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[halfmileharry]

I have hated his punk smug ass since they cheated the Raiders with that Bravo Sierra forward motion call in the snow. They have rode the officiating ever since.
Yes he is a great QB. But if Manning had the tools he has had...???

and the coaching. Manning seemed to lack defense on his teams. That's management and money spent on offense. Bellichick is a very good GM.
It's so easy to hate the Pats. It's difficult to appreciate their accomplishments as an organization.

 

[MCgrease08]

I have hated his punk smug ass since they cheated the Raiders with that Bravo Sierra forward motion call in the snow. They have rode the officiating ever since.
Yes he is a great QB. But if Manning had the tools he has had...???

What great tools has Brady had that Manning didn't?

Manning played with Marvin Harrison (hall of famer), Edgerin James (hall of fame finalist), Reggie Wayne (possible hall of famer) Tarik Glenn, (all pro left tackle).

Brady has had ... Gronk. A bunch of small random white wide receivers. Running backs that no one has ever heard of.

Many of the high-scoring Colts offenses were loaded with talent. The Patriots squeeze every ounce of effort and performance out of average players. Totally different styles and systems for sure, but Brady has never been surrounded by super stars.

The Patriots win by playing solid defense, not turning the ball over and by exploiting the weakness of their opponent. A ton of that credit falls on Belichick, the greatest coach ever. But Brady deserves to be called the best QB too. No one has ever done what he's done.

 

[Ingomike]

So he has some magic formula that no one else has ever figured out on how to stay in good athletic physical shape into his 40s? Sure.

You have missed a lot of reporting and apparently the details of my post, repeat, He pioneered QB flexibility for longevity vs the old conventional wisdom of bulk up to take hits, so yes he has "some magic formula" to stay in shape into the 40's. He does not drink alcohol and has a strict diet that you would likely puke on, focusing on the healthiest intake possible. In the meantime he is developing a company to sell the formula to others.

He has just what you asked for, a winning magic formula...

 

[churchmouse]

What great tools has Brady had that Manning didn't?

Manning played with Marvin Harrison (hall of famer), Edgerin James (hall of fame finalist), Reggie Wayne (possible hall of famer) Tarik Glenn, (all pro left tackle).

Brady has had ... Gronk. A bunch of small random white wide receivers. Running backs that no one has ever heard of.

Many of the high-scoring Colts offenses were loaded with talent. The Patriots squeeze every ounce of effort and performance out of average players. Totally different styles and systems for sure, but Brady has never been surrounded by super stars.

The Patriots win by playing solid defense, not turning the ball over and by exploiting the weakness of their opponent. A ton of that credit falls on Belichick, the greatest coach ever. But Brady deserves to be called the best QB too. No one has ever done what he's done.

True. But I still hate him.....

Can you tell I was a Raiders fan.

 

[Ingomike]

He's a good QB that fit very well into the system. Ever wonder why he stayed healthy despite not being a mobile QB. Outstanding OL through the years. But he is not the greatest as most fans claim. Brady's success should be credited to the management and coaching for surrounding him with talent. If Brady was with the colts, I doubt he can improvise and still find ways to win with a collapsing OL.

Yep, all the greats played on a team, they played in some type of "system". Joe Montana had the weapons and the short passing game system, everybody on a team plays in a system, although that term is usually reserved for college teams that play a type of game that is substantially different from other teams.

I believe Manning a smarter QB than Brady, heck Manning was a better coach than his coaches in the later years, but on the field is where it counts, and Brady has the regular season accomplishments coupled with off the charts post-season success. Just who is the greatest QB of all time if not Brady?

 

[Ingomike]

True. But I still hate him.....

Can you tell I was a Raiders fan.

I remember that game like yesterday. Was rooting for the Raiders that day for sure.

 

[churchmouse]

I remember that game like yesterday. Was rooting for the Raiders that day for sure.

We had rented a block of rooms pool side for our kids to have a party. They were out in the pool with their friends and the adults were watching the game of football be forever changed.

 

[jamil]

Definitely wouldn’t diminish his accomplishments, but the greatest qb ever? I’m not on that bandwagon.

He has 5 Superbowl rings, 4 Superbowl MVPs, 3 NFL MVPs, Most playoff wins by far. I could go on. I don't know how one can say that his accomplishments don't put him at the top. I'm a Payton Manning fan and I used to think he was the GOAT. Manning would probably be better than Brady if his body hadn't failed him. He played hurt for a lot of years. And his infamous waffle ball he'd throw up at the most inconvenient times really hurt his success. Coulda isn't GOAT though. At 41 Brady is still getting it done, though he won the last Superbowl by not losing. The team won that, and with a little help from the Rams and some curious coaching.

