NWI 2010 Meet & Shoot End of Year Review.

[Woodrow]

Congratulations on the reps.

I have no problems with moving people back from the firing line. It was very crowded. As I have said, there is room for improvement, but it wasn't a "train wreck." We are introducing new shooters, we are building community. If anyone thought there were serious issues all around and didn't call a general stop to action to conduct a safety briefing, then I take issue with such negligence. I am open to some level of regulation, but I won't suffer such grandiose criticism of a very positive event.

Posts like this are why it is so hard to attract new shooters and for novices to excel. It is easy to complain after the fact. If a few safety contacts were made at the time, then thank you, but it sounds to me like some sat idly by, uncomfortable with the events as they were unfolding, and are now sounding off when it is too late. Remember, a stitch in time saves nine. I won't pretend that everything was ideal, but if there were serious problems, I find it unnerving that more wasn't done at the time by those who feel that things were so out of hand.

 

[jedi]

Does the 50 yard range have the rifle stands like the 25 yard range as shown in this pic?

I've only been on the 50 yard range twice (never the 100 or 200) so I don't recall.

The reason I ask is the one time we have meet at the 50 yard range it seemed our gear was smaller perception wise. Not sure if we brought less, or was in the cases, or just since it's not as easy to lay out I did not see it all.

Yes the 25 yard benches/rifle holders gets jammed pack when we have our meets. The tables are a mess in terms of ammo/guns (all the ones I saw had no mag in them and their were opened (ie.not sure the term but you know when the slide is back indicating chamber is empty.) Did not pay attention to the rifles this time around but I don't really recall ever seeing any on the tables.

Guess perhaps we need some places to put all our stuff. Would bringing more tables help? I brought a longer one this time round due to the food items since we keep bring more food each time. Perhaps a few more tables (either card or long) to help have over flow space for the handguns?

We could do say 2 handguns per bench the rest need to stay on the "handgun tables" and allow all the ammo on the benches only. (ie. no ammo on the "handgun tables"). Would this help or make things worse?

Guess I'm thinking out loud now.
On 1 end of the spectrum we have the "change nothing" and we start the 2011 season the same way we did 2010. Meaning vote for a date in MAR, make the official post, people sign up, when then post pics and AARs at the end.

At the other end of the spectrum we have "complete safety"
1) We have a designated area where it's handguns/rifles only NO AMMO somewhere behind the line
2) We have ammo only on the benches
3) We have MAX of 2 shooters per bench so 8 total shooter. Each would have a RED football flag on their belt (ie. ACTIVE SHOOTER)
4) We have a MAX of 8 "yellow flag" people these are people that are either teaching the red shooter or looking at what that shooter in that lane is doing.
5) EVERYONE else must be off the cement pad and 10 feet back from the pad where the food/chairs are at.
6) We have 1 roving RO on the line
7) We have a timer that goes off every 10 min. At which time the RED flager give up their red flag to those waiting for a time to shoot.
8) Only handguns and .22 rifles on the 25 everything else either 50/100/200 ranges.

Yes this is CRAZY and I'm thinking of the 2 Extremes as we look for a balance for 2011.

 

[451_Detonics]

As I said I spoke to several privately about gun handling, I ask several to keep actions open behind the firing line, and I did speak to a few about sweeping people with their muzzles...if you didn't see these things happening then you weren't looking because it happened quite often.

Posts like this are why it is so hard to attract new shooters and for novices to excel.

I would hate to think a new shooter would think this is the proper way to run a range and how can a new shooter excel when all he/she is doing is making noise with no idea where their bullets are going?

Remember, a stitch in time saves nine. I won't pretend that everything was ideal, but if there were serious problems, I find it unnerving that more wasn't done at the time by those who feel that things were so out of hand.

As I said I spoke up several times. A few months ago I tried to make a difference and was almost universally ignored so all I do is try to keep a safe zone around myself...I either went to the 50 or stayed well behind the line when it got really silly.

I am not my brother's keeper tho I have attempted to keep things safe but when I am ignored I must make the decision to watch out for myself and let others do as they will.

