Rayshard Brooks Shooting in Atlanta

[Clay Pigeon]

What's the intent? To use it to gain compliance for a lawful arrest or to use it during the commission of a forcible felony? Big difference.

Thats a interesting question, the answer probably will not be answered for a while.... But do we know if was used in this case?
I haven't heard or read if it was, or if it was the taser that already had launched its pins????........
Is it a forcibly felony in Georgia to point a taser at someone including a LEO?

 

[Denny347]

Do I understand though that Tazer cartridges are a one and done until replaced or then used for a dry stun? Tasers, like a bean bag round or rubber projectile is LESS lethal and not NONLETHAL correct?
Do tazer holsters have multiple levels of retention such as a level 3 retention holster?

Depends on the model. The X26P is a "one and done" The Taser X2 and Taser 7 can fire twice before needing a fresh cartridge. Typical Taser holsters like the Blackhawk are level 1.

 

[Denny347]

Thats a interesting question, the answer probably will not be answered for a while.... But do we know if was used in this case?
I haven't heard or read if it was, or if it was the taser that already had launched its pins????........

That really doesn't matter. What matters is what the officer reasonably believed at the time he pulled the trigger.

Is it a forcibly felony in Georgia to point a taser at someone including a LEO?

I have no idea. I do well just to keep up with Indiana law. Quite frankly, I don't really even care. I have enough here to keep me busy for awhile...

 

[Denny347]

I just watched the body cam footage for the first time. At the end, when the body camera is facing the sky, you can hear the distinct sound of a Taser cartridge a split second before the handgun shots. A Taser was fired immediately before gunfire.

 

[Denny347]

Looking closely, it looks like the DUI officer was carrying a yellow Taser X2 in a standard thumb break holster (level 1 at best). Not sure THAT was the same Taser that the suspect grabbed.

 

[Clay Pigeon]

That really doesn't matter. What matters is what the officer reasonably believed at the time he pulled the trigger.


I have no idea. I do well just to keep up with Indiana law. Quite frankly, I don't really even care. I have enough here to keep me busy for awhile...

Thank you.

 

[KJQ6945]

I predict this officer will retire a millionaire, right after his lawsuit.


The two rookies from Minneapolis will retire as millionaires also.

The media will fan the flames, and the riots will be epic. Probably prevent Trumps third term.

 

[phylodog]

HOWEVER, this is yet another example of police officers being forced to go to guns because they lacked the empty-handed skills to subdue and arrest someone. Legally okay, but the shooting shouldn't have happened because things shouldn't have been allowed to get to that point. These two cops weren't capable of winning a fight against a drunk. We need to be able to look past the justified/unjustified binary and consider what lessons could be learned about how to avoid an event like this. He should have been on the ground within three seconds of trying to pull away from the police. That doesn't mean the officers deserve harsh reprimand, but they shot because they failed at everything except the gun.

You sure about that? Have any evidence to support your assumption?

Might it be possible that with all of the armchair quarterbacking and bull**** going on that officers these days might just be a little hesitant to use any kind of appropriate force and instead are trying to handle everyone with kid gloves for fear of being the next victim of our SJW - crybaby society? Maybe you're right but that video doesn't tell a complete story, they never do.

I couldn't be more happy about being retired from what has become an unbearable profession and if I wasn't you can bet your ass I wouldn't be doing a damned thing but sitting in my car. Society is going to get the police force it wants before long and once that happens socialism is gonna look like the best thing since sliced bread to everyone incapable or unwilling to provide for their own safety and security.

 

[phylodog]

And that brings it back to my original question..... Remember tasers have been touted a long time as a non lethal alternative...

Negative. They are a less lethal alternative, words matter.

If I'm working and someone attempts to shoot me with a Taser I'm going to shoot them and it is going to be a good shoot. The law isn't set up so that the police must present a fair fight against criminals, it isn't the UFC.

Should you care to educate yourself as far as your statement about shooting the suspect in the back you might find the literature and studies from the Force Science Institute of interest. Time is a funny thing.

 

[phylodog]

I agree, its either one or the other. And if its lethal why are lots of folks learning, qualifying and shooting for practice each other with lethal weapons.....
One would think it would have been worked out in the courts long ago...

Its interesting that in the 90's tasers were introduced to Law Enforcement to use as a alternative to Deadly Force.

Typically, police officers, corrections officers or anyone else attending legitimate Taser training aren't going to be jacked up on cocaine, meth or anything that is usually a significant contributing factor to the very rare occurrence of someone dying after being hit by a Taser. I've been Tased 10-12 times in training and once while working.

 

[Clay Pigeon]

Negative. They are a less lethal alternative, words matter.

