If power grid failed....

[CHCRandy]

The only electronic device on my genny is the watch battery powered hour/rpm meter. So I'm going to say not true.

Yeah, that thing looks kind of fancy! Will the windings short out though or are they shielded?

 

[Leadeye]

Power goes off, genny comes on, ice in the fridge and bourbon in the bar. Life would go on as long as the propane lasts.

 

[K_W]

Portable, handheld, and "Archaic" devices like mowers and mechanical gennys will be fine. Vehicles not directly under the emission will likely be ok too. Mechanical diesels and classic cars will never even flinch.

The most vulnerable will be unsheilded, ungrounded, or plugged in electronics. The EMP will travel through the grid (giant antenna) frying nearly everything computerized plugged in to it. Your cellphone will be fine unless you are under it, but your digital FM radio will be fried.

I have family, friends, and acquaintances in power production and distribution and know of some of our countries vulnerabilities and the available remedies and time frames, but only in the most basic terms. (Hi NSA.)

 

[indyjohn]

Yeah, that thing looks kind of fancy! Will the windings short out though or are they shielded?

See K_W's comment on low tech motors above. My genny is the same as CMs, only mine has been converted to run off a grill tank. Care to venture how many grill tanks can be found in a square mile?

Life would go on as long as the propane lasts.

Amen Brother.

 

[91FXRS]

See K_W's comment on low tech motors above. My genny is the same as CMs, only mine has been converted to run off a grill tank. Care to venture how many grill tanks can be found in a square mile?



Amen Brother.

What all is involved in the conversion? I see you still have fuel line connected, is that actually dual fuel?

 

[Spear Dane]

I been doing some work for an electrical engineer and he was talking the other day about NK using EMP to knock out our grid. Then today I read an article where some Dr.s say it would kill 90% of population in 1 year. Then that led to me looking at some book called "one second later". Guess I have a couple of questions. How real is this stuff?

And the more important question. If our power grid failed today, where or how would we harvest ice? Serious question. Where did ice come from in August in Indiana in 1800?

It was cut way up north and brought down in insulated ice box's. Hence why the words are part of the modern lexicon. Before refrigeration people had ice boxes in their home. How real is the threat? It's quite real. Look up the Carrington Event. In late July of 2012 the sun spit out a massive CME that barely missed us. An event like that would end civilization world wide and send us back to the dark ages. Not the 1800's, the dark ages. We will regress to the level of technology we can maintain, and we don't have steam, we don't have forges, except in museums. Healthcare? Fugeddabout it. Transportation?? No buggies, wagons to speak of and not so many horses. Sailing ships? Not nearly enough. Food? What food?
Grocery stores are perpetually about 3 days away from being out of stock. Trucks are the red blood cells of this country and there will be no trucks, so no food. Water? Problematic at best. Clean water and hygiene are the difference between us and 1800 and that is why those Dr's say there could be a 90% death rate. Violence has never even come close to killing as many people as have died from disease. So it's Hobson's choice. Starvation, disease or the inevitable violence. Choose your poison. Oh and EME's and CME's aren't the only threat. There's hackers too, but their actions shouldn't lead to the same world ending consequences. I hope. Maybe.

 

[femurphy77]

So does EMP destroy anything electrical or only stuff that is turned on/in use? I've heard it both ways.

 

[Leadeye]

See K_W's comment on low tech motors above. My genny is the same as CMs, only mine has been converted to run off a grill tank. Care to venture how many grill tanks can be found in a square mile?



Amen Brother.

Genny is in a grounded steel box and fueled by a 1K gallon propane tank. I figure to buy another if I can get a good deal on one.

 

[indyjohn]

What all is involved in the conversion? I see you still have fuel line connected, is that actually dual fuel?

Yes, it is.

It is very easy to turn [STRIKE]churchmouse's[/STRIKE] your gasoline genny into a dual fuel system. There is plenty of info on Google and YouTube on how to do it. Then go here and buy a kit for your generator.

https://www.motorsnorkel.com/

There were a couple of minor details I had to address based on my google searches. Such as plugging the PCV pipe because it would create a vacuum leak when running off LP and installing a valve on the gas line to address the same issue.

It's as easy to plug in as your gas grill, it starts right up every time, the gas is easy to transport and never goes stale.

Did I mention the part about the gas grill population density?

 

[K_W]

Yes, it is.

