Man Evicted For Living Too Simply in Madison Co.

[hornadylnl]

Democracy, I think. Rule of the Many.

I believe you are confusing communism (all property owned by the state) with our democracy (individual rights restricted by elected representatives). We are a nation of laws, and we chose who gets to make and enforce those laws.

"Communist" is a nice, inflammatory term, so I know why you used it. Calling me a "Representative Republican" doesn't have the same ring to it


Yep. Your local zoning ordinances and building codes cover this as well. Your kitchen is inspected when built and during any major remodel. If you make major changes WITHOUT an inspection, then you can be fined and have your work torn out (or the property seized).

BTW: Never said I agree with any of this. I really do feel for the guy. I'm just trying to point out a few things I think a lot of folks miss:
- there is more to this story than some dude living in a trailer
- the media is working us like puppets
- zoning laws aren't about giving some old guy the boot, they are about balancing YOUR rights with your NEIGHBOR'S rights.
- we all elected the folks that put these laws on the books. If we don't like them, look in the mirror first. Zoning committees are usually elected positions, the meetings are open, and area residents are welcome to attend.

Accept we don't live in a democracy. I'm sure you'll be all for democracy when your neighborhood decides your posterior is the appropriate receptacle for their desires. Don't like it, too bad. The majority has ruled so bend over and take it.

This country was founded on the idea of the individual and property rights.

 

[Bondhead88]

Democracy, I think. Rule of the Many.

I believe you are confusing communism (all property owned by the state) with our democracy (individual rights restricted by elected representatives). We are a nation of laws, and we chose who gets to make and enforce those laws.

"Communist" is a nice, inflammatory term, so I know why you used it. Calling me a "Representative Republican" doesn't have the same ring to it


Yep. Your local zoning ordinances and building codes cover this as well. Your kitchen is inspected when built and during any major remodel. If you make major changes WITHOUT an inspection, then you can be fined and have your work torn out (or the property seized).

BTW: Never said I agree with any of this. I really do feel for the guy. I'm just trying to point out a few things I think a lot of folks miss:
- there is more to this story than some dude living in a trailer
- the media is working us like puppets
- zoning laws aren't about giving some old guy the boot, they are about balancing YOUR rights with your NEIGHBOR'S rights.
- we all elected the folks that put these laws on the books. If we don't like them, look in the mirror first. Zoning committees are usually elected positions, the meetings are open, and area residents are welcome to attend.

Ok but you do not live in a democracy. You live in a representative republic. The way you vote and elect your representatives is different in a democracy, The way laws are made are different in a democracy.

You never have a right to take away someone else's rights by using the word democracy.

And I always find it interesting that the word democracy is used so often when someone is about to lose their rights.

If he wants to wrap himself in cellophane, douse himself in baby-oil and do Karaoke to YMCA then that is his right to do that on his property.

No where in the Constitution does it say you can have your own property as long as your neighbors like the way you keep your property and conform to everybody else.

There is no balance to taking away somebodies property because you don't like the way they live. I mean you can move away from him. (I notice those who don't like his living conditions never suggest this)

Oppression is oppression. Too many gave up their lives to stop other from infringing the rights of the individual. This is how tyranny starts.

 

[Wabatuckian]

Hey Folks,

Why don't those of us who live fairly close just go and pitch some tents out front of his land there (if you're in the type of health to hack the cold)?

You know, protest?

I'm in. Anyone else?

Josh

 

[eldirector]

Just to make sure I understand your position BondHead88 and hordndylnl:

You would abolish all local zoning laws? Property owners would be allowed to do whatever they wanted with their own property, regardless of the impact to other nearby property owners?

Help me understand, seriously. I have been getting mixed messages, so need some help.

You mentioned that this guys neighbors could move away. How is that affirming THEIR property rights? Especially if they were there first?

You mentioned doing whatever they want (something about dancing in shrink wrap), as long as they put up a tall hedge. How is that different that any other zoning regulation?

In the case of a dispute, how would you settle it? Two neighbors are at odds about how the other uses their property. With no social agreement (law) in place, how is it settled? Guns at 10 paces?