If I'm working and someone attempts to shoot me with a Taser I'm going to shoot them and it is going to be a good shoot. The law isn't set up so that the police must present a fair fight against criminals, it isn't the UFC.

Should you care to educate yourself as far as your statement about shooting the suspect in the back you might find the literature and studies from the Force Science Institute of interest. Time is a funny thing.

Do you ever think why you are so angry in some of the threads here when people have questions or have their own opinions?
Maybe it would work better for you if the two officers just stomped him in the parking lot in the beginning.. Keep the family tradition going..

This is a discussion forum... Too much agreement kills the chat...

 

[Clay Pigeon]

Typically, police officers, corrections officers or anyone else attending legitimate Taser training aren't going to be jacked up on cocaine, meth or anything that is usually a significant contributing factor to the very rare occurrence of someone dying after being hit by a Taser. I've been Tased 10-12 times in training and once while working.

So what you are telling me is a taser is non lethal, then why is it ok with YOU to shoot someone pointing a taser at you?

 

[Route 45]

So what you are telling me is a taser is non lethal, then why is it ok with YOU to shoot someone pointing a taser at you?

Just posted this in another thread, but it fits here:

It's neither. It is less lethal. Generally not lethal if used correctly, but can be lethal depending on the suspect's health status or its application. (ie: multiple cycles)

A baton is not a lethal weapon, unless you hit somebody over the head repeatedly with it. If an officer uses a baton when it is called for as an appropriate use of force, that's fine. If a suspect takes the baton and tries to strike the officer over the head, he legitimately deserves hollowpoints.

It's about the totality of the circumstances, not a simple "If A is A, then B is B" equation. This may require more thought than some people are used to.

 

[phylodog]

Do you ever think why you are so angry in some of the threads here when people have questions or have their own opinions?
Maybe it would work better for you if the two officers just stomped him in the parking lot in the beginning.. Keep the family tradition going..

This is a discussion forum... Too much agreement kills the chat...

I'm sorry, did I miss a question you asked? I thought I read opinions you'd posted. I'm angry because I put up with this kind of **** for almost 20 years and it seems people will never stop assuming they know things they simply do not.

I'm all about answering questions when they're asked of me. I'll also be happy to dispel bull**** when I see it.

 

[phylodog]

So what you are telling me is a taser is non lethal, then why is it ok with YOU to shoot someone pointing a taser at you?

Nope, still not non lethal. They are less lethal.

In most agencies officers are not restricted to using the same level of force a suspect is using to escape or attack the officer, they can go higher. The next step above less lethal force is lethal force.

Someone attempting to incapacitate anyone, especially if they are carrying a weapon which could be used against them, would be justifying in using deadly force in this situation.

 

[ziggy]

Thanks to all who posted. An interesting discussion.
I used to referee youth soccer. I'd tell the kids, "The referee is not always right but the referee is always the referee." It seems to me to me
the same goes for LEO's. They are not always right but they are always law enforcement and physical resistance will always go south. I'm happy none of the kids I coached and refereed for came to play drunk or high on drugs. Life is a lot simpler that way.

 

[Route 45]

Do you ever think why you are so angry in some of the threads here when people have questions or have their own opinions?

Nobody gets angry about questions. Opinions based on zero practical experience are admittedly annoying, but luckily, worth exactly what was paid for them.

Maybe it would work better for you if the two officers just stomped him in the parking lot in the beginning.. Keep the family tradition going..

Now you're talking! Thanks for keeping up the peanut gallery tradition!

 

[sheepdog697]

It doesn’t matter what we might think. From now until a democrat takes over the presidency, every interaction that involves this particular racial combination that has similar results will be blown up all over the news until the next one happens.

Yep. Yep. And yep.

 

[Hatin Since 87]

Thanks to all who posted. An interesting discussion.
I used to referee youth soccer. I'd tell the kids, "The referee is not always right but the referee is always the referee." It seems to me to me
the same goes for LEO's. They are not always right but they are always law enforcement and physical resistance will always go south. I'm happy none of the kids I coached and refereed for came to play drunk or high on drugs. Life is a lot simpler that way.

Ya I’ve never had a negative run in with LEO. But i also try my best to make them feel at ease when approaching me. The safer they feel the safer I’ll feel. Then again, even if I was being put in cuffs and feel I shouldn’t be, I’m not going to debate on the side of the road and fight them. That’s what courts are for.

 

[Clay Pigeon]

Nobody gets angry about questions. Opinions based on zero practical experience are admittedly annoying, but luckily, worth exactly what was paid for them.
Now you're talking! Thanks for keeping up the peanut gallery tradition!

I'm amazed you fit so much irony in that small box.....



Edit,
How about we have the same rules of engagement at home we have when we are on a combat deployment.....