Last Jedi ***WITH SPOILERS***

[Kutnupe14]

what..... .. . ? The new star trek movies were just . . . Awful. Didnt feel like star trek at all.

I was happily surprised by the new star wars movies because i was expecting JJ to ruin another great show ( like he did star trek) but it turned out well.

I'm not a Star Trek purist, but I have friend who are. I enjoyed the new movies, but they absolutely hate them. I was really puzzled as to why, until these new "Star Wars" movies started coming out. Now I understand completely.

 

[Bartman]

Just seen on reddit. "Luke Skywalker joined the rebellion because he saw a 10 second video and thought his sister was hot."

With regard to Snoke and his lack of depth as a character, I have to say, we didn't know squat about Palpatine before the prequels came along. If you want more of Snoke's backstory, I'm sure there will be a book shortly.

 

[chipbennett]

Just seen on reddit. "Luke Skywalker joined the rebellion because he saw a 10 second video and thought his sister was hot."

With regard to Snoke and his lack of depth as a character, I have to say, we didn't know squat about Palpatine before the prequels came along. If you want more of Snoke's backstory, I'm sure there will be a book shortly.

Again: the Star Wars story can only (plausibly) begin in media res only once.

Disney is trying to have it both ways: both retain (and kill off) the classic/legendary characters from the original story, yet start afresh, in the middle of the story, with an entirely new cast of characters. Either just start with the new characters, and leave out the originals, or else provide some plausible bridge for how the original characters got to this new point in the storytelling.

 

[Woobie]

Right now, Rotten Tomatoes has it (amongst audience), at 56% liking it. For reference (prequels), TPM, AOTC, ROTS, are 59%, 57%, and 65% respectively.

Here, I'll ask this question - How did you feel, when:
Kenobi died, Yoda raised the X-Wing, Han Frozen, Vader-father, Boba dies, Darth Maul at the palace, Kenobi defeats Anakin, the re-introduction of the Falcon? Was there a scene in TLJ that give you that type of feeling?

Here watch this (again):

[video=youtube;HMUKGTkiWik]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HMUKGTkiWik[/video]


That still gives me chills. There's a real sense of morality, learning, and the power of belief(or used to be) in Star Wars. Things that you really could say "that's inspiring." These new movies simply don't have that.
-

Actually, Luke kicking Kylo's butt from across the galaxy was that moment for me. I thought it was incredible.

 

[K_W]

Just seen on reddit. "Luke Skywalker joined the rebellion because he saw a 10 second video and thought his sister was hot."

With regard to Snoke and his lack of depth as a character, I have to say, we didn't know squat about Palpatine before the prequels came along. If you want more of Snoke's backstory, I'm sure there will be a book shortly.

The Empire also killed his Aunt and Uncle who raised him.

 

[churchmouse]

WE just dialed up Rogue 1 on demand and re-watched in prep to see the new one.

 

[Kutnupe14]

WE just dialed up Rogue 1 on demand and re-watched in prep to see the new one.

Rogue One was awesome... hell, it's Citizen Kane compared to Episode VIII.

 

[Woobie]

Rogue One was awesome... hell, it's Citizen Kane compared to Episode VIII.

Well I know everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but I just don't see it. R1 was better, but VIII was pretty good. I would put it middle of the pack, or slightly better.

 

[T.Lex]

Well, it was a dumb plan, based on a dumb plot point (ships running out of fuel), due to an implausible technological leap (tracking ships through hyperspace). It didn't even have to be that implausible. Just make it so that Finn has some implant or something, that the First Order can track. Or have a spy, who planted something on the capital ship.

I actually thought they'd come out and confirm that the homing beacon they were using for Rey to get back had been hacked and they were using it to track the fleet.

That would've been an easy - and apparently techno-consistent - explanation.

Which would have made the Finn/Rose subplot...

I don't actually have a problem with Finn's and Rose's mission. That sort of improbable gambit actually fits the SW universe. Having it fail fits the ESB parallel.

... darker. I mean, it would've meant they were wrong the whole time. The mission had been a fool's errand, which, as it turns out, it was anyway.