Does the 50 yard range have the rifle stands like the 25 yard range as shown in this pic?

They have the same racks on all the ranges. The idea is whenever someone is downrange the rifle should be racked muzzle up...no firearms on the benches. I always racked my long guns and bagged my handguns when I wasn't shooting them.

 

[melensdad]

Let me just say that it might be better if we set up the food at the 50 yard line? Seems that there are so many people at the 25 yard line because the tables and food are all set up at the 25.

Last month the food was at the 50 and we had shooters spread out all over BOTH the 25 and the 50 yard ranges. It seemed to be far less crowded last month, but we probably had about as many shooters, they just were scattered over a much wider area of the property.

After
Action
Reports

I know...if it doesn't involve cigars or hotdogs it's a bit hard for ya

OK GOT IT NOW. Remind me again next time because being old enough to qualify for AARP (but refusing to join that bastard organization) my mind slips and I will probably forget next time it comes up.

 

[jedi]

I would hate to think a new shooter would think this is the proper way to run a range and how can a new shooter excel when all he/she is doing is making noise with no idea where their bullets are going?

I think we might have a different definition of a new shooter.

This season all the new shooters I took were people who had never fired a gun before and all but 1 was scared to fire anything BEFORE the event or really did not want to touch guns. They were not anti-gunners (I know some of those people and have yet to get one of those to come. 2011 may be different even if I have to drag one there. )

The goal (at least for me) for these new shooters was to show them that the gun is nothing more than a tool and goes boom and it's not like what they see in the movies. The goal was not to teach them to aim and shoot or make nice groupings. More just to allow them to shoot everything from .22 to .45 and rifle caliber long guns & plant that seed that the guns are not dangerous. If they choose later on to get training, etc. then we point them in the right direction. Not this type of event. The event primary was to put faces to all these INGo names and bring "new" shooters so they can see that guns are not evil. From that aspect I/we met the 2010 goal.

They have the same racks on all the ranges. The idea is whenever someone is downrange the rifle should be racked muzzle up...no firearms on the benches. I always racked my long guns and bagged my handguns when I wasn't shooting them.

With the large number of handguns and people our current setup does not make it possible to keep the benches free of handguns while people are downrange. The 2 times the ranges was COLD and I was on the right side the handguns on the bench were all unload with slides locked back. The sole rifle (GB's .30 carbine) was on the bench but it was also unloaded, no mag on it. GB was fixing something on it and he stopped and backed away from it when I told him COLD.

Perhaps a table near the benches on the grass where we can place unloaded handguns (slides open) would help ensure we have room on the benches. Better yet next time we go COLD we have everyone get off the cement pad onto the grass area while those that are downrange put their targets. This way even if we have guns on the benches we have no issues. GLOCKS EXCLUDED FROM THIS OFF COURSE SINCE THEY ALWAYS GO BOOM EVEN WHEN LOOKED AT.

"bagging the handguns" while an option is not a preferred option since we might not all unload a handgun before bagging it and it "hides" the gun which in turn may cause another member not to see it and who may have come to try it out? Yes most of the regulars know who brings what but we still get new INGO members that come and don't know everyone or who brought what.

In addition having a bagged handgun still has the same issue in which now we have a load/unload handgun not on the line but in a bag behind the line.

Looks like perhaps a designated safe area we may need when we have larger groups.

 

[jedi]

Let me just say that it might be better if we set up the food at the 50 yard line? Seems that there are so many people at the 25 yard line because the tables and food are all set up at the 25.

Last month the food was at the 50 and we had shooters spread out all over BOTH the 25 and the 50 yard ranges. It seemed to be far less crowded last month, but we probably had about as many shooters, they just were scattered over a much wider area of the property.

That may work as well. Doing it on the 25 makes it more "group focused" since we can so quickly fill it up and have all our gear in one place and we can very easily look at everything everyone brought.

