So I guess all the "Russia!" stuff was projection

[churchmouse]

There isn't an elected official in Washington, D.C. that has not committed a crime. I firmly believe this. The Trump administration isn't acting as a proxy for an enemy nation. They are simply acting outside of the accepted norms for the two sides of one coin. The real decision makers in our government, the big banks, the upper level bureaucracy, the permanent intelligence apparatus, the elected lapdogs, etc. and their media mouthpieces are going to ensure this populist elected president gets nowhere. The people spoke loud and clear of their dissatisfaction with the status quo of greed and corruption and now the swamp is rising up to protect itself. Trump has a few of the necessary qualities for this task but not enough of them and he is most certainly not politically savvy enough to win. He will eventually be replaced by someone from within the fold and it doesn't really matter what letter is next to their name. We will be back on the path to a totalitarian socialist/communist regime that all of these players so desperately want.

Pretty much covers things as they exist right now. We have been complacent far to long. The roots run to deep to kill.

 

[T.Lex]

There isn't an elected official in Washington, D.C. that has not committed a crime. I firmly believe this. The Trump administration isn't acting as a proxy for an enemy nation. They are simply acting outside of the accepted norms for the two sides of one coin. The real decision makers in our government, the big banks, the upper level bureaucracy, the permanent intelligence apparatus, the elected lapdogs, etc. and their media mouthpieces are going to ensure this populist elected president gets nowhere. The people spoke loud and clear of their dissatisfaction with the status quo of greed and corruption and now the swamp is rising up to protect itself.

I'm sorry, BA, but I'm not following the logic.

Manafort was/is one of those lapdogs. It sounds like you would WANT a guy like that prosecuted. This can't really be the swamp rising up to protect itself, when Trump's special counsel is going after a guy who was a Trump insider.

 

[Brad69]

Manafort strikes me as a bad “used car” salesman ?

Whats the chances the Special Mueller finds the creepy Podesta guy at fault ?

 

[Birds Away]

I'm sorry, BA, but I'm not following the logic.

Manafort was/is one of those lapdogs. It sounds like you would WANT a guy like that prosecuted. This can't really be the swamp rising up to protect itself, when Trump's special counsel is going after a guy who was a Trump insider.

I have no issue with Manafort going down. From all reports he is just one of the swine on the periphery of the swamp feeding where he can. That he ended up somehow on the DJT team speaks volumes about Trump's standards, or lack thereof, in that area. I guess old bull****ters like to be surrounded by old bull****ters.
As for Mueller, I think DJT was talked into appointing him and now seriously regrets that decision. To me it seems clear that Mueller has an agenda and will not stop until he completes his assignment. My question is who, exactly, assigned it to him. You can bet it wasn't DJT.

 

[Kutnupe14]

I have no issue with Manafort going down. From all reports he is just one of the swine on the periphery of the swamp feeding where he can. That he ended up somehow on the DJT team speaks volumes about Trump's standards, or lack thereof, in that area. I guess old bull****ters like to be surrounded by old bull****ters.
As for Mueller, I think DJT was talked into appointing him and now seriously regrets that decision. To me it seems clear that Mueller has an agenda and will not stop until he completes his assignment. My question is who, exactly, assigned it to him. You can bet it wasn't DJT.

The buck stops at the president's desk. He wouldn't be in this fiasco if he hadn't fired Comey for Russ... I mean bean mean to Clinton. It's one of the worst political moves of ALL-TIME. Everything, and I mean EVERYTHING that has been exposed about his administration is self-inflicted.

 

[T.Lex]

I have no issue with Manafort going down. From all reports he is just one of the swine on the periphery of the swamp feeding where he can. That he ended up somehow on the DJT team speaks volumes about Trump's standards, or lack thereof, in that area. I guess old bull****ters like to be surrounded by old bull****ters.
As for Mueller, I think DJT was talked into appointing him and now seriously regrets that decision. To me it seems clear that Mueller has an agenda and will not stop until he completes his assignment. My question is who, exactly, assigned it to him. You can bet it wasn't DJT.

At the most basic level, Mueller's assignment is the same as Ken Starr's was: figure out if there were criminal activities by someone politically connected.