The more I think about that whole sequence, though, 2 things float to the top:
- the Finn-Phasma thing was made for the trailers and really could've have been cut;
- that whole thing was, I think, a set piece designed to show a droid at the helm of an AT-ST.

Frankly, I think that's the first time we actually see a main-character droid using deadly force, no? K2-S0, I guess? Certainly open to correction, but it opens up some Asimovian dilemmas. (The battledroids were always programmed to fight. This appears to either be a new development, or a rarely implemented subroutine in its programming.)

 

[T.Lex]

WE just dialed up Rogue 1 on demand and re-watched in prep to see the new one.

This seems like an odd choice.

 

[Woobie]

I actually thought they'd come out and confirm that the homing beacon they were using for Rey to get back had been hacked and they were using it to track the fleet.

That would've been an easy - and apparently techno-consistent - explanation.

Which would have made the Finn/Rose subplot...



... darker. I mean, it would've meant they were wrong the whole time. The mission had been a fool's errand, which, as it turns out, it was anyway.

The more I think about that whole sequence, though, 2 things float to the top:
- the Finn-Phasma thing was made for the trailers and really could've have been cut;
- that whole thing was, I think, a set piece designed to show a droid at the helm of an AT-ST.

Frankly, I think that's the first time we actually see a main-character droid using deadly force, no? K2-S0, I guess? Certainly open to correction, but it opens up some Asimovian dilemmas. (The battledroids were always programmed to fight. This appears to either be a new development, or a rarely implemented subroutine in its programming.)

I'm conflicted about the Finn/Rose thing. It was meant to be a giant, frustrating waste of time for the characters that ultimately ended in failure, which is really important for the ESB feel we need in the middle movie. On the other hand, it felt like a waste of time watching it. I liked the Casino Royale planet, the new crop of younglings and all that. I liked the dark version of Han Solo that del Toro played. I liked the concept of the fools errand. But it just felt like a distraction. I don't know how you would execute that better. Maybe if Phasma didn't totally suck it would have worked.

 

[Kutnupe14]

I'm conflicted about the Finn/Rose thing. It was meant to be a giant, frustrating waste of time for the characters that ultimately ended in failure, which is really important for the ESB feel we need in the middle movie. On the other hand, it felt like a waste of time watching it. I liked the Casino Royale planet, the new crop of younglings and all that. I liked the dark version of Han Solo that del Toro played. I liked the concept of the fools errand. But it just felt like a distraction. I don't know how you would execute that better. Maybe if Phasma didn't totally suck it would have worked.

-The Casino Royale Planet felt like it shot during the prequels.
-Yeah, the way this "new" movies are going the slave kids probably are going to be younglings
-Del Toro, definitely a bright spot... he couldve been a "new" Solo-type character... but he did betray them, and leave them to their deaths.

The most frustrating thing about these movies, is how they simply ruin the idea of what a Jedi is, and what a difficult task it is to be one, and master the force.

 

[T.Lex]

I'm conflicted about the Finn/Rose thing. It was meant to be a giant, frustrating waste of time for the characters that ultimately ended in failure, which is really important for the ESB feel we need in the middle movie. On the other hand, it felt like a waste of time watching it. I liked the Casino Royale planet, the new crop of younglings and all that. I liked the dark version of Han Solo that del Toro played. I liked the concept of the fools errand. But it just felt like a distraction. I don't know how you would execute that better. Maybe if Phasma didn't totally suck it would have worked.

Honestly, that's a storyline that I thought deserved elaboration. Let them try to infiltrate the high stakes stuff and really make poignant the difference between the rebel reality and that of these other sentients. In fact, the idea that the Republic/Resistance has the funds to pay for stuff is interesting in itself. Taxation? Spoils of war? How DO they fund their stuff?

For the Lucas-originated stories, he was pretty explicit about part of his formula: 3 different worlds/geographies. It didn't fit with ANH, but ESB had Daghoba, Hoth, and Cloud City. ROTJ had Tattoine, Endor, and DS2.

The Last Jedi had: Ach-to, the Rebel cruiser, Snoke's super-duper-uber starship, Canto Bight, Crait. That's a bunch of jumping around that was kinda distracting.