Since we are growing perhaps it is time to consider starting on the 50 yard. In the end whereever the food gets set up that is where the majorty will end up at. The 50 also give us easier access to the "RO house" for electricity

 

[melensdad]

That may work as well. Doing it on the 25 makes it more "group focused" since we can so quickly fill it up . . .

But that also implies that we can so quickly OVERFILL the line too.

I really don't shoot too much at these events but go for the social aspect. Sure I blow off a box or two of ammo, but its just as common for me to walk to the 200 yard line with a rifle as it is for me to be back at the grill with the food or hanging around with the cigar crowd.

 

[geronimojoe85]

So here is where you guys are.

As I said on the other thread I see no reason for the Centerfire rifles at the 25 yard line, except in the case of using a 25 meter zeroing target for a rifle. (But I didn't see any of those at the range.)

If you want to get the feel of a rifle walk your happy a$$ to the 50 yard line. If you REALLY want a feel for a rifle go to the 100 or 200. That will keep space on the 25 for "seeders" and pistols.

And I'm guilty of being an a$$hole and just making noise on the range with the saiga.
Yeah, I did that with a couple other guns too. I suppose that really doesn't make us look good to the novice/new shooters, I'll own that one.

I think just structuring it with pistols/.22s here, shotguns here, and rifles over there. Will do all kinds of good.

 

[turnandshoot4]

With the large number of handguns and people our current setup does not make it possible to keep the benches free of handguns while people are downrange. The 2 times the ranges was COLD and I was on the right side the handguns on the bench were all unload with slides locked back. The sole rifle (GB's .30 carbine) was on the bench but it was also unloaded, no mag on it. GB was fixing something on it and he stopped and backed away from it when I told him COLD.

This was great and I really liked how everyone responded when this happened. I did not see any firearms handling when we went cold. Everyone just went and got a hotdog or a pop when we went cold.

Perhaps a table near the benches on the grass where we can place unloaded handguns (slides open) would help ensure we have room on the benches. Better yet next time we go COLD we have everyone get off the cement pad onto the grass area while those that are downrange put their targets. This way even if we have guns on the benches we have no issues.

Not to poke fun but we could also sit in a circle and sing coom by ya. Many people's "perception" of saftey is different. For me, as long as firearms aren't being handled while I'm down range I'm fine. I do take the opportunity to load mags however. This is not viewed as "safe" by some I'm sure. That's fine. I'd love to hear what others think should be done. Please 451_Detonics, chime in.

IMHO we don't need a Kingsbury to operate a safe range. Guns generally don't go off by themselves and as some of us found out some guns don't go off even when we want them to I don't like "cold" ranges and saw many carrying at the shoot. I'm fine with this at the range same as I am in public.

Now I have one more question, why don't we consider another range? I know everyone likes the RO but it makes no sense to me. I've waited a year to ask this question because I thought the reason to go Winimac was because of the covered shooting positions. However, it only rained once on the NWI crowd. We pass one range on the way to another, so why not JP?

I'd like it for group shoots for the following reasons.

1. At least 20 times the parking spaces.
2. More shooting bays (7 on pistol, similar for other ranges except for the 225)
3. Skeet range close (so we can shoot shotguns at moving targets and NOT tear up the range)
4. Closer by all accounts.
5. Larger in every way. We can break off in groups to do different activites. One group shooting clays, one group shooting handguns, so on and so forth.

Now I'm sure Winimac is considered much "nicer" but those 5 reasons for JP are the reason I don't like Winimac. Sure they have nicer bathrooms but heck, I didn't even see anyone use the bathroom. They HAD (WINK WINK) nicer grass. That being said I think we've out grown Winimac. That is great but we are starting to fix things that can't be fixed. 30 or more people at that range can just get to be too much. Especially if people start to car pool from elsewhere.

Just some thoughts NWI.

 

[geronimojoe85]

Winimac is kind of a haul, not that I've actually driven there. JP would be closed and a bigger range would be better. That way we dont totally occupy any one firing line. On the other hand taking the Centerfire rifles to the longer ranges could thin out the hoard on the 25.

