Indianapolis PD firearm seizure, no return

[churchmouse]

Nah, I'm thinking a RIA 1911.....

Rough crowd......very rough.

 

[Trigger Time]

Where is that damn flip off emoty. I know it is in here somewhere..........

You wanna get pulled over or something?

 

[churchmouse]

You wanna get pulled over or something?

 

[Cameramonkey]

I have driven across the county to return a gun to a crash victims Home on more than one occasion just to avoid our property room boondoggle.

I dont care what Frank says behind your back. You're all right. Kudos to you.

 

[smasherofall]

We can put a detective hold on a car for 72 hours if we need to process it for evidence, otherwise there's no hold.

Yeah, it sucks to pay a tow bill. It also sucks to pay a doctor because you got sick, a plumber because a pipe burst, etc. Such is life. Talk to your insurance company and see if they cover the tow.

Still not the point, but oh well, we tried.

 

[Hoosierdood]

They have to do a “background check” on the person before they release the firearm. They have 2 civilian employees who do all the background checks and they claim that there is such a backlog that it takes 12+ months to get one done. I call BS.

NICS background checks take minutes. But IMPD won’t be able to use the system without an FFL. Employment background checks take only a few days tops. I’m sure most departments can do a criminal history check right from their laptops. Several years ago when I took a group of students to visit the Pentagon, it took 2 months for background checks on the whole group, and I’m sure those checks were more in depth. There is absolutely no reason for it to take 12 months except for obvious mishandling by the department. Hell, I could have a new suppressor in less time than that.

 

[Thor]

I can get a temporary security clearance background check done in a couple of weeks...an actual clearance in 6 months and I know that's a much more rigorous process. Lazy bureaucrats that can say no to getting out of doing their jobs will.

 

[Tactically Fat]

They have to do a “background check” on the person before they release the firearm. They have 2 civilian employees who do all the background checks and they claim that there is such a backlog that it takes 12+ months to get one done. I call BS.

Would the City have to respond to a FOIA request asking how many "background checks" are performed per day? Or even inquiring of their official SOP? Or both?

 

[Pohaku]

NICS background checks take minutes. But IMPD won’t be able to use the system without an FFL. Employment background checks take only a few days tops. I’m sure most departments can do a criminal history check right from their laptops. Several years ago when I took a group of students to visit the Pentagon, it took 2 months for background checks on the whole group, and I’m sure those checks were more in depth. There is absolutely no reason for it to take 12 months except for obvious mishandling by the department. Hell, I could have a new suppressor in less time than that.

It would seem that the lengthy delay is done intentionally to keep citizens from getting back their firearms. There could be many reasons for this including profit and the belief that the less firearms out there the safer LE officers would be on the streets. The first is basically theft and the second, although not without a degree of logic, is not lawfully justifiable and I suspect a violation of the 4th Amendment. Something must be done about these injustices and if anything, brought out into the spotlight of public awareness.

 

[luger fan]

This is why Jeff Cooper advised people to own a copy of their carry weapon. Things take time, courts take time, wheels grind slowly. I don't think the Police are dragging their feet but it's no different than waiting for your tax check to arrive or Christmas as a child. It SEEMS to take forever.

 

[drillsgt]

This is why Jeff Cooper advised people to own a copy of their carry weapon. Things take time, courts take time, wheels grind slowly. I don't think the Police are dragging their feet but it's no different than waiting for your tax check to arrive or Christmas as a child. It SEEMS to take forever.

Waiting a year or two years to get your property back isn't dragging their feet?

 

[bwframe]

This would be different if the public servants involved in this could offer legitimate rules/guidelines/specifics on why property not tied to a crime is detained from being released to the owner.

 

[actaeon277]

Bureaucrats can do this, because not enough Americans are willing to hold feet to the fire.
In this case, well it's guns, so it's "okay".
Yet if it was their car, they'd be upset.

Yet then it would be, "well, what can you do?"


The government is treated as being "big brother", or "father".

