Mosul has fallen

[BehindBlueI's]

I really hate that pic. It is taken completely out of context.

Ok. Let's add some context. Text of speech: Text Of Bush Speech - CBS News

Admiral Kelly, Captain Card, officers and sailors of the USS Abraham Lincoln, my fellow Americans: Major combat operations in Iraq have ended. In the Battle of Iraq, the United States and our allies have prevailed. And now our coalition is engaged in securing and reconstructing that country.

In this battle, we have fought for the cause of liberty, and for the peace of the world. Our nation and our coalition are proud of this accomplishment — yet it is you, the members of the United States military, who achieved it. Your courage — your willingness to face danger for your country and for each other — made this day possible. Because of you, our nation is more secure. Because of you, the tyrant has fallen, and Iraq is free.

Seems like major combat operations were far from over. Some 4 years later we'd be doing the "Surge", as an example.

We have difficult work to do in Iraq. We are bringing order to parts of that country that remain dangerous. We are pursuing and finding leaders of the old regime, who will be held to account for their crimes. We have begun the search for hidden chemical and biological weapons, and already know of hundreds of sites that will be investigated. We are helping to rebuild Iraq, where the dictator built palaces for himself, instead of hospitals and schools. And we will stand with the new leaders of Iraq as they establish a government of, by, and for the Iraqi people. The transition from dictatorship to democracy will take time, but it is worth every effort. Our coalition will stay until our work is done. And then we will leave — and we will leave behind a free Iraq.

Did we stay until the work was done? Did we leave behind a free Iraq? What did those 100's of sites to investigate for chemical weapons turn up?

Ah, but just one speech, right, easily taken out of context and perhaps a bit to exuberant but well meaning?

A month later, in a speech to troops: USATODAY.com - Bush to troops: Mission accomplished

(

"America sent you on a mission to remove a grave threat and to liberate an oppressed people, and that mission has been accomplished," he said. Despite growing doubts at home and abroad, he reiterated that troops would find weapons of mass destruction, which were his rationale for striking first at Iraq.

No, his messages of the day were that the War on Terrorism was an ongoing effort with much work to do, but that operations in Iraq and Afghanistan were basically mop up and rebuilding efforts at that point, those theaters were won and we could prepare to move to the next one.

 

[Birds Away]

What did we find there again? I think I missed that current events class 10 years ago.

We did find artillery shells with chemical warheads. But that didn't make it on MSNBC so I guess you missed it.

 

[rambone]

This was always the intended conclusion. The war contractors got rich. The USA lost its freedoms. Plane-loads of money went "missing." Mission accomplished.

 

[Crbn79]

We did find artillery shells with chemical warheads. But that didn't make it on MSNBC so I guess you missed it.

It's hard to tell. When the US moved in it was all over the TV before forces even left Kuwait. Convoys were seen leaving Iraq for Syria, Iraqi leaders fled as well, when the US arrived in Baghdad it's Govt and Military compounds were a ghost town. We will never know what left before our troops arrived aside from knowing it did not contain viable nuclear material.

Saddam bragged about having a functioning Nuke program, in reality the major facilities of his were bombed to dust early on. Iraq did in fact have chemical weapons and the means to produce them, or are we going to ignore the gassing of the Kurds and act like it never happened?

Despite what people saw on the news, or the people came up with, Iraqi's ****es were genuinely happy to see our arrival. Sure the Sunnis were not happy, they were the ruling class and lived as Kings under Saddam, however they were a vast minority. But then, as mentioned, we don't want to be bothered with the truth. Let's just jump on a website and spout "make belief" and connect the dots that have a 15ft thick titanium wall between them, what could possibly go wrong.

 

[Crbn79]

This was always the intended conclusion. The war contractors got rich. The USA lost its freedoms. Plane-loads of money went "missing." Mission accomplished.

Don't even get me started on Blackwater......

 

[daddyusmaximus]

Disclaimer: I still think obama is a POS ruining our country.