I do like the idea of JP though or even Willow slough.
Fact is, unless somebody buys a crapload of land our options for ranges are limited.

 

[jedi]

Not to poke fun but we could also sit in a circle and sing coom by ya. Many people's "perception" of saftey is different. For me, as long as firearms aren't being handled while I'm down range I'm fine. I do take the opportunity to load mags however. This is not viewed as "safe" by some I'm sure. That's fine. I'd love to hear what others think should be done. Please 451_Detonics, chime in.

Coom By Ya is NOT allowed at the range. It's on the very fine print of that pink/yellow/orange sign in card you signed.


Yes the term "safe" and "cold" range will differ from person to person and we are never going to get an agreement on it from all so I'm not even going to try. Not to mention that at this last one (NOV) we had the 25 to ourselves for the majority of the shoot. Some times we have had to SHARE with the public the range. Yes I know it's a public range but when we are their I want to imagine it's all ours.

I have no issue with people carrying "holsters" a handgun while on the range or people loading mags. Guess to me safe would mean no one is touching a firearm on the line while people are downrange.

Now I have one more question, why don't we consider another range? I know everyone likes the RO but it makes no sense to me. I've waited a year to ask this question because I thought the reason to go Winimac was because of the covered shooting positions. However, it only rained once on the NWI crowd. We pass one range on the way to another, so why not JP?

I'd like it for group shoots for the following reasons.

1. At least 20 times the parking spaces.
2. More shooting bays (7 on pistol, similar for other ranges except for the 225)
3. Skeet range close (so we can shoot shotguns at moving targets and NOT tear up the range)
4. Closer by all accounts.
5. Larger in every way. We can break off in groups to do different activites. One group shooting clays, one group shooting handguns, so on and so forth.

Now I'm sure Winimac is considered much "nicer" but those 5 reasons for JP are the reason I don't like Winimac. Sure they have nicer bathrooms but heck, I didn't even see anyone use the bathroom. They HAD (WINK WINK) nicer grass. That being said I think we've out grown Winimac. That is great but we are starting to fix things that can't be fixed. 30 or more people at that range can just get to be too much. Especially if people start to car pool from elsewhere.

Just some thoughts NWI.

First a little bit of history of why Winimac.
Back in MAR 2010 was when an INGO member (Andre46996) posted this:
https://www.indianagunowners.com/forums/ingo_events/79467-3_28_10_nwi_spring_fling.html

The first official NWI INGO Shoot.

For those of you about to complain if you have never been there you have no idea what you are missing!!

It IS worth the drive. It is only about 15 mins east of Jasper/Pulaski and 100x better range!!

That followed with an APRIL one again by Andrea46996
https://www.indianagunowners.com/forums/ingo_events/83665-04_24_2010_nwi_shoot_out.html

Note that both were labeled "Shoots" as in more shooting that talking and or eating would be done. In fact at both the MAR/APR we had no food or cigars just nothing but shooting done those days.

I don't recall why in MAY 2010 I did the post. I think in part because Andrea was not going to be able to make it.
https://www.indianagunowners.com/forums/ingo_events/86132-05_02_2010_nwi_meet_and_shoot.html

When I did the MAY event I labeled it MEET & SHOOT after our MEET & EATs and spammed the entire NWI INGO social group. The prior 2 events I don't think anyone spammed the NWI INGO social group. I followed the same format as the prior two but my focus was on INGO members putting faces to the names they always read online about.

AAR from MARCH:
https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo...0_nwi_meet_and_shoot-after_action_report.html

In June again same concept:
https://www.indianagunowners.com/forums/ingo_events/89536-06_06_2010_nwi_meet_and_shoot.html

JUL (largest one we had with 35+ people) was when we first brought food to the range as well. AuntieBellum brought brownies, others brought pop , I took a bag of chips and maybe melensdad brought the grill with cigars.
https://www.indianagunowners.com/forums/ingo_events/94620-07_11_10_nwi_meet_and_shoot.html

This is went it became a full blow social event and we had guns everywhere on the 25 yard range.

