Las Vegas Officer bodycam

[Randy Harris]

Look at his grip. Now look at a revolver grip. Look at his hand placement during the reload. Now look at hand placement during a revolver reload. Look at the stripes on his arm. Not saying the guy was absolutely not a soup sandwich, but it is entirely possible this was a guy trained on revolvers reverting back to said training.

Learning to shoot in a vehicle is best not done the first time with a badguy throwing real bullets at you.

That is a very astute observation and may well have been under pressure him reverting to what he's got the most reps of doing...however.... one has to wonder exactly how long he has been carrying an auto on duty now? When did LVMPD switch to autos? The 1990s?

Could he have been carrying a revolver "grandfathered in" after the rest of the dept switched to autos? Maybe...But how old would he have to be now? It is 2018 now so if they switched in the early 90s (and that is a guess-I think it may have been earlier... like when Clark County and Las Vegas City merged in 1973?) and he was carrying a revolver prior to that and then at some point they forced the auto on him that he is carrying now then he'd have to have been on the dept for 20+ years now....so doing the math the revolver theory might be wishful thinking.

On the other hand maybe he shoots revolver in USPSA or IDPA?

 

[nakinate]

As someone who isn't trained in pursuit my first reaction is that shooting from a moving vehicle while driving is a terrible idea. However, after seeing the shooting portion in context with the rest of the pursuit I believe the officer did the right thing and chose his spot to end the fight before anyone innocent got hurt. Yeah, his grip and reload sucked big time, but his driving and bravery overcame that. I have big respect for this officer after watching that video.

 

[Roland of Gilead]

Look at his grip. Now look at a revolver grip. Look at his hand placement during the reload. Now look at hand placement during a revolver reload. Look at the stripes on his arm. Not saying the guy was absolutely not a soup sandwich, but it is entirely possible this was a guy trained on revolvers reverting back to said training.

Learning to shoot in a vehicle is best not done the first time with a badguy throwing real bullets at you.

I think your right on the money, the officers lizard brain was running a revolver. Just as he was driving he was not thinking gas pedal to speed up. Turn this wheel to move to the left or right. This is a gun shoot these guys, he was just doing it same way he had done it a million times.

But Randy is right, the math doesn't really add up.

 

[jlw]

Look at his grip. Now look at a revolver grip. Look at his hand placement during the reload. Now look at hand placement during a revolver reload. Look at the stripes on his arm. Not saying the guy was absolutely not a soup sandwich, but it is entirely possible this was a guy trained on revolvers reverting back to said training.

Learning to shoot in a vehicle is best not done the first time with a badguy throwing real bullets at you.

A plausible theory indeed, but how long has it been since LVMPD issued revolvers? Surely it's been long enough to ago that if he has had time to mylenate the bottom feeder.

 

[jlw]

As someone who isn't trained in pursuit my first reaction is that shooting from a moving vehicle while driving is a terrible idea. However, after seeing the shooting portion in context with the rest of the pursuit I believe the officer did the right thing and chose his spot to end the fight before anyone innocent got hurt. Yeah, his grip and reload sucked big time, but his driving and bravery overcame that. I have big respect for this officer after watching that video.

My grade of an A for effort reflects much of what you posted. He did the job. That's what counts.

 

[KellyinAvon]

That is a very astute observation and may well have been under pressure him reverting to what he's got the most reps of doing...however.... one has to wonder exactly how long he has been carrying an auto on duty now? When did LVMPD switch to autos? The 1990s?

Could he have been carrying a revolver "grandfathered in" after the rest of the dept switched to autos? Maybe...But how old would he have to be now? It is 2018 now so if they switched in the early 90s (and that is a guess-I think it may have been earlier... like when Clark County and Las Vegas City merged in 1973?) and he was carrying a revolver prior to that and then at some point they forced the auto on him that he is carrying now then he'd have to have been on the dept for 20+ years now....so doing the math the revolver theory might be wishful thinking.

On the other hand maybe he shoots revolver in USPSA or IDPA?

I remember seeing Vegas Metro Officers carrying cocked and locked 1911s in April 89. Those days had a lot of Model 19s in service as well.

 

[jlw]

And here's one from Oklahoma, where the rifle fire comes sweeping down the plains...

[video=youtube;p47ONDlR9aY]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p47ONDlR9aY[/video]

 

[rhino]

I like the officers driving, coolness under fire, efforts and the balls the size of grapefruits that he displayed. He was following the policy that was read to the letter and he got the job done. There is no arguing with results. He got the results. My hat is off to him and those assisting him.

I like his SHO grip on the pistol. The two hand grip is bad, and I would speculate that he is defaulting to his level of training there. He drives, operates the radio and handles stress well. I would guess he has done all of those things much more than he shoots. Many cops go a career without having to fire a shot, but some have to fire a shot. Shooting well is part of the job. More time and effort needs to be there. If there was more time and effort on that the grip and the reload would have been better.

How many of you have fired from a vehicle? Moving vehicle? How many practice WHO and SHO from the vehicle?

Sometimes I park the truck in the bay and shoot from the vehicle because I don't want the first time I do it to be under fire. Going to the range tomorrow and I am doing it tomorrow.

I have not shot from a moving vehicle that I was driving since my folks sold the farm, but I have done it and done it safely. Why would every cop not have practice shooting from a moving vehicle. It can happen for them.

Some of us may or may not have more than one caliber of spent brass stuck under the front of the dashboard where it makes an annoying sound when it vibrates.

