New Report on Police Militarization via The Daily Beast

[XMil]

I really don't have a problem with them having these things, if I can have them too. That and the immunity from consequences for bad behavior.

 

[RockofStrength]

the numbers speak for themselves. is it that hard to understand that more non cops get killed by guns than cops?

For one thing, the ratio of cops/non-cops is egregiously in favor of the non-cop population.

For another, I fail to understand the point of your observation. Fewer cops are killed by firearms than by other causes: so what? Body armor and assault rifles are hardly the mark of anything but a reasonably well-prepared police force. Any one of us can legally purchase body armor and assault rifles and we would hardly bat an eye if someone else did.

APCs or tanks are excessive, because they simply are not designed for keeping the peace in a manner consistent with what a civilian police force should do. SWAT teams are overused and are often poorly directed by their highly politicized bigwigs. But let's not shoot our arguments in the foot by throwing around idiotic hyperbole (not saying you are, but the article kept emphasizing how militarized their gear is, then tells me that they're using the same make of rifle I keep for personal safety as if it were a military superweapon.).

 

[serpicostraight]

For one thing, the ratio of cops/non-cops is egregiously in favor of the non-cop population.

For another, I fail to understand the point of your observation. Fewer cops are killed by firearms than by other causes: so what? Body armor and assault rifles are hardly the mark of anything but a reasonably well-prepared police force. Any one of us can legally purchase body armor and assault rifles and we would hardly bat an eye if someone else did.

APCs or tanks are excessive, because they simply are not designed for keeping the peace in a manner consistent with what a civilian police force should do. SWAT teams are overused and are often poorly directed by their highly politicized bigwigs. But let's not shoot our arguments in the foot by throwing around idiotic hyperbole (not saying you are, but the article kept emphasizing how militarized their gear is, then tells me that they're using the same make of rifle I keep for personal safety as if it were a military superweapon.).

tell that to a dead marines family in tuscon.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

There was also a latin gang presence

Yes, Latin gangs can be horrific: declensions, wearing togas, dative case, aquaducts, building nice roads--it must have be horrible for you.

Did you run the eagles over with your tank treads?

 

[RockofStrength]

tell that to a dead marines family in tuscon.

Ooooook. Emotional appeal instead of intelligent, logical argument.

I'm sorry, I don't swing that way. Seen enough stupid, foolish, and ignorant garbage perpetuated because people swing on emotion.

Fact is, Mr. Guerena was killed because of a mindset, not the equipment at hand. Those SWAT team members could have been in T-shirts, boxers, and wielding black powder pistols and he still would have died.

As I said in the post you quoted, SWAT teams are egregiously overused, and their actions influenced by politicized officials who want to have "cut down crime during my term" on their resume when they come up for reelection. But that doesn't mean that the SWAT team (or any officer, for that matter) shouldn't be able to have body armor and a rifle that I can buy literally right now if I toddle off to the right stores.

 

[serpicostraight]

Ooooook. Emotional appeal instead of intelligent, logical argument.

I'm sorry, I don't swing that way. Seen enough stupid, foolish, and ignorant garbage perpetuated because people swing on emotion.

Fact is, Mr. Guerena was killed because of a mindset, not the equipment at hand. Those SWAT team members could have been in T-shirts, boxers, and wielding black powder pistols and he still would have died.

As I said in the post you quoted, SWAT teams are egregiously overused, and their actions influenced by politicized officials who want to have "cut down crime during my term" on their resume when they come up for reelection. But that doesn't mean that the SWAT team (or any officer, for that matter) shouldn't be able to have body armor and a rifle that I can buy literally right now if I toddle off to the right stores.

they in fact can have body armor and any rifle we can. can we have any weapon they have? how many tanks you own? they are not using slingshots.

 

[ghuns]

Anyone see that Sons of Guns episode where they mounted a M240 machine gun and a Mark 19 grenade launcher on a sheriffs dept patrol boat? Seemed like a bit of overkill to me. Them gators must get pretty aggressive down there.

 

[public servant]

they are not using slingshots.

Neither are the criminals. I'm not talking about the drunks that lay passed out in their cars behind the bar...I'm talking the real criminals.

 

[RockofStrength]

they in fact can have body armor and any rifle we can. can we have any weapon they have? how many tanks you own? they are not using slingshots.