In AUG we got more organized in terms of food (water coolers, tables, and more food was brought) along with the idea of material donations to the range.
https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo..._ingo_meet_and_shoot_-_sat_07_aug_2010_a.html

SEP, OCT and NOV all followed the format we have right now:
https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo..._ingo_meet_and_shoot_-_sat_18_sep_2010_a.html

OCT
https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo..._ingo_meet_and_shoot_-_sat_16_oct_2010_a.html

NOV
https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo...t_sunday_14_nov_2010_-_last_1_for_2010_a.html

Suspect that what made NOV so big was the fact it was the last 1 for 2010 and everyone who had missed or not come showed up. Case in point we had at least 2 new INGO members show up (evilblackrifle and MeAndMyXD). Plus we had guest of INGO members and some from IL.

Now why Winamac & not the others?
Well for starters I have been the one that have started the "poll for a date" and posted the official date as well as having to SPAM the entire NWI INGO social group (5 PMs at a time since that is the limit) so it takes me about 35 mins to send the message event for the poll thread and another 35 for the actual event to everyone. In addition I spam my post with it when I post along with other events in our area. As GOW stated I'm the cheerleader in PINK pushing the event along with the MEET & EAT.

Yes their have been other MEET & EATs done before by others but it appears that nothing on a consistence basis. Ours are currently once a quarter. We are due for one in DEC/JAN BTW.

Now back to why Winamac? It's the only range (public) I have gone to. I have heard all sorts of "bad" stories about the other ranges in our area (JP, Willow..) about unsafe handling, overcrowded, nazi ROs, etc and at Winamac as you can see we "owe" the range the day we go since we are so many.

Plus not sure if we can cook and smoke at the other ones. We have alos begun to form a relationship with the RO, are thinking of getting more involved with the range in 2011 as well.

For me personally it's a long drive at 1.5 hours but well worth it since I can shoot my long guns (can't at Deb's Gun Range), I get to eat "bad food" (I've been dieting/exercising for 1 year now and lost 30 lbs + 8 inches off the waist), and get to hang out with INGO friends I don't see any other time. To me it's more of a social event than shooting groups, etc..

We have appleseed (we brought it to NWI already) if you want to shoot like a pro. We have various other venues to competition shooting as well.

We could consider in 2011 trying one of the other ranges if the majority wants. I don't have an issue with that. I consider Winamac home even though it's far, far away.

But as this main post implies now is the time to bring up all the ideas for 2011. Change of venue being 1 of them is ok as well. Could we do what we have done at Winamac at other places?

 

[gunbunnies]

As Jediagh stated above, the intended goal of this meet and shoot event is to introduce new people to firearms, to try out stuff you may want to try out and haven't purchased as of yet, or can't purchase, and to allow fellow INGO members to come out and meet each other and enjoy something that is a common activity... This is a social event through and through.

It isn't a competition, a match, a training course, heck I don't even think I could consider it real target practice... I think we are clear on this...

To keep it as it is, we can't turn it into a military firing line and start throwing people out and barking at them as to what to do and not to do, it will not bring the INGO membership out, if I wanted to go to that I would go out to a training facility or one of the many ranges that are ran that way and use it appropriately.. In that notion we can't have a unsafe range, as that just ends up hurting or worst killing someone...

So, what I think I'm seeing from these posts is that we do need to have more table space where ever we may be... and we need a assigned RO which will watch and make comment as too safety issues while the meet is being conducted, not a control freak, but someone that will know what is unsafe, and in a educational voice let the individual that's committing the act know what he has done and why it is wrong. This would probally be our most important addition to the range useage and the event overall...

The use of a rifle on the pistol range really isn't that big of deal if we are mindful and safe in doing it... Matter of fact I use rifles on the 25 yard line when putting a new scope on them or playing with sights and loads as too make sure I'm not too far off in POI vs POA before moving too a longer range to actually use the rifle. I did bring the 30 carb, and the M1 Garand because some of the INGO membership wanted to shoot one, heck I even supplied all the ammo that was fired through the M1 for my fellow INGOer's to get a chance to fire a piece of history. I didn't think it would be safe or appropiate for me too leave a couple of handguns and rifles and a shotgun on the range area and go to the 50 or 100 yard range for someone to just get the feel of firing the old war horse, so I let them fire it on the 25 yard line where I could keep control over the other stuff I had out for others to shoot also...