 

[hornadylnl]

Just to make sure I understand your position BondHead88 and hordndylnl:

You would abolish all local zoning laws? Property owners would be allowed to do whatever they wanted with their own property, regardless of the impact to other nearby property owners?

Help me understand, seriously. I have been getting mixed messages, so need some help.

You mentioned that this guys neighbors could move away. How is that affirming THEIR property rights? Especially if they were there first?

You mentioned doing whatever they want (something about dancing in shrink wrap), as long as they put up a tall hedge. How is that different that any other zoning regulation?

In the case of a dispute, how would you settle it? Two neighbors are at odds about how the other uses their property. With no social agreement (law) in place, how is it settled? Guns at 10 paces?

I'd eliminate about 90% or more of all zoning laws. Are we free people or do we need nannies to take care of our every problem? Some locales make you get permits to have over a certain amount of dogs. Why should I need a permit if I want 20 dogs on my property? If they leave my property and become a nuisance to others, they should be free to shoot them. My dog leaves my property, I have no right to complain if he doesn't make it back.

I got tired of dealing with douche neighbors so I moved out to the country. See my nearest neighbor? I barely can.

This guy lives on a bigger property than I do and he still has busybody neighbors telling him what to do.

 

[Bondhead88]

Just to make sure I understand your position BondHead88 and hordndylnl:

You would abolish all local zoning laws? Property owners would be allowed to do whatever they wanted with their own property, regardless of the impact to other nearby property owners?

Help me understand, seriously. I have been getting mixed messages, so need some help.

You mentioned that this guys neighbors could move away. How is that affirming THEIR property rights? Especially if they were there first?

You mentioned doing whatever they want (something about dancing in shrink wrap), as long as they put up a tall hedge. How is that different that any other zoning regulation?

In the case of a dispute, how would you settle it? Two neighbors are at odds about how the other uses their property. With no social agreement (law) in place, how is it settled? Guns at 10 paces?

I was joking about the tall hedge, but yes now you understand. it is his property he can do what he wants on it. If you read the constitution you might come to understand this. Instead you have made zoning laws the law of the community.

It is amazing when I suggest they move all of a sudden you are about their property rights. I don't want them to move I was offering it as a suggestion.

You do not need a social agreement, you do what you want on your property I'll do what I want on mine. That is the settlement.

By the way yes I would abolish all zoning laws. I would abolish all sign laws.

How is it that you think you should be able to tell others what they can do on their property. You did not pay for it, nor did you finance it.

What if for instance I hated the color green (actually I usually do). You decide that you like green and not only do you like green but you decide you are going to paint your house bright green, with forest green trim on the gutters, lime green on the shutters, tree green on your doors, puke green on your fence and split pea green for your driveway brick.

Do I now have the right to come along and say hey your freaky looking green house is affecting my real estate values you need to change it. Do I now have the right to force you to repaint it and make it more ascetically pleasing to the rest of the neighborhood.

Because I can show you stats that say that homes that are more unusual in architecture or color can affect the resale value of the other homes around them.

My brother in law once lived across from a guy who had cedar shingles, pine railing, three different colors on his home with two different types of siding.

When my brother in-law went to sell his home the real estate agent tried getting Don to force the other guy to do some changes so he could get more money for his home. My brother in-law fired him and got himself an agent that understood the concept of private property.

This is something you think you know about (private property) but you do not. You would be the guy who looks out his window through the curtains to make sure the neighbors are complying with the way you want them to live. You have no issue with making others comply with your standards and your way of living.

I really hope that you get a neighbor who takes offense to something (anything) you do and starts to make you comply with their way of life. Change house color, change siding style, doesn't like your nativity scene, your inflatable Santa, your Halloween decorations (which I hate and don't do but would never tell my neighbor not to do it on their property.) I hope they think your car is too big or too small and try and make you change it. I hope they think you have too many kids or not enough.

I hope they make you change the color of your asphalt, don't like your style of shingles. thinks your fence is too high or too short. I hope they don't like your style of grass it is too blue or it is too green.

