INGO LEO's Please weigh in on this.

[ray d]

I wonder if it would take this long if a citizen did this to a cop.

 

[blackoak]

As a retired LEO I have some problems with this.

A LEO may use that degree of force which is necessary to overcome resistance and effect a lawful arrest. Force used beyond that constitutes assault.

I had a number of experiences in dealing with very dangerous mentally deranged individuals who had to be restrained and apprehended. The trouble for LEOs in dealing with such people is that most of our non-lethal techniques utilize pain compliance, and people having psychotic episodes simply do not have a pain threshold. In pre-taser days all you could do was get a lot of cops together, pile on the guy, get the cuffs on him and then strap him to a stretcher, all while trying to injure him as little as you can.

However, once you have your man under control, use of force STOPS.

Such an individual does not belong in a detention facility, which makes me wonder why this guy was in a jail for 48 hours? In my jurisdiction he would have been transported directly from the arrest location to an appropriate mental health facility.

If he was being detained in such a way that it was necessary to pepper spray him at regular intervals, then he was clearly not under control and was being restrained improperly.

My biggest question as a retired command officer is, where the hell were the supervisors when this was going on?

If I'd ever walked into a police or detention facility and found a naked guy strapped to a chair with a bag over his head while cops were taking turns pepper spraying him I definitely would have had someone's ass.

If everything as described is true, this situation was handled VERY badly and the agency is culpable in this man's death.

Good post coming from the type of LEO that I respect. From what I see, they murdered an unarmed, restrained, naked man and should face a jury for murder in the first degree. Paying this mans family a billion dollars would not make it right.

 

[nicajack]

I blew up in another post on this issue. The first thing these, I assume LEO's, on here did was junmp on me, the messenger. That is exactly what I mean by they cover up, lie or whatever is necessary to protect another officer. The very first thing they did was jump on me to defend the perps in this case. Their very first reaction, without knowing a single thing about the case. Nation wide! The movie Serpico was about the same subject of police covering up for each other. I know that most cops have a throw-down gun in their vehicle most of the time. What do you think those are for?
I was a sheriff's deputy for a little over 3 years. Had quite a file of commendations for what I did, considering the short time I was there. I quit because of the corruption. In fact, my shift sergeant met me one afternoon and he had a talk with me. Said that I had a rep. as a straight shooter. His "friendly" advice to me was to consider making up my mind about what I wanted to do, stay or maybe leave. He said that I could get hurt if I stayed and happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. He meant whacked! I had already seen enough and quit about a week or 2 after that.
I am well aware that most cops are good. But stuff like this post are going on all over way to frequently. They go on because in way too many cases they get away with it. The corruption is not only the LEO's, but the prosecutors, judges, etc. One bit happy family. But the victims of all this corruption is always the citizens in their jurisdiction. Cops are feared for good reason. They are always killing unarmed or innocent people by "mistake" and getting away with it. That is why there is such a flap over people being able to video cops in action. They keep getting caught and the proof of the video prevents them from lying their way out of it....

 

[Zoub]

This OP was one of the least inflammatory posts I've seen regarding cops doing bad things.

You're just itching to pull the "Cop-Bashing" card aren't you.

Get a girl friend and lose your virginity, it will do you wonders.

(no I didn't forget to use purple)

 

[Denny347]

I blew up in another post on this issue. The first thing these, I assume LEO's, on here did was junmp on me, the messenger. That is exactly what I mean by they cover up, lie or whatever is necessary to protect another officer. The very first thing they did was jump on me to defend the perps in this case. Their very first reaction, without knowing a single thing about the case. Nation wide! The movie Serpico was about the same subject of police covering up for each other. I know that most cops have a throw-down gun in their vehicle most of the time. What do you think those are for?
I was a sheriff's deputy for a little over 3 years. Had quite a file of commendations for what I did, considering the short time I was there. I quit because of the corruption. In fact, my shift sergeant met me one afternoon and he had a talk with me. Said that I had a rep. as a straight shooter. His "friendly" advice to me was to consider making up my mind about what I wanted to do, stay or maybe leave. He said that I could get hurt if I stayed and happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. He meant whacked! I had already seen enough and quit about a week or 2 after that.
I am well aware that most cops are good. But stuff like this post are going on all over way to frequently. They go on because in way too many cases they get away with it. The corruption is not only the LEO's, but the prosecutors, judges, etc. One bit happy family. But the victims of all this corruption is always the citizens in their jurisdiction. Cops are feared for good reason. They are always killing unarmed or innocent people by "mistake" and getting away with it. That is why there is such a flap over people being able to video cops in action. They keep getting caught and the proof of the video prevents them from lying their way out of it....

Good God, you had to infect this thread with your BS. Ok, under YOUR logic, we all have throw down guns and always killing innocent people but most of us are good? WTH? You keep spouting your ingnorance and your stay here could be a short one. Is it in the water or something?

 

[steveh_131]

Get a girl friend and lose your virginity, it will do you wonders.

(no I didn't forget to use purple)

The 'teenage hippy in mom's basement' stereotype just never gets old.