It is very easy to turn [STRIKE]churchmouse's[/STRIKE] your gasoline genny into a dual fuel system. There is plenty of info on Google and YouTube on how to do it. Then go here and buy a kit for your generator.

https://www.motorsnorkel.com/

There were a couple of minor details I had to address based on my google searches. Such as plugging the PCV pipe because it would create a vacuum leak when running off LP and installing a valve on the gas line to address the same issue.

It's as easy to plug in as your gas grill, it starts right up every time, the gas is easy to transport and never goes stale.

Did I mention the part about the gas grill density?

Unless you have a 500+ gallon tank your grill tanks won't last until help arrives.

 

[K_W]

So does EMP destroy anything electrical or only stuff that is turned on/in use? I've heard it both ways.

Non computerized and Electro-mechanical, shielded, grounded, and smaller devices without antennas will survive. Anything with an decent antenna will fry. The power grid will act as an antenna and any electronic device plugged in will be damaged.

Cars are decently shielded and may survive unless directly under the blast, although some systems will be affected which may cause driveability issues.

 

[churchmouse]

Do you live far enough off the grid to not drwa attention with noise and light?


My idea is I need to be prepared to be stealthy.

ETA 4 genneys and 5 gals of gas?

I live in a neighbor hood and yes it will draw all sorts of unwanted attention. The genney's will be in the shop with the overhead door open (and locked in position) and a window just enough to clear the fumes and mask the noise unless you are pretty close. We have ran the scenario. The windows are barred.

The 2 big units will run 10 hours on 5 gallons of fuel at half load.

 

[churchmouse]

Is it not true EMP would render generators useless unless they are properly caged?

No. Only something directly attached to the grip to experience the huge surge from the EMP. If you are close enough for this to effect stored units off the grid you will not care because you and everything around you will be toast anyway.

 

[PapaScout]

IMHO, generators will simply ease the transition to sustaining without power in a major attack - not the final answer. Hunting won't work unless 70% (guessing) of the population starves. Cannibalism is the only sustainable short->mid-term food source for a nation without power. ETA: and who wants to live that badly? Not me.

 

[churchmouse]

Why would people even need fuel? Our cars won't start and most people won't be able to get money for fuel anyway..........since they need to use a debit card and have no cash, gold or silver. Most generators will be destroyed by the EMP. Diabetics will suffer. Nursing homes and hospitals would have serious issues. I have no doubt I can hunt deer and fish to survive but my problem would be keeping the meat from ruining, hence wondering how ice would be supplied. I really was never taught how to survive without power, how to preserve meats, etc. I doubt if dad or grandpa ever gave that a thought when they were teaching me how to feed myself.

Another myth. Modern cars are well shielded to ptotect the ECU's from every day interference's anyway. Again, if you are that close to the initial blast you will no longer care.

There is a sticky in the forum that has discussed this at length. I need to fine the link.

 

[indyjohn]

Unless you have a 500+ gallon tank your grill tanks won't last until help arrives.

I'm not at Leadeye skill level yet, but will be. Grill tanks are found while foraging for other needed items (yes, I have introduced an entirely new topic of conversation).

.... until help arrives? Pffffttt. We are our own help.

 

[churchmouse]

EMP's are discussed at length here...https://www.indianagunowners.com/forums/survival-disaster-preparedness/58047-emp-projects.html

 

[churchmouse]

Unless you have a 500+ gallon tank your grill tanks won't last until help arrives.

"If" help arrives.

 

[indyjohn]

IMHO, generators will simply ease the transition to sustaining without power in a major attack - not the final answer. Hunting won't work unless 70% (guessing) of the population starves. Cannibalism is the only sustainable short->mid-term food source for a nation without power. ETA: and who wants to live that badly? Not me.

I can't challenge anything stated above. I think the survivors with the most resources add time exponentially as demand dies off. (Think about that for a minute). The human race has survived with so much less than we have today, it's just that humans today have lost all the survival skill it took to get to this point.

 

[churchmouse]

I can't challenge anything stated above. I think the survivors with the most resources add time exponentially as demand dies off. (Think about that for a minute). The human race has survived with so much less than we have today, it's just that humans today have lost all the survival skill it took to get to this point.

I have stated this before. All my spouse and I will be doing is giving the kids a leg up.
Spouse and I both would only make it out to the end of the meds anyway. After that it will be in a higher powers hands.