 

[Kutnupe14]

It would seem that the lengthy delay is done intentionally to keep citizens from getting back their firearms. There could be many reasons for this including profit and the belief that the less firearms out there the safer LE officers would be on the streets. The first is basically theft and the second, although not without a degree of logic, is not lawfully justifiable and I suspect a violation of the 4th Amendment. Something must be done about these injustices and if anything, brought out into the spotlight of public awareness.

It may seem that way, but honestly it isn't. In many cases, it's up to the officer to see it released. If he doesn't set himself a reminder, after the conclusion of a case, then he (or she) is most certainly going to forget it. At the beginning of the next year, the property room (at least at CPD) would send you pages and pages of property logged in under your name, and the officer had to decide if the property was to be released to the owner (depending on the status of a case). Some officers complete them promptly, some just don't make the time, and wait until they get a nasty gram from the property room over something that might have been held for a few years. Once the officer allows for the item to be "released," then it goes to back of the line with every other officer's items that have approved to be released. When you're dealing with a large PD, you can imagine that it may take a good amount of time before an owner is called to pick up their item.

 

[rhino]

Would the City have to respond to a FOIA request asking how many "background checks" are performed per day? Or even inquiring of their official SOP? Or both?

That would only work if they had a document containing that information.

 

[Frank_N_Stein]

This would be different if the public servants involved in this could offer legitimate rules/guidelines/specifics on why property not tied to a crime is detained from being released to the owner.

Why don't you call the Property Room and ask? The "public servants" involved in this thread have nothing to do with the policy in place, didn't assist in writing or enacting it, and don't agree with it.

 

[bwframe]

Why don't you call the Property Room and ask? The "public servants" involved in this thread have nothing to do with the policy in place, didn't assist in writing or enacting it, and don't agree with it.

Good suggestion!

Don't you think that call might come closer to getting an answer coming from you though?

The Property Room's specific written policies would be great posted right here.

Thank you!

 

[VUPDblue]

I asked the firearms branch that very question yesterday. In addition to processing returns of recovered guns, they are responsible for the entire 17k+ inventory of guns that come and go through our property room each year. There are three civilians who work in there full time. That's it. Combine the volume with all the bureaucracy involved and it's easy to see why things move at a snail's pace. The gun I was checking on yesterday has been in the process of getting back to it's owner for 12+months now. The only holdup now is the recovering Officer signing the disposition form authorizing it's release. Their records show the form has been sent to the Officer twice and never returned. We are supposed to have 14 days to return those forms..... Like I said, bureaucracy.

 

[bwframe]

I asked the firearms branch that very question yesterday. In addition to processing returns of recovered guns, they are responsible for the entire 17k+ inventory of guns that come and go through our property room each year. There are three civilians who work in there full time. That's it. Combine the volume with all the bureaucracy involved and it's easy to see why things move at a snail's pace. The gun I was checking on yesterday has been in the process of getting back to it's owner for 12+months now. The only holdup now is the recovering Officer signing the disposition form authorizing it's release. Their records show the form has been sent to the Officer twice and never returned. We are supposed to have 14 days to return those forms..... Like I said, bureaucracy.

Thank you for the pertinent information!

Wonder how much those civilian positions pay? I think one other motivated worker and myself could process 17K guns a year. That only translates to 4.5 an hour. We could do that, save the department some money and solve a whole lot of the department's public discourse. Maybe net a bonus, for making our numbers???

Now, how are we going to motivate the recovering officers to do their jobs?

 

[VUPDblue]

Thank you for the pertinent information!

Wonder how much those civilian positions pay? I think one other motivated worker and myself could process 17K guns a year. That only translates to 4.5 an hour. We could do that, save the department some money and solve a whole lot of the department's public discourse. Maybe net a bonus, for making our numbers???

Now, how are we going to motivate the recovering officers to do their jobs?

Last year my pile of disposition forms was about 2" thick and numbered close to 300. That's 300 pieces of evidence I had to sign off to either keep, destroy or return to owner. To make that decision, an Officer has to look up the associated case and determine if it was decided or not, then what the outcome was, then if there's any current appeals. It took me several months to wade through my property forms, working in any down time I managed to come by. It is a tedious process to say the least.