open carry stopped by hobart pd while pumping gas

[Hoosierdood]

Just so we're clear. I'm right. State is wrong.

I like the cut of your jib.

 

[ATM]

When the state is wrong, it's dangerous to be right.


I like danger.

 

[dansgotguns]

Sooo where does it say they can "run" the ltch. How is showing the pink paper not enough?

 

[ArcadiaGP]

Sooo where does it say they can "run" the ltch. How is showing the pink paper not enough?

That's where he overstepped, and threw around his authority with unnecessary steps to show you "who's boss". That, or he just gets off on running IDs and papers. Extra steps that don't need to be done, aren't supposed to be done, but by golly he'll do 'em cause it rustles your jimmies.

That is all I needed to see to know he was an anti-gun officer. He didn't like you, he didn't like how you were carrying, so he drew out the encounter as much as he could just to assert his position over you.

Name me one bad guy that open-carried.

 

[dansgotguns]

What im getting from hoosierdads posts are it was ok for my ltch to be "ran". Am I reading incorrectly?

 

[Hoosierdood]

Sooo where does it say they can "run" the ltch. How is showing the pink paper not enough?

You won't find anywhere that says they can "run" your license. At the same time, you won't find anywhere that says they can't. They must do their due diligence to verify that your LTCH is valid. Anyone can print a real looking license on pink paper. And who is to say that you haven't done something to have your license repealed but you still carry the piece of paper.

 

[dansgotguns]

Thats their problem. If they want it differently they should tell thier legislatures. Law says I have to have a pink card, not that I have to have one and them go check it out. What's the point of the pink card if they are gonna run our papers....

 

[Roadie]

I stand corrected. Apparently I misunderstood a couple of the finer legal points.

 

[actaeon277]

Sorry but my post wasn't the one full of fail. You are comparing apples and oranges. Driving a car is not the same as carrying a gun. The courts have established that a LEO cannot randomly pull you over to check your papers. You have to be observed violating an ordinance first. It sure would be nice if they have that same courtesy to gun owners but they haven't. Apples and oranges.

In Indiana it is a crime to carry a handgun.
Whether you or I like it or not, the officer has every right to verify that we are properly licensed to carry a handgun. I never said I agree with it. And whether anyone likes it or not, OCing IS probable cause under the current law. (And I am an avid OCer)

Just so we're clear. I'm right. State is wrong.

Driving a car is not the same, because they say it is not the same. That is not the same as being "not the same".
It is illegal to drive a car in Indiana on public roads, unless you are licensed.
It is illegal to carry a gun in Indiana in public, unless you are licensed.
Some people driving cars kill people.
Some people with guns kill people.

I agree, that the court said it's ok.
I disagree.
I also agree, my disagreement means nothing. Or at least it means 1/330 millionth of something.

 

[88GT]

BTW, what would Fred have done it you had told him, "Screw you, I'm putting the bullets back in it right now. Want to watch me?"

i wonder this every time someone shares his "I was disarmed" story and it ends with the LEO telling them not to re-load until some later point in time.

 

[actaeon277]

Thats their problem. If they want it differently they should tell thier legislatures. Law says I have to have a pink card, not that I have to have one and them go check it out. What's the point of the pink card if they are gonna run our papers....

The point?
The same point as 75 percent of laws.
To become so burdensome, that you can't remember all of them, and will inadvertently break some.

 

[Trigger Time]

What a doofus. He needs to be retrained to modern standards. Or time for officer backwards hat to retire to the land of 'consulting'. Or whatever retired cops do to still feel in control.
State cop just had to come over and see if he could get his fix in too. But didn't really wanna do anything useful except the secret cop handshake. Bike cop hopefully doesn't learn from backwards hat cop.
good on you for recording it or this would just be another thread of cops calling you a liar and siding with the cops who coon fingered your gun wrongly and I believe illegally but hey I'm not a lawyer.
you pursue this as far as you can even if it's only filing formal complaints against all 3 officers. If state boy didn't want to be included then he shouldn't have walked over. To me that makes him officially part of the wrongdoing. File a complaint with state and Hobart. Good luck

 

[Jack Burton]

Please explain what caused the reasonable suspicion the officer must have had to have a need to "verify" the LTCH.

The OP handed it to the officer. That is the end of the story, or should be.

 

[Jack Burton]

the only way the jbt knows of verifying that the LTCH is valid is by running it (ie. calling it in) so jbt does have to "run it" so to speak.

The only need for the officer to "validate" the LTCH is if he has reason to believe that it is not valid. What was that reason?

 

[Jack Burton]

In Indiana it is a crime to carry a handgun.
Whether you or I like it or not, the officer has every right to verify that we are properly licensed to carry a handgun. I never said I agree with it. And whether anyone likes it or not, OCing IS probable cause under the current law. (And I am an avid OCer)

And once he saw the LTCH he just verified it unless he had a reasonable suspicion that the LTCH was not valid. Please tell us what that suspicion was.

 

[dansgotguns]

My thoughts exactly

 

[Cameramonkey]

personally, I find a cheap photocopy on pink paper suspicious now that I have my Utah permit. (not that its relevant)

And for the record, you dont have to carry your pink permission slip anymore. If you choose not to, you just have to either memorize your number and rattle it off to the officer to verify by calling it in, or be willing to hand over your drivers license for him to run as your pink is tied to your DL and provides all the confirmation "officer nervous hat" needs.

 

[Jack Burton]

How about this scenario... ?

As officer friendly is walking away with the firearm... the OP hollers out, "Hey, what about my backup gun... are you going to take that also?"

Now, that puts OF in a bad situation. He simply cannot continue to walk away with the excuse of "officer safety" being the reason he took the one gun. He HAS to take the other, theoretical, gun the OP has. However, the OP has no obligation to tell OF just where this supposed back up gun is. Which means that if OF attempts to search for it he is committing an illegal search since the OP has committed no crime, and this stop is not within a mile of being a qualified Terry stop. Since guns can really, really be "concealed" quite well his options are to force the OP to get nekkid in public for an illegal search... or to continue to walk away "knowing" that the OP still has a gun and can shoot him quite well with it.

This is really going to mess with his mind. And it couldn't happen to a better person.

 

[Redhorse]

Nope, Hoosierdood is correct.

The FAIL is on the part of our Indiana legislators for not repealing IC 35-47-2-24(a) which codifies that we may be presumed guilty and placing the burden of proof upon the licensee.

Exactly. Innocent until proven guilty not "carrying a firearm is a crime unless you can prove you're doing so lawfully."

 

[Redhorse]

I can't remember whose quote it was, but if the law is silent on whether or not the officer is allowed to run the OP's LTCH, then the officer is allowed to. Now I will admit that i am no legal expert but to me that works the same way as the law being silent on how a handgun can be carried, OC or CC.