Pistol caliber carbines

[ScouT6a]

I agree, oldpink. It's time that many of these crazy NFA rules are revisited. Many are not grounded in common sense.

 

[Hawkeye]

OK. So here's my question. And it really relates to the semi-auto PCC's or PCR's. Any preference for cartrige? I have generlaly seen them in 9mm, 40mm and 45ACP. I do nto currently have a 9 mm handgun, but do have a couple of .40 pistols and a .45 ACP Government model. I'm tempted to keep with the .45 ACP, but am also tempted by teh 9mm for relative cheapness of shooting. Thoughts?

FYI, I already have a Win 94 Trapper in .44 Mag and a Ruger 77/44 bolt gun.

 

[Grelber]

Also, shooting 9mm from a carbine-length barrel effectively turns the 9mm into a .357 Magnum.

Interesting concept. My first thought was , nope it won't make that much difference, but the USPSA open guys shoot 9mm major at 160-170 power factor, so if the pcc can handle the higher pressure it can be done. Maybe just finding the right slower burning powder would let you take advantage of the barrel length at normal 9mm pressure?

In any case, what are you guys seeing on the chrono without pushing the gun past the point where it is no longer a soft shooter?

 

[nipprdog]

Also, shooting 9mm from a carbine-length barrel effectively turns the 9mm into a .357 Magnum.

With factory loads, that generally only applies to lighter bullets. Some 147gr rounds will lose velocity out of carbine. Something to do with faster burning powders. I believe.

 

[oldpink]

With factory loads, that generally only applies to lighter bullets. Some 147gr rounds will lose velocity out of carbine. Something to do with faster burning powders. I believe.

Yeah, I oversimplified a bit on that.
I just flipped open my Lyman 48th Edition, and the fastest MV with the 125 grain Sierra JHP grain bullet out of a 4" pressure barrel uses a maximum (compressed) charge of 7.1 grains of Blue Dot is 1163 FPS, while the exact same bullet and powder charge out of the 16.5" barrel of the Ruger PC9 Carbine is 1270 FPS.
Obviously, most people would be disappointed to get anything below 1400 FPS with a 125 grain bullet out of .357 Magnum, so it would probably be more accurate to say that the longer barrel bumps up the MV enough to just about split the difference between 9mm and .357 Magnum.
By contrast, my Ruger Blackhawk .45 Colt launches a 225 grain bullet with a max charge of H110 at between 1200 and 1300 FPS, but the same load out of my Marlin 1894 moves along at 1882 FPS; so the much greater case capacity of the big Colt round vs. 9mm Luger makes a huge difference.

 

[dbrier]

If someone would make an inexpensive bullpup 9mm PCC. It would offset the size since all it would need is overall length requirement and it would retain a close handling of an SBR while still being useful. And when I meant inexpensive, I mean just that. The Tavor and X95 are cool, but those are really pricey guns and even more so to convert to 9mm.

A friend just picked one of these up this summer.
JARD J67 ? JARD, Inc.

 

[ars]

The high point is truly an awesome carbine. Mine is in 40 cal and has never misfed or malfunctioned in any manner.

 

[ScouT6a]

Grelber, I load a lot of 125 grain 9mm bullets in front of Herco because I have a lot of it that I bought cheap, years ago. I am pushing them out around 1075 fps from my 4" CZ and around 1125 fps from my 5" Beretta.
With my 10.5" 9mm PCC, the numbers on the chronograph, show between a 200-225 fps gain.

 

[NyleRN]

I think I'll just build an AR9. I'm torn between an 11" barreled pistol or a 16" carbine.

 

[ScouT6a]

Build it as a pistol, first.

 

[ScouT6a]

OK. So here's my question. And it really relates to the semi-auto PCC's or PCR's. Any preference for cartrige? I have generlaly seen them in 9mm, 40mm and 45ACP. I do nto currently have a 9 mm handgun, but do have a couple of .40 pistols and a .45 ACP Government model. I'm tempted to keep with the .45 ACP, but am also tempted by teh 9mm for relative cheapness of shooting. Thoughts?

FYI, I already have a Win 94 Trapper in .44 Mag and a Ruger 77/44 bolt gun.

Hawkeye,
Obviously, a huge draw for PCC, for many, has been the advantages of owning a pistol /carbine in the same caliber. If you don't reload, the 9mm would be the cheapest route. If you do reload, I'd stick with a caliber you already shoot/load for.

 

[Grelber]

Grelber, I load a lot of 125 grain 9mm bullets in front of Herco because I have a lot of it that I bought cheap, years ago. I am pushing them out around 1075 fps from my 4" CZ and around 1125 fps from my 5" Beretta.
With my 10.5" 9mm PCC, the numbers on the chronograph, show between a 200-225 fps gain.

I am warmer on the idea of pcc for home self defense as well as just a range toy. Thanks all.

Like me a lot of folks I am waiting to jump when I find what looks like ar15 quality at ar15 prices.

 

[ScouT6a]

I didn't want to pay an inflated price, so I built my own.

 

[DanVoils]

I recently built a 9mm AR that uses Glock 17 mags. No complaints at all. Check out www.apachearmaments.com at the next 1500. They had everything I needed for a great price. I'll get some pics of it later and post them.
Dan

 

[KJQ6945]

I am warmer on the idea of pcc for home self defense as well as just a range toy. Thanks all.

Like me a lot of folks I am waiting to jump when I find what looks like ar15 quality at ar15 prices.

The problem with PCCs, as I see it, you have the $500 dollar stuff, that is adequate. The cool stuff starts at about $1500.

There needs to be some middle ground.

 

[chezuki]

The problem with PCCs, as I see it, you have the $500 dollar stuff, that is adequate. The cool stuff starts at about $1500.

There needs to be some middle ground.

Scorpion is right at $1k. But it will likely be $1500+ by the time it's the right length.

 

[NyleRN]

Scorpion is right at $1k. But it will likely be $1500+ by the time it's the right length.

Are you having any issues with the feed lips breaking off on your scorpion mags?

 

[Grelber]

I recently built a 9mm AR that uses Glock 17 mags. No complaints at all. Check out www.apachearmaments.com at the next 1500. They had everything I needed for a great price. I'll get some pics of it later and post them.
Dan

Hurry up.

 

[Sling10mm]

Still expensive. I'm talking about something so dead simple but still functional and cheap like if Kel-tec or Beretta made a bullpup of their PCCs and kept the prices about the same.

While not technically a bullpup, the Beretta CX4 is still reasonably compact. I regret getting rid of mine, but I believe they sell in the $700-800 range if I'm not mistaken, and use fairly readily available Beretta 92 mags.

 

[chezuki]

No. That was the first batch. The current production mags are profiled differently at the lip. More material