but instead someone else makes them for them and they put SWFA on it.

When I think rebranding I think of the primary/atibal/etc approach. They buy into an already developed program and make minor changes if any and put their name on it. The holosun approach if you will. You won't get the same thing as an swfa from another manufacturer, where you will basically get the same holosun from sig, primary, and anyone else who wants to buy a run of them.

 

[seedubs1]

IIRC, the HD line is from LOW Japan.

Correct, they own the designs and have them manufactured. It started with them buying the rights to a scope design that won a Crane contract for the Navy from [STRIKE]Bushnell[/STRIKE] Tasco. (the original SWFA 10x fixed). TASCO (like many others) also doesn't make most of its own stuff. After buying the design rights, they developed a relationship with the supplier of that Crane scope, and then expanded that scope to a model line of multiple magnifications.

Then they did similarly with another supplier of perhaps higher cost and capability and launched the SWFA HD series. The HD have different knobs and guts and such and are a scope that approach and be competitive with some of the $2k+ class glass.

It's possible the HD series is the same supplier as the original, but I'm told it's a different facility at least if not totally different supplier.

 

[JJFII]

For a great scope at a good cost that comes with a lifetime no questions asked warranty (no questions meaning they dont care if YOU caused the damage, they will still fix or replace it) look at Athlon Optics.

For guys with eye issues I suggest their FFP models. The 4-14x44 Talos BTR is under $325 and is functionally better than scopes costing TWICE that...or more

 

[teewhizzle]

If you like Nikon, you really need to check out the Black series... I picked up the FX 4-16 x 50 illuminated MilRad on Armslist for $400, retail is around $600-800, but they're absolutely worth it imo. And with those Black series you really shouldn't need the cheater app SpotOn, though it is a really nice app...

And the customer service is top notch. I had an issue with the windage control and they replaced the entire scope, no charge.

 

[hANNAbONE]

Long Range..? Athlon -- FFP only

I have the HELOS on one of my 5.56 and it is lights out.!



Budget Pricing : Look @ Hi-Lux/Leatherman - excellent glass for the money : FFP

 

[Ggreen]

I've heard nothing but horrible things about the turrets on Athlons, but everyone on here seems to be recommending them??

 

[bjlay2000]

What are some good budget brands that still have good quality and accuracy?

 

[Ggreen]

What are some good budget brands that still have good quality and accuracy?

What is your definition of budget?

 

[Hohn]

There are so many cheap scope brands out there, it's so hard to say. The only "solid" scopes I know of under $500 are Vortex and SWFA. I haven't personally had any issues (other than wicked parallax) with my Nikon, but I know many have had Nikon tracking issues.

 

[rhino]

Used my first Vortex (Diamondback Tactical 2-9X) for the first time today. So far, I really like it and it was an excellent deal from A&A Optics (INGO Site Supporter!). It's also the first time I used a ranging reticle with hashes instead of mil-dots and the first time I had the reticle graduations and turret adjustments both in MOA instead of Mils-MOA. Not having to convert in my head is a really good thing. I may try a mil-mil scope in the future, but anything else I get will either be MOA-MOA or Mil-Mil.

I could see my hits on a steel bowling pin at 200m as they happened, which is a good thing. It was even easier to see the green splashes appear on a shoot-n-see at 165m.

Me like!