Of course Brady didn't win all those games by himself. He had a team around him and probably the GOAT coach. Still I don't have a problem with saying Brady is probably the GOAT. But he's not going to hold it for long. Patrick Mahomes is impressive. If he can develop his mental game to help him survive aging, I think he could be the GOAT. That's something that both Manning and Brady have. Neither Manning nor Brady were ever great Athletes like Mahomes. Yet they both are at least in the top 5 QBs of all time. Hopefully Mahomes will stay healthy and mature. I guess I just like seeing greatness at the QB position. And that guy is a lot of fun to watch play.

 

[jamil]

So he has some magic formula that no one else has ever figured out on how to stay in good athletic physical shape into his 40s? Sure.

No one's saying that. But, not many QBs can play at that level beyond 40 and be successful. Bret Favre did. But then Bret Favre is in the top 5 too. But Favre looked like an old man when he finally gave it up.

 

[ChristianPatriot]

He has 5 Superbowl rings, 4 Superbowl MVPs, 3 NFL MVPs, Most playoff wins by far. I could go on. I don't know how one can say that his accomplishments don't put him at the top. I'm a Payton Manning fan and I used to think he was the GOAT. Manning would probably be better than Brady if his body hadn't failed him. He played hurt for a lot of years. And his infamous waffle ball he'd throw up at the most inconvenient times really hurt his success. Coulda isn't GOAT though. At 41 Brady is still getting it done, though he won the last Superbowl by not losing. The team won that, and with a little help from the Rams and some curious coaching.

Of course Brady didn't win all those games by himself. He had a team around him and probably the GOAT coach. Still I don't have a problem with saying Brady is probably the GOAT. But he's not going to hold it for long. Patrick Mahomes is impressive. If he can develop his mental game to help him survive aging, I think he could be the GOAT. That's something that both Manning and Brady have. Neither Manning nor Brady were ever great Athletes like Mahomes. Yet they both are at least in the top 5 QBs of all time. Hopefully Mahomes will stay healthy and mature. I guess I just like seeing greatness at the QB position. And that guy is a lot of fun to watch play.

I think Brees is a better pure quarterback than Brady, he only has one ring though so he doesn’t get into those conversations nationally.

 

[churchmouse]

I think Brees is a better pure quarterback than Brady, he only has one ring though so he doesn’t get into those conversations nationally.

I have no love for that team but I do really enjoy watching Breeze do his thing. He has one of if not the best thrown balls in the game. It is pure beauty.

 

[KLB]

You have missed a lot of reporting and apparently the details of my post, repeat, He pioneered QB flexibility for longevity vs the old conventional wisdom of bulk up to take hits, so yes he has "some magic formula" to stay in shape into the 40's. He does not drink alcohol and has a strict diet that you would likely puke on, focusing on the healthiest intake possible. In the meantime he is developing a company to sell the formula to others.

He has just what you asked for, a winning magic formula...

No. I doubt the veracity of that. Although, you forgot about his magic diet too. If you want to believe, be my guest.

The same kind of crap was said about Clemens when he had his resurgence in his late 30s, and when Bonds suddenly bulked up in his mid 30s.

 

[KLB]

No one's saying that. But, not many QBs can play at that level beyond 40 and be successful. Bret Favre did. But then Bret Favre is in the top 5 too. But Favre looked like an old man when he finally gave it up.

I had my doubts about Favre too. Not many anything play into their 40s except kickers, and few enough of them do it. Even with the new rules protecting them, playing QB is punishing. You are not going to convince me that stretching and diet allow him to stay healthy and in shape at his age.

 

[Ingomike]

No. I doubt the veracity of that. Although, you forgot about his magic diet too. If you want to believe, be my guest.

The same kind of crap was said about Clemens when he had his resurgence in his late 30s, and when Bonds suddenly bulked up in his mid 30s.

I know it is hard for folks in our region to get over despising the Patriots and Brady, but I can guarantee top level thoroughbred racehorses are not fed junk, and Brady has a notoriously strict diet, so all the reports on that are fake? His proprietary diet and workout plans are the result of working with innovative people in the exercise and fitness world to develop a better way for athletes to perform better while aging, all while using his own body as a billboard to sell it. New young players in the league are demanding that type of fitness approach instead of the old school bulk up approach.