Ok now I'm simply mystified. I specifically set apart tanks, APCs and the like as unsuitable for peacekeeping. Unless I missed the part where Mr. Guerena was run over by a tank, the only "militarized" equipment in the hands of the SWAT team was their body armor and weaponry. I'm trying and failing to understand how your posts match up so I can make an informed comment.

 

[fireblade]

not to sound all foil hat sounding but in my opinion the reason they want to militarize the police force is the government has realized that our troops would not obey orders that are unconstitutional and have in the past refused such unlawful orders were the police force and other agency will blindly obey order given to them remember they are the law its up to the court system and the government for you to answer too to protest or claim your a good citizen there just doing there job and enforcing the law.

have a police force militarized and willing to follow any order under the the word law you can control greater numbers.............
they can't get that from the military in domestic operation

 

[TMU317]

not to sound all foil hat sounding but in my opinion the reason they want to militarize the police force is the government has realized that our troops would not obey orders that are unconstitutional and have in the past refused such unlawful orders were the police force and other agency will blindly obey order given to them remember they are the law its up to the court system and the government for you to answer too to protest or claim your a good citizen there just doing there job and enforcing the law.

have a police force militarized and willing to follow any order under the the word law you can control greater numbers.............
they can't get that from the military in domestic operation

Ha, not so. Remember, the people who make up any police force are a part of the community that they work in. The laws that they enforce have an impact on their families, their friends, and even themselves. For the same reasons that our troops would refuse to follow ridiculous unconstitutional orders, police officers would also refuse to follow such orders. Do you know anyone who is a police officer? What makes you think they would "blindly obey order given to them"? Not all police officers may be upstanding citizens, but the vast majority are good people and more than capable of thinking for themselves. The vast majority of them are hard working, dedicated individuals, who go to work every day and try to make their community a better place. While not all officers are the same (shocking), the majority are not out to screw everyone over and violate their constitutional rights.

 

[Denny347]

Cops Killed in Line of Duty Up in 2011; Guns Blamed on average thirty thousand people are killed by guns in this country every year. according to this article 62 of them were cops. someone remind me again how dangerous police work is

What do you know about it....oh right, statistics. We can answer everything from them. Danger is area/department specific. Like I have said on here numerous times. There will be departments where NO officers had pulled their duty pistol, let along fire it or get shot at. Then there is the reverse. It is no secret that I work for IMPD, it is the largest department in the state. I happen to work the busiest area in the city. I have had 3 friends/co-workers get shot to death, 5 or 6 that have actually taken a bullet (injuries range from bruising from the vest, losing an eye, to brain damage,), and probably a dozen that had to shoot someone. So don't sit there in cyberland and tell me how dangerous my job isn't. You have no idea whst you are talking about. What do you do for a living?

 

[public servant]

What do you do for a living?

I think he drives a truck for a living. As a hobby he gets drunk and passes out in the parking lot of bars and gets carted off to jail.

 

[Denny347]

they in fact can have body armor and any rifle we can. can we have any weapon they have? how many tanks you own? they are not using slingshots.

We do not own tanks.
Websters : an enclosed heavily armed and armored combat vehicle that moves on tracks

We own armored vehicles 100% legal to own. Hell, non-LEO's have the market cornered for owning actual tanks, lots of collectors of those.

 

[Denny347]

Anyone see that Sons of Guns episode where they mounted a M240 machine gun and a Mark 19 grenade launcher on a sheriffs dept patrol boat? Seemed like a bit of overkill to me. Them gators must get pretty aggressive down there.

God I hate that show, those idiots make us all look bad.

 

[Denny347]

not to sound all foil hat sounding but in my opinion the reason they want to militarize the police force is the government has realized that our troops would not obey orders that are unconstitutional and have in the past refused such unlawful orders were the police force and other agency will blindly obey order given to them remember they are the law its up to the court system and the government for you to answer too to protest or claim your a good citizen there just doing there job and enforcing the law.

have a police force militarized and willing to follow any order under the the word law you can control greater numbers.............
they can't get that from the military in domestic operation

Good Lord, you make us sound like a bunch of idiots. Thanks. 100% untrue and fabricated fear.

 

[serpicostraight]

i drive a truck. which more drivers die by far every year than cops. and if cops were smart enough to tell the difference between a moving vehicle and a parked one there would not have been a problem. i can look at the wheels and tell if a vehicle is moving. but i guess its not that simple for some people.

 

[public servant]

Grind that axe.

 

[jeremy]

Sigh....

This BS again...

 

[serpicostraight]

too early for grinding i got coffee to drink