It's Bush's fault.

The daddy, the FIRST Bush.

We went in there and didn't finish the job! Sadam should have been removed from power the FIRST time we went in. We knew of his Chem/Bio/Nuke ambitions back then. He had used them on both Iran, and his own people. Then he invaded a neighboring country! By destabilizing the region and threatening our oil supply, he was a threat to our country back then. We should have either stayed completely out of it, or drove into Baghdad back then. I was there the second time we went in. (missed it first go round, I was a drill sgt at Ft Benning back then) Now I'm a cripple, with a brain injury to boot.

Lesson of the day: Stay out of crap, or do it right the FIRST time. Far as I'm concerned these days, leave haji alone until he come after us again, then BOOM.

 

[T.Lex]

And now... Tikrit.
BBC News - Iraq crisis: Militants seize Tikrit after taking Mosul

Iran's gotta be giggling a little bit, after all the time they spent trying to topple Saddam.

Looks like we'll end up with a 3 way split of Iraq after all: Kurdistan, the New Caliphate, and Northern Saudi Arabia/Kuwait.

Edit:
Another interesting tidbit - seems like they're getting some pretty good supplies, and maybe training:
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-25588623

On Monday, the governor of Nineveh province urged residents to "stand firm in their areas and to defend them against the strangers". But within hours, Atheel al-Nujaifi was forced to flee before the provincial government's headquarters was overrun by hundreds of men armed with rocket-propelled grenades, sniper rifles and heavy machine-guns.

And then later...

Mr Maliki also said citizens would be armed to fight the militants.

Should make us appreciate our own rights... and yet also wonder if Maliki really should arm those people. He appears to assume they would fight on his side....

 

[freekforge]

My cousin was in falujah and baghdad during the start of the war so I am not trying to undo their bravery. But ORHA had made a list of all the sites that needed to be preserved and have security in order for iraq to be rebuilt. It is my understanding that not one of these sites had security but the ministry of oil had both military and civilians guarding it. We made a lot more enemies when we didn't listen to orha. I am ok with going in and ousting a tyrant but trying to rebuild the country into something it never was and never will be at the cost of American lives is completely wrong.

 

[Crbn79]

Everyone who wasn't there is an expert on the matter.

 

[freekforge]

I dont claim to be an expert at anything but I have no reason to call the vets that tell me what happened over there liars

 

[Crbn79]

I dont claim to be an expert at anything but I have no reason to call the vets that tell me what happened over there liars

 

[T.Lex]

Besides, the situation in Mosul today is different than what it was when we were fighting there and different from when we were trying to keep the peace there.

Seems like Maliki should be the expert on it. :shrug:

Edit:
Just when you think it couldn't get any worse...

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/mosul-seiz...make-isis-worlds-richest-terror-force-1452190

Half a billion dollars buys a whole boatload of terrorism.

An Iraqi army officer told the Independent: "We can't beat them."
"They're trained in street fighting and we're not. We need a whole army to drive them out of Mosul. They're like ghosts; they appear to hit and disappear within seconds."

 

[Phil502]

Is this part of that Arab Spring I kept hearing about?

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Photos of Obama having his ass handed to him in Northern Iraq: Iraqi Insurgents Capture Northern Cities, Move Toward Baghdad - In Focus - The Atlantic

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Outnumbered 35 to 1 al-Qaida fighters force Iraqi soldiers and security forces to flee toward Baghdad.

UK Telegraph has the blow by blow complete with tweets: Iraq crisis: al-Qaeda forces seize Mosul and Tikrit - as it happened - Telegraph

They are kicking Obama's teeth in now. The Brits are tapping out; Turkey issues warnings. Will Obama be forced to re-invade or will al-Qaida have Iraq?

 

[funeralweb]

Disclaimer: I still think obama is a POS ruining our country.

It's Bush's fault.

The daddy, the FIRST Bush.