 

[UncleMike]

I blew up in another post on this issue. The first thing these, I assume LEO's, on here did was junmp on me, the messenger. That is exactly what I mean by they cover up, lie or whatever is necessary to protect another officer. The very first thing they did was jump on me to defend the perps in this case. Their very first reaction, without knowing a single thing about the case. Nation wide! The movie Serpico was about the same subject of police covering up for each other. I know that most cops have a throw-down gun in their vehicle most of the time. What do you think those are for?
I was a sheriff's deputy for a little over 3 years. Had quite a file of commendations for what I did, considering the short time I was there. I quit because of the corruption. In fact, my shift sergeant met me one afternoon and he had a talk with me. Said that I had a rep. as a straight shooter. His "friendly" advice to me was to consider making up my mind about what I wanted to do, stay or maybe leave. He said that I could get hurt if I stayed and happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. He meant whacked! I had already seen enough and quit about a week or 2 after that.
I am well aware that most cops are good. But stuff like this post are going on all over way to frequently. They go on because in way too many cases they get away with it. The corruption is not only the LEO's, but the prosecutors, judges, etc. One bit happy family. But the victims of all this corruption is always the citizens in their jurisdiction. Cops are feared for good reason. They are always killing unarmed or innocent people by "mistake" and getting away with it. That is why there is such a flap over people being able to video cops in action. They keep getting caught and the proof of the video prevents them from lying their way out of it....

I don't suppose you care to share the name of this corruption ridden Department??

 

[fireblade]

Good God, you had to infect this thread with your BS. Ok, under YOUR logic, we all have throw down guns and always killing innocent people but most of us are good? WTH? You keep spouting your ingnorance and your stay here could be a short one. Is it in the water or something?

i agree his view seems to be to all police........

what i find funny is you are arguing that not all police are bad there some good officer out there and you have implied or stated you are a officer yet your avatar says: TO PUNISH AND ENSLAVE ....... to me at least doesn't help to imply you are one of the good guys.

 

[KG1]

Hey UM, You're one of the old timers. Did'nt you have a "throw-down"? Was it a Cap and Ball?

 

[rambone]

Good Lord. Nobody was even fired.

 

[UncleMike]

Hey UM, You're one of the old timers. Did'nt you have a "throw-down"? Was it a Cap and Ball?

It was a stone axe......

I'd really like to know which department he was referring to.
I still have contacts around the state and I would like to hear their side of that accusation.

(I'm not holding by breath though.....)

 

[level.eleven]

Good Lord. Nobody was even fired.

The Brotherhood conducted an investigation on themselves and found that none of their brothers did anything wrong.

 

[rambone]

I don't suppose you care to share the name of this corruption ridden Department??

I'd really like to know which department he was referring to.

Why not start with the one in the article that tortures people to death, and fires nobody?

 

[UncleMike]

Why not start with the one in the article that tortures people to death, and fires nobody?

Because that's Florida.
My contacts are in Indiana.
I've become interested in learning about that Indiana Sheriff Department that is so corrupt.
We should always clean up our own back yard before we start *****ing about the condition of someone else's.

 

[Denny347]

i agree his view seems to be to all police........

what i find funny is you are arguing that not all police are bad there some good officer out there and you have implied or stated you are a officer yet your avatar says: TO PUNISH AND ENSLAVE ....... to me at least doesn't help to imply you are one of the good guys.

Well, it's humor. It is one of my many avatars I have used that poke fun at the naysayers. Spend any time on here and you will know where I stand, my reputation is well established.

 

[fireblade]

Here the the facts on this what happen to this man in a county jail house and the cover -up is truly wrong. No honest jailer or police officer can justify what has happen here if use of force policy was used correctly and medical given, used as intended from use of force applied correctly this man would have never died in this manner they know( police officer or jailer) this from there own training.

The bigger issue is what we see in alot of threads in all kinds of forums on the internet .

the public in general do not trust and fear the police departments around the nation lets face it we hear everyday bad things about police departments in the news like: police in a wrongful death incident , closing down kids lemonade stands, closing girl scout cookies sale area, public filming police in public streets being arrested or threated, etc. which is not fair to the honest good officer out there who are not doing those things.

with the push to have a police force more militarized it is not helping the public view of the Departments in a whole in turn it just scare the public and they feel they need to arm them self even more(bigger guns more body armor etc.) to protect them from a militarized police force they fear from media reports internet bloggs etc. of bad officers doing bad things.

police officer's are there for us the people of this great nation to protect and serve the community alot of officer do this all the time yet there are some who do not , like the jailers who did this to this man who was arrested and who was innocent until proven guilty now because of bad actions from jailers he's dead.

story's like this don't help the publics views

 

[fireblade]

Well, it's humor. It is one of my many avatars I have used that poke fun at the naysayers. Spend any time on here and you will know where I stand, my reputation is well established.

i for one love humor am sure you are a great person and officer just wanted to point it out what some my think from that avatar thats all....

 

[other guy]

I find it really disturbing that they would pepper spray a prisioner who was restrained. Does anyone know the status of the lawsuit today?

 

[trad78]

I find it really disturbing that they would pepper spray a prisioner who was restrained. Does anyone know the status of the lawsuit today?

Ahhhh, don't worry about it. it was just to humor the naysayers.

 

[ghunter]

Definitely not in the training manual. FUBAR.