As I age, I have come to appreciate, desire, and work toward flexibility. My personal trainer stresses stretching and flexibility to allow me to do more as I age. It is particularly important for those of us at a desk frequently. So maybe seeing that in my personal life helps me see how it could help a 41 yo football player with the money, God given physical attributes, and desire to continue competing.

Farve had the desire to compete but not to stop drinking alcohol and chasing women. He liked the physical play and his body let him down. I believe that the year Brady missed he vowed to to anything for that to never happen again, it was a complete change your life moment.

 

[Ingomike]

He has 5 Superbowl rings, 4 Superbowl MVPs, 3 NFL MVPs, Most playoff wins by far.

6 Super Bowl wins. As a QB he has won 33% of the SB's in the 2000's.

OH, and the clincher, fans of other teams that hate him now debate if he is the greatest. Done...

 

[ChristianPatriot]

Bradshaw’s got 4 rings and he’s NEVER brought up as one of the goat’s. It’s a team sport. Clearly the Patriots dynasty over the past two decades might be the greatest accomplishment in any professional sport, but we’re talking about the qb position.

Bill Russell’s got 11 freakin rings but it’s always Jordan as the goat. So clearly championships isn’t everything.

 

[Ingomike]

Bradshaw’s got 4 rings and he’s NEVER brought up as one of the goat’s. It’s a team sport. Clearly the Patriots dynasty over the past two decades might be the greatest accomplishment in any professional sport, but we’re talking about the qb position.

Bill Russell’s got 11 freakin rings but it’s always Jordan as the goat. So clearly championships isn’t everything.

But it makes for fun winter banter...

 

[KLB]

I know it is hard for folks in our region to get over despising the Patriots and Brady, but I can guarantee top level thoroughbred racehorses are not fed junk, and Brady has a notoriously strict diet, so all the reports on that are fake? His proprietary diet and workout plans are the result of working with innovative people in the exercise and fitness world to develop a better way for athletes to perform better while aging, all while using his own body as a billboard to sell it. New young players in the league are demanding that type of fitness approach instead of the old school bulk up approach.


As I age, I have come to appreciate, desire, and work toward flexibility. My personal trainer stresses stretching and flexibility to allow me to do more as I age. It is particularly important for those of us at a desk frequently. So maybe seeing that in my personal life helps me see how it could help a 41 yo football player with the money, God given physical attributes, and desire to continue competing.

Farve had the desire to compete but not to stop drinking alcohol and chasing women. He liked the physical play and his body let him down. I believe that the year Brady missed he vowed to to anything for that to never happen again, it was a complete change your life moment.

Dude, I don't despise Brady and the Patriots. I'm a Bears fan not a Colts fan. I've been a bears fan longer than the Colts have been in Indy.

Again, if you want to believe he found the fountain of youth, be my guest. I am skeptical of any athlete that does this kind of thing. Science will always stay far ahead of testing, which will make it close to impossible to catch anyone with the means and desire to tweak their physiology. The money and egos of these guys will always be big drivers towards finding ways to enhance their performance.

There is too much money and ego to be fed for these guys.

 

[KittySlayer]

I heard that Gronk has been living on his endorsement money all this time and hasn't even touched his NFL salary. While he may act like a big kid, you don't play at his level without having some brains to go with your muscles and skills.

[video=youtube;1d-EyX5r_lk]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1d-EyX5r_lk[/video]

 

[Ingomike]

Dude, I don't despise Brady and the Patriots. I'm a Bears fan not a Colts fan. I've been a bears fan longer than the Colts have been in Indy.

Again, if you want to believe he found the fountain of youth, be my guest. I am skeptical of any athlete that does this kind of thing. Science will always stay far ahead of testing, which will make it close to impossible to catch anyone with the means and desire to tweak their physiology. The money and egos of these guys will always be big drivers towards finding ways to enhance their performance.

There is too much money and ego to be fed for these guys.

I grant you they will all do what they can to prolong the money including types of steroids. You do realize the all the "low T" commercials are for roids of some kind. But without great genetics, proper nutrition, and exercise none of that matters and Brady has been a pioneer in that area. So any guy that excells is suspected of doping in your world?

We are a long way from the days when the Pacers played at the Coliseum, drank in a nearby bar with fans after the game, and went to work the next day. Many footballers still sit on the couch eating Cheetos in the off season.