We went in there and didn't finish the job! Sadam should have been removed from power the FIRST time we went in. We knew of his Chem/Bio/Nuke ambitions back then. He had used them on both Iran, and his own people. Then he invaded a neighboring country! By destabilizing the region and threatening our oil supply, he was a threat to our country back then. We should have either stayed completely out of it, or drove into Baghdad back then. I was there the second time we went in. (missed it first go round, I was a drill sgt at Ft Benning back then) Now I'm a cripple, with a brain injury to boot.

Lesson of the day: Stay out of crap, or do it right the FIRST time. Far as I'm concerned these days, leave haji alone until he come after us again, then BOOM.

^^^^^THIS^^^^^
We had elements of a certain infantry division close enough to Baghdad in '91 that could see the skyline on the horizon when the order came down to halt the advance. The idea then was that the Iraqi forces were so defeated that Saddam's enemies (read "insurgents") would finish him off. Besides, we didn't want to **** off the muzzies by pushing all the way into their sacred city. Beginning on March 19, 2003 with the commencement of OIF, we learned exactly what insurgents were capable of in all the wrong ways. I also believe Bush 41 knew exactly what Saddam had in his inventory after serving as Reagan's VP during our support of Iraq during the Iran-Iraq war in the 80s. Perhaps our great-great-great-grandchildren will be around to read the supporting documents when they become unclassified, if there is still a USA for them to live in.

 

[funeralweb]

Outnumbered 35 to 1 al-Qaida fighters force Iraqi soldiers and security forces to flee toward Baghdad.

UK Telegraph has the blow by blow complete with tweets: Iraq crisis: al-Qaeda forces seize Mosul and Tikrit - as it happened - Telegraph

They are kicking Obama's teeth in now. The Brits are tapping out; Turkey issues warnings. Will Obama be forced to re-invade or will al-Qaida have Iraq?

When I see reports of Iraqi military turning tail and running away from this attack, I realize that Iraq's own countrymen do not see value in defending against al-Qaida. Then I look at my KIA bracelet with the names of 26 brothers-in-arms from OEF-OIF and can't help but think that a domino effect is about to erase any gains their sacrifices helped to achieve. Can't decide whether to cry or curse.

 

[printcraft]

Outnumbered 35 to 1 al-Qaida fighters force Iraqi soldiers and security forces to flee toward Baghdad.

UK Telegraph has the blow by blow complete with tweets: Iraq crisis: al-Qaeda forces seize Mosul and Tikrit - as it happened - Telegraph

They are kicking Obama's teeth in now. The Brits are tapping out; Turkey issues warnings. Will Obama be forced to re-invade or will al-Qaida have Iraq?

Kirk, really...... you need to reevaluate your statements here.......... obama told me that he killed OBL and alqaeda was broken and on the run.
This can't possibly be true, please stop it.

I do have one lingering question though about the true cause of this outbreak of violence.........

WHO MADE THE YOUTUBE VIDEO THEY ARE OBVIOUSLY UPSET ABOUT AND CAN WE ARREST THE FILM MAKER!?!??!?!!

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Looks like we'll end up with a 3 way split of Iraq after all: Kurdistan, the New Caliphate, and Northern Saudi Arabia/Kuwait.

History undoing itself, basically. Iraq was never a country until the British declared it a country after WWI, forcing disparate groups of people together as a single kingdom. The Kurds have apparently never wanted any part of it. Basra and Mosul were independent of each other under the Ottomans.

Much of the friction in the modern Middle East can be traced back to post-WWI redrawing of the map to carve up the corpse of the Ottoman empire with little to no regard for the populations living there. Some nations have thrived, but others were made up of disparate factions, sometimes with a history of tribal warfare with each other, and have been fractured from the beginning.

 

[printcraft]

Also waiting for the reports in the coming weeks that the Fatal 5 jihadists from Gitmo that big O released are in Iraq orchestrating future chaos.