The shotgun is a natural at the 25 yard line as if your sighting in for deer season, you will probally be shooting your deer at 40 yards and in too make sure it isn't another hunter or animal and that your tags are matching what your shooting anyways, plus if your shooting a pattern with bird shot and your shooting at a board any further than 40 yards you aren't going to get a pattern, more like a donut hole all over the barn, so the closer range is really more within the shotgun's intended use... I know if you can learn your shotty and your using slug it will perform fairly well out to the 225 yard range distances but really for the most part it's a close range weapon affair for most..

Pistol and pistol carbine's belong on the 25 and 50 yard ranges although can perform very well on the longer ranges if the shooter is up to the task.

I think for our use the Winamac range is pretty good, although we would probally get more range area available at JP, but we would have to clear to use a section of the parking lot for cooking and conversation. Also JP does suffer from no wind guard, and wind is a problem, along with no shade in the hot summer sun, but the heat doesn't bother me so just say the word and I can talk to the RO there and see if we can hold one there. The RO's both know me by first name and I'm pretty sure they would allow us out there once as a trial if that's the way you guy's want to go... Although again I think the Winamac range is better suited to this social event we hold...

Also one other note, I didn't see anyone handling loaded firearms while others were down range, and I did not see anyone sweeping or turning back towards the crowd of people with loaded firearms either. I was very attentive to what was going on around me, although again I was on the firing line most of the event and not back in the crowd. I am very careful with firearms in general and to the ripe old age I am at now have not had any AD's on a range or in day to day carry while on the job or not. With this said from what I experienced at the range the other day I was not in any way scared for my life from my fellow INGOer's....

Look forward to the March 2011 shoot....

 

[2cool9031]

When all is decided, please post all the rules so I can decide if I want to attend again.
Getting together for a shoot was a great idea....but now it seems to be getting to big to handle.

 

[turnandshoot4]

First of all Mike (Andrea, Mikea, catmanjoea, and all of his other names) has always been opposed to JP. He is 7 minutes away from the Winimac range, who wouldn't be opposed to somewhere else?

Jedi, you have done a great job getting everyone together, spamming people, and general organization of all of this. Much of this wouldn't have happened without you.

"Now back to why Winamac? It's the only range (public) I have gone to. I have heard all sorts of "bad" stories about the other ranges in our area (JP, Willow..) about unsafe handling, overcrowded, nazi ROs, etc."

There are bad stories about any range. I personall HATE Kingsbury because I'm being babysat and Willow Slough for the same reason.

JP can get crowded. The RO at JP will not allow anyone to place anything but paper down range. Same as Winimac now I'm sure.

"and at Winamac as you can see we "owe" the range the day we go since we are so many"

What I am saying is that JP we will not "own" the range. It is large enough to have everyone there plus some. Set the grill up in the parking lot that is 20 times bigger than Winimac.

 

[jedi]

When all is decided, please send me a copy of the rules so I can decide if I want to attend again.

Thanks

Don't worry as long as you are on the NWI INGO social group I will SPAM you when the next event occurs.

In terms of rules. Hum... more like a set of guidelines I think is what we might end up with. Although right now I'm looking at it more of moving it to the 50 yard range and the "hand gunners" will most likely move to the 25 yard range.

The concern I see some may have as GB stated is leaving your gear at one range while you are at another. Case in point I left my 1911, Ruger Mark 3, SG, AK, and 2 10/22 at the 25 entire time while I walked over to the 50 yard to shoot turnandshoots "man rifles". I did not think anything of it. But then again I guess I trust ya and besides I have "common" guns unlike some of the others that have historical guns. Then again GOW left his .22 walter along with the others on a bench for all to use as well.