 

[rhino]

Just watched the video. HOLY CRAP! Charlie 4's balls must drag the ground when he walks. That guy has guts and then some.

I think the speculation about him being a revolver shooter make sense, especially when he shifted the gun to his support hand to reload.

I'm not going to criticize him. He got the job done.

I'm glad I'm not a cop.

 

[Vigilant]

How many of you have fired from a vehicle? Moving vehicle? How many practice WHO and SHO from the vehicle?

Sometimes I park the truck in the bay and shoot from the vehicle because I don't want the first time I do it to be under fire. Going to the range tomorrow and I am doing it tomorrow!

Benefits of a private range. Come to think of it, the Jeep needs a new windshield anywhoo, wonder if Safelite will make “range calls”?(didn’t even think of WHO, we were having too much fun)

 

[Coach]

Benefits of a private range. Come to think of it, the Jeep needs a new windshield anywhoo, wonder if Safelite will make “range calls”?(didn’t even think of WHO, we were having too much fun)

Some of us are truly blessed.

 

[9mmfan]

I have nothing but respect for that officer.

No, he wasn't perfect but he sure as s-&t got the job done.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

How many of you have fired from a vehicle? Moving vehicle? How many practice WHO and SHO from the vehicle?

From a vehicle, yes. Not from a moving vehicle unless we're counting belt fed with no real counterpart in the civilian world. I've done more dry fire from a vehicle than live fire, and more long gun than handgun. This actually reminds me I need to get some reps in with the duty belt instead of the plain clothes holster.

 

[Spear Dane]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9699n4Hd2g&feature=youtu.be

A couple of notes about this.
1. Bad tactics, skills, and decisions can still win the day.
2. If you haven't mastered the grip in pistol 1 you don't need to be in vehicle class.
3. The first time you shoot though a windsheild shouldn't be while you are speeding through the streets.
4. Accuracy by volume is a real thing.
5. The car is a weapon, use it.
6. If you haven't mastered mag changes you don't need to be in a vehicle class.
7. Head up during mag changes works because you need to breathe, see what's going on, and the bad guy is probably moving.
8. This guy now has "real world experience" in an armed vehicle encounter.
9. I'm glad he is ok and the bad guys got shot.

I defy you or anyone else that isn't trained to Operator standards to so much as remember your own name in that situation. Those two were murder suspects, not jay walkers and they were shooting constantly. Go back and watch that again and take note of everything the guy is trying to do AT THE SAME TIME...and he does it! I don't see how you train a cop for that situation. Yeah you got range time, you got skid pad and road course time. But what he just did was your basic Hollywood SEAL team 6/ Delta Force movie ending and that is NOT what they train for. Thank god Michael Bay wasn't there or half the town would be exploded too.

 

[churchmouse]

I defy you or anyone else that isn't trained to Operator standards to so much as remember your own name in that situation. Those two were murder suspects, not jay walkers and they were shooting constantly. Go back and watch that again and take note of everything the guy is trying to do AT THE SAME TIME...and he does it! I don't see how you train a cop for that situation. Yeah you got range time, you got skid pad and road course time. But what he just did was your basic Hollywood SEAL team 6/ Delta Force movie ending and that is NOT what they train for. Thank god Michael Bay wasn't there or half the town would be exploded too.

I have nothing but respect for that officer. He stayed with them under near constant fire. Lost but regained the lead and took the fight to them when it was on better ground.

 

[Goodcat]

I’m impressed by his safe shot placement in a shooting that was necessary and challenging to remain safe. Could his grip and reload have been better? Yes. Who cares. Job got done, safely in a situation most of us would forget what kind of gun we were holding.

 

[churchmouse]

I’m impressed by his safe shot placement in a shooting that was necessary and challenging to remain safe. Could his grip and reload have been better? Yes. Who cares. Job got done, safely in a situation most of us would forget what kind of gun we were holding.

In all of this I understand the calling out of obvious mistakes. Could more training advance muscle memory in this scenario.....Mag change for sure. High speed pursuit under fire in traffic shooting through the window......how do you train for that.

 

[T.Lex]

In all of this I understand the calling out of obvious mistakes. Could more training advance muscle memory in this scenario.....Mag change for sure. High speed pursuit under fire in traffic shooting through the window......how do you train for that.

Actually, I've been thinking about that. I think there is actually a role for somewhat sophisticated simulators for that kind of thing.

The rolling action of a moving vehicle isn't hard to replicate. Same with the approximate recoil and visual cues of shooting. I'm not saying it would be cheap to make, or that every cop should do it regularly. But, the VR/AR (augmented reality) tech is getting REALLY good.

Just a thought, not a criticism or complaint or anything like that.

 

[jlw]

How many of you have fired from a vehicle? Moving vehicle? How many practice WHO and SHO from the vehicle?

I have fired from a moving vehicle. I've also fired from horseback. I've shot through windshields, but that was from a stationary vehicle.

 

[churchmouse]

Actually, I've been thinking about that. I think there is actually a role for somewhat sophisticated simulators for that kind of thing.

The rolling action of a moving vehicle isn't hard to replicate. Same with the approximate recoil and visual cues of shooting. I'm not saying it would be cheap to make, or that every cop should do it regularly. But, the VR/AR (augmented reality) tech is getting REALLY good.

Just a thought, not a criticism or complaint or anything like that.

That might be a good point but again can you actually put the level of stress in place during a simulation. That would be the issue. Firing in the confined space of the car. That pressure would be another hard thing to match.