Using your paradigm, if Trump's standards are in any way comparable to Manafort's, isn't this investigation a good thing?

 

[IndyDave1776]

The buck stops at the president's desk. He wouldn't be in this fiasco if he hadn't fired Comey for Russ... I mean bean mean to Clinton. It's one of the worst political moves of ALL-TIME. Everything, and I mean EVERYTHING that has been exposed about his administration is self-inflicted.

Yes, we know, firing incompetent crooks is always a bad plan.

 

[Kutnupe14]

Yes, we know, firing incompetent crooks is always a bad plan.

A stated personal opinion, devoid of the intimate knowledge needed to make such a claim, renders it little more than an emotional outburst based in frustration.

 

[Birds Away]

At the most basic level, Mueller's assignment is the same as Ken Starr's was: figure out if there were criminal activities by someone politically connected.

Using your paradigm, if Trump's standards are in any way comparable to Manafort's, isn't this investigation a good thing?

Sure. Again, I have no problem with the investigation. If there is criminality involved then let the chips fall where they may. My problem is two fold. One is that Mueller is just a hit man and he will continue to dig until he finds something, anything, that can be stuck on DJT. Okay, fine. Meanwhile during the last administration the WH used the powers of the federal government against their political enemies, the Secretary of State ran a pay for play scam and basically sold the influence of her office to the highest bidder. The Attorney General was found in contempt but, of course, not prosecuted for lying to Congress. Of course the national media is silent about all of that corruption while they beat the hell out of even the slightest misstep from this WH. The people who voted for Trump didn't vote for him at all. They voted against this endless corruption and registered their contempt for the same old, same old. You want to hang Trump from the nearest lamppost? Knock yourself out. What you're actually doing is further inflaming the people who realize this is a rigged game and they, the people, will always be the losers. The media has successfully indoctrinated or distracted a good percentage of the people. But the rest are paying attention.

 

[IndyDave1776]

A stated personal opinion, devoid of the intimate knowledge needed to make such a claim, renders it little more than an emotional outburst based in frustration.

I seem to recall Comey saying that Hillary didn't lie, she just said some things that weren't true (never mind destroying evidence at the same time). For someone to say such a thing, he is either crooked or too stupid to live. Given his lengthy background with the Clintons, I am betting on the former.

 

[Birds Away]

A stated personal opinion, devoid of the intimate knowledge needed to make such a claim, renders it little more than an emotional outburst based in frustration.

Well he's on your team so we wouldn't expect an objective look at it.

 

[IndyDave1776]

Sure. Again, I have no problem with the investigation. If there is criminality involved then let the chips fall where they may. My problem is two fold. One is that Mueller is just a hit man and he will continue to dig until he finds something, anything, that can be stuck on DJT. Okay, fine. Meanwhile during the last administration the WH used the powers of the federal government against their political enemies, the Secretary of State ran a pay for play scam and basically sold the influence of her office to the highest bidder. The Attorney General was found in contempt but, of course, not prosecuted for lying to Congress. Of course the national media is silent about all of that corruption while they beat the hell out of even the slightest misstep from this WH. The people who voted for Trump didn't vote for him at all. They voted against this endless corruption and registered their contempt for the same old, same old. You want to hang Trump from the nearest lamppost? Knock yourself out. What you're actually doing is further inflaming the people who realize this is a rigged game and they, the people, will always be the losers. The media has successfully indoctrinated or distracted a good percentage of the people. But the rest are paying attention.

Exactly. And if this is all that winning an election gets us, well, we may be down to alternatives prohibited for discussion on INGO.

 

[Birds Away]

The buck stops at the president's desk. He wouldn't be in this fiasco if he hadn't fired Comey for Russ... I mean bean mean to Clinton. It's one of the worst political moves of ALL-TIME. Everything, and I mean EVERYTHING that has been exposed about his administration is self-inflicted.

Yes, Trump is the devil incarnate. We got it, thanks.