But keep the ideas and comments flowing. Perhaps at our DEC/JAN MEET & EAT we can have a discussion about what we want to see in 2011. First and foremost I do think GB is correct it is a SOCIAL event and most likely always will be. Training we have lots of other venues in the area for.

 

[2cool9031]

First of all Mike (Andrea, Mikea, catmanjoea, and all of his other names) has always been opposed to JP. He is 7 minutes away from the Winimac range, who wouldn't be opposed to somewhere else?

Jedi, you have done a great job getting everyone together, spamming people, and general organization of all of this. Much of this wouldn't have happened without you.

"Now back to why Winamac? It's the only range (public) I have gone to. I have heard all sorts of "bad" stories about the other ranges in our area (JP, Willow..) about unsafe handling, overcrowded, nazi ROs, etc."

There are bad stories about any range. I personall HATE Kingsbury because I'm being babysat and Willow Slough for the same reason.

JP can get crowded. The RO at JP will not allow anyone to place anything but paper down range. Same as Winimac now I'm sure.

"and at Winamac as you can see we "owe" the range the day we go since we are so many"

What I am saying is that JP we will not "own" the range. It is large enough to have everyone there plus some. Set the grill up in the parking lot that is 20 times bigger than Winimac.

The Halloween shoot of 2009 was at JP

 

[jedi]

JP can get crowded. The RO at JP will not allow anyone to place anything but paper down range. Same as Winimac now I'm sure.

Rest assure we are NOT taking the PVC stands again! Maybe if we have a small group with only handguns. Maybe. But for 2011 I don't see that happening. Perhaps some wooden T shape ones down the road. For the time being I'm not focused on that.

The side projects for Winamic are on other things.

"and at Winamac as you can see we "owe" the range the day we go since we are so many"

What I am saying is that JP we will not "own" the range. It is large enough to have everyone there plus some. Set the grill up in the parking lot that is 20 times bigger than Winimac.

Do you have a google maps ariel view of what JP looks like so we can get an idea of location setup and where it's at?

 

[2cool9031]

Jedi....just let me say you have been doing a great job! So good that I quit going because it was becoming too crowded

 

[gunbunnies]

Quote from Jediagh...

"The concern I see some may have as GB stated is leaving your gear at one range while you are at another. Case in point I left my 1911, Ruger Mark 3, SG, AK, and 2 10/22 at the 25 entire time while I walked over to the 50 yard to shoot turnandshoots "man rifles". I did not think anything of it. But then again I guess I trust ya and besides I have "common" guns unlike some of the others that have historical guns. Then again GOW left his .22 walter along with the others on a bench for all to use as well."

My concern wasn't if something would be taken, but that I brought these firearms to the range and I am responsible for what they do in whom evers hands they may be in. That was my concern as too leaving them on a range and going to the other one. If I felt that someone would take something then I wouldn't be attending these shoots at all...

 

[jedi]

Jedi....just let me say you have been doing a great job! So good that I quit going because it was becoming too crowded

Hum.. what they they call this? Over success?

Quote from Jediagh...

"The concern I see some may have as GB stated is leaving your gear at one range while you are at another. Case in point I left my 1911, Ruger Mark 3, SG, AK, and 2 10/22 at the 25 entire time while I walked over to the 50 yard to shoot turnandshoots "man rifles". I did not think anything of it. But then again I guess I trust ya and besides I have "common" guns unlike some of the others that have historical guns. Then again GOW left his .22 walter along with the others on a bench for all to use as well."

My concern wasn't if something would be taken, but that I brought these firearms to the range and I am responsible for what they do in whom evers hands they may be in. That was my concern as too leaving them on a range and going to the other one. If I felt that someone would take something then I wouldn't be attending these shoots at all...

"I read" guess I ask before I go picking up someone else's gun while their. Or in the case of CLIF/GOW I pick it up but ask for the magazine and if I can shoot it while I inform those 2.

Never crossed my mind that someone who just pick up my stuff to shoot without asking. Oh how naive me is.