I hope they don't like your pool, watering the lawn, I hope they don't like the fact that your friends come over on a Saturday during the day. You take up too much room on the street, you have too many cars in your driveway, think you have too many animals.

ALL these things have been issues where one neighbor thinks they have had the right to tell someone else what they should do on their own property. We don't need more zoning laws, more by-laws, more regulation, more control.

We need people to mind their own business and stay out of everybody elses.

If you want to live a miserable life and be a busybody go live with Rosie O'Donnell. Cause her misery loves your company!

 

[eldirector]

I'd eliminate about 90% or more of all zoning laws. Are we free people or do we need nannies to take care of our every problem? Some locales make you get permits to have over a certain amount of dogs. Why should I need a permit if I want 20 dogs on my property? If they leave my property and become a nuisance to others, they should be free to shoot them. My dog leaves my property, I have no right to complain if he doesn't make it back.

I got tired of dealing with douche neighbors so I moved out to the country. See my nearest neighbor? I barely can.


This guy lives on a bigger property than I do and he still has busybody neighbors telling him what to do.

I remember your thread about your new property. Congrats on living the dream!

Also, if I remember, you had a low spot on the edge of your property that you considered digging out to form a pond. That sounds like a lot of work, time and money for you to invest. Wouldn't it be a shame if that neighbor you can hardly see decides to set up a pit toilet right near the property line, right uphill from your new pond? Wouldn't it suck if after every hard rain, the unfiltered runoff contaminated your new pond, killed your fish, and made it undrinkable? Maybe even passed on some nice Cholera? But, hey, it is his property, right?

It would be nice if we all just got along, if a handshake was enough, and we all respected our neighbors. Unfortunately, that is not the case. Either intentionally, though ignorance, or through simple disregard, our neighbors actions can greatly impact our own lives. Since a handshake doesn't work, many communities have adopted some rules. As a member of that community, you agree to be bound by them. You don't have to like the rules, but they will be enforced none-the-less (I think we even have an different thread about that). We are a nation of laws, by our own design.

BTW: You have a backstop set up out there yet? I don't think you are too far from me (hint).

 

[Prometheus]

Also, if I remember, you had a low spot on the edge of your property that you considered digging out to form a pond. That sounds like a lot of work, time and money for you to invest. Wouldn't it be a shame if that neighbor you can hardly see decides to set up a pit toilet right near the property line, right uphill from your new pond? Wouldn't it suck if after every hard rain, the unfiltered runoff contaminated your new pond, killed your fish, and made it undrinkable? Maybe even passed on some nice Cholera? But, hey, it is his property, right?

This ^^^ is why socialism flourishes in this country.

A complete lack of logic and reasoning.

This is a ridiculous argument on every level. The Right of one property owner to have his property remain intact from ACTUAL incursion and REAL PHYSICAL damage extending from the actions of another is a basic tenant of Rights extending back for centuries.

Alas this simple concept will be lost on anyone who lacks even basic logic or reasoning... or by someone who is so wrapped up in themselves they will invent any argument they can and hope like heck no one calls them out on it.

"'feelings" are not included in your socialism view of Rights.

 

[eldirector]

This is a ridiculous argument on every level. The Right of one property owner to have his property remain intact from ACTUAL incursion and REAL PHYSICAL damage extending from the actions of another is a basic tenant of Rights extending back for centuries.

So, if someone's actions damage your property, they should be held accountable?

Sounds like we are on the same page.

 

[hornadylnl]

My pond will be 600'+ from the nearest possible sewage which is mine. The nearest possible neighbors would be 1000'+. Where I'm going to put my pond is surrounded by corn field on 3 sides. As such, I will have to put in necessary berms and such to control direct runoff of farm chemicals. I suppose I could tell the neighboring farmer that my pond trumps his property rifts and as such, he can no longer use fertilizers and pesticides near my pond.

I don't have the range done yet. I'll mess with that this spring.

 

[hornadylnl]

So, if someone's actions damage your property, they should be held accountable?

Sounds like we are on the same page.

And that is taken care of through property rights, not nanny state laws.

 

[ocsdor]

... With no social agreement (law) in place, how is it settled? Guns at 10 paces?

You have my support.