 

[T.Lex]

Sure. Again, I have no problem with the investigation. If there is criminality involved then let the chips fall where they may. My problem is two fold. One is that Mueller is just a hit man and he will continue to dig until he finds something, anything, that can be stuck on DJT. Okay, fine. Meanwhile during the last administration the WH used the powers of the federal government against their political enemies, the Secretary of State ran a pay for play scam and basically sold the influence of her office to the highest bidder. The Attorney General was found in contempt but, of course, not prosecuted for lying to Congress. Of course the national media is silent about all of that corruption while they beat the hell out of even the slightest misstep from this WH. The people who voted for Trump didn't vote for him at all. They voted against this endless corruption and registered their contempt for the same old, same old. You want to hang Trump from the nearest lamppost? Knock yourself out. What you're actually doing is further inflaming the people who realize this is a rigged game and they, the people, will always be the losers. The media has successfully indoctrinated or distracted a good percentage of the people. But the rest are paying attention.

Paying attention to what? Actual prosecution of actual wrongdoing? If anything, the rule of law is being supported in this endeavor.

Why should Mueller NOT try to find evidence of criminal wrongdoing by DJT? If he committed crimes, he should be prosecuted. If he didn't, he shouldn't. Just like Clinton. The husband. Well, that might not narrow it down much, either, but you get the idea.

Is a witch hunt a bad thing if actual witches are found?

Tell you what, there's some speculation that some of the institutions involved with Manafort are also connected to Clinton. The whole thing, as noted often, is incestuous. So, this isn't necessarily a partisan thing at all.

 

[Birds Away]

Paying attention to what? Actual prosecution of actual wrongdoing? If anything, the rule of law is being supported in this endeavor.

Why should Mueller NOT try to find evidence of criminal wrongdoing by DJT? If he committed crimes, he should be prosecuted. If he didn't, he shouldn't. Just like Clinton. The husband. Well, that might not narrow it down much, either, but you get the idea.

Is a witch hunt a bad thing if actual witches are found?

Tell you what, there's some speculation that some of the institutions involved with Manafort are also connected to Clinton. The whole thing, as noted often, is incestuous. So, this isn't necessarily a partisan thing at all.

Again, where did I say the investigation was a bad thing? I also said that every politician in Washington (and elsewhere, certainly) is guilty of a crime at some level. If you dug deep enough you could probably find something on every one of them. What is infuriating is watching one team skate free time after time after time while the media provides cover. While on the other hand the entire government apparatus is energized to move mountains to find any iota of wrongdoing on the other team. I personally think Trump is a pretty reprehensible human being and I certainly don't admire him. However, when juxtaposed with his predecessor and that predecessor's accomplices the only real difference I see is that Trump lacks polish, style and a media machine to cover his tracks.

 

[IndyDave1776]

Paying attention to what? Actual prosecution of actual wrongdoing? If anything, the rule of law is being supported in this endeavor.

Why should Mueller NOT try to find evidence of criminal wrongdoing by DJT? If he committed crimes, he should be prosecuted. If he didn't, he shouldn't. Just like Clinton. The husband. Well, that might not narrow it down much, either, but you get the idea.

Is a witch hunt a bad thing if actual witches are found?

Tell you what, there's some speculation that some of the institutions involved with Manafort are also connected to Clinton. The whole thing, as noted often, is incestuous. So, this isn't necessarily a partisan thing at all.

It isn't a problem with the rule of law, but rather the selective application thereof. After decades of wrong-doing from the swamp, apparently including Mueller personally, it gets tiresome when Mueller is willing to search for something, anything, even if it is that Trump kicked a puppy dog when he was 13.

 

[1DOWN4UP]

I am still going to assume that this is DJTs best chess game.Mueller left the FBI in '12 or '13 I am going to assume because of the internal corruption.I assume he was tired of looking the other way for Holders/Clinton/Obama BS......on and on and on then they got Comey who continued to cover it up..He was the longest serving director this side of Hoover.He has to know who the big rats are.I am still thinking Trump has set this thing investigation in place for a reason.JMO

 

[Birds Away]

The rule of law is meaningless if it isn't equally applied.

 

[Birds Away]

Mueller is running amok

 

[1DOWN4UP]

The rule of law is meaningless if it isn't equally applied.

this^