 

[chipbennett]

-The Casino Royale Planet felt like it shot during the prequels.
-Yeah, the way this "new" movies are going the slave kids probably are going to be younglings
-Del Toro, definitely a bright spot... he couldve been a "new" Solo-type character... but he did betray them, and leave them to their deaths.

The DJ character was the obvious Kutnupe, er, I mean, Lando Calrissian, character in EpVIII. Needed in this episode, and I like that he isn't a carbon(ite) copy of Lando.

The most frustrating thing about these movies, is how they simply ruin the idea of what a Jedi is, and what a difficult task it is to be one, and master the force.

Perhaps that is part of the greater story, though. Obviously, over the eons, the impact of the Force on the natural universe wanes. Perhaps the point is that the nature of the Force, and how it interacts, is starting to change dramatically at this inflection point in the history of the universe from "long, long ago" to today.

 

[T.Lex]

I remember when the original movie came out and we really only had Obi Wan's description of the Force. That felt more natural. More relatable.

The midichlorian thing just lends itself to some sort of hereditary monarchy, which doesn't really make sense at ALL if the Jedi aren't supposed to have attachments. Like progeny.

It feels to me like they're taking the Force back to what it started out as.

 

[chipbennett]

Honestly, that's a storyline that I thought deserved elaboration. Let them try to infiltrate the high stakes stuff and really make poignant the difference between the rebel reality and that of these other sentients. In fact, the idea that the Republic/Resistance has the funds to pay for stuff is interesting in itself. Taxation? Spoils of war? How DO they fund their stuff?

For the Lucas-originated stories, he was pretty explicit about part of his formula: 3 different worlds/geographies. It didn't fit with ANH, but ESB had Daghoba, Hoth, and Cloud City. ROTJ had Tattoine, Endor, and DS2.

The Last Jedi had: Ach-to, the Rebel cruiser, Snoke's super-duper-uber starship, Canto Bight, Crait. That's a bunch of jumping around that was kinda distracting.

EpI: TPM: Naboo, Tatooine, Coruscant
EpII: AotC: Coruscant, Kamino, Tatooine, Geonosis
EpIII: RotS: Coruscant, Utapau, Kashyyyk, Mustafar, Dagobah, DS1, Alderaan, Tatooine

EpIV: Tatooine, DS1, Yavin
EpV: Hoth, Dagobah, Bespin
EpVI: Tatooine, Dagobah, Endor/DS2

EpVII: Jakku, Takodana, Starkiller Base, Republic Capital star system, D'Qar
EpVIII: Resistance base, Ach-To, Canto Bight, Snoke's Dreadnaught, Crait

Ironically, one of the only things that EpI has going for it, here, is that it follows the three-setting pattern of the original trilogy.

 

[printcraft]

Why in the name of God didn't they have LANDO as the mysterious code breaker/gambler?

So many wasted opportunities.

Out with the old, in with the new characters I guess. Take what made the series work and throw it out for the sake of being "different".
I'm sort of shocked they didn't have Chewy and R2D2 do a kamikaze run in the Falcon to take out the mini deathstar weapon.
Just get those out of the way too.

It's like watching a sequel to "The Lion King" where Simba gets a 5 minute mention and now we are following the story of the Elephants for the entire movie. Why do we care about the elephants when we came to see "The Lion King"?

 

[Alpo]

Why in the name of God didn't they have LANDO as the mysterious code breaker/gambler?

Maybe because Billy Dee is 80?

 

[printcraft]

Maybe because Billy Dee is 80?

[video=youtube;zbqLWDl-1i8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zbqLWDl-1i8[/video]

That's not bad. He could have set up the DJ character as his protege to have him help them etc.

Seriously missed opportunities. Why are we supposed to care about these characters?
Like in E7 when they blew up the Republic planets with the Starkiller base out of nowhere ..... 5 minutes or less of screen time spent on those planets before hand would have added a "why do we care" to an otherwise blah moment.

 

[Alpo]

Daisy Ridley, John Boyega and Oscar Isaac are good characters going into the future. I'm trying to get behind Adam Driver...but he doesn't get it done for me as the bad/good guy. Maybe it's his voice.

I think the destruction of the Supremacy by Laura Dern and the light saber battles with Driver and Ridley were among the best SW scenes in all of the films. My next would be: