The 1911 is a one bad guy gun in a two bad guy world>

[lovemachine]

Not quite.

Doesn't even have a beard!

 

[bwframe]

Active shooters, terrorism, gangs, possibly with long guns. I've gone the direction of more rounds before reload and more on the belt. It may take a few more rounds to get to my long gun.

 

[VERT]

Active shooters, terrorism, gangs, possibly with long guns. I've gone the direction of more rounds before reload and more on the belt.

Yeah but you probably do crazy things like carry lights, knives, tourniquets or even a second gun. I even heard you gave up 1911s. Why should we listen to you?

 

[bwframe]

Yeah but you probably do crazy things like carry lights, knives, tourniquets or even a second gun. I even heard you gave up 1911s. Why should we listen to you?

I wouldn't listen to me. Might listen to him though...

 

[LostWander]

But somehow...I just can't NOT want a 1911. May not carry it ever, or would sparingly, but you can't deny that gun has an eternal bit of class

 

[Leo]

Para ordinance makes a wide body in .45 acp that holds 14 and a .40S&W, that holds 16. If a man is a natural with a 1911, he can have a few extra rounds.

 

[churchmouse]

Para ordinance makes a wide body in .45 acp that holds 14 and a .40S&W, that holds 16. If a man is a natural with a 1911, he can have a few extra rounds.

Owned a few Para's when they were OK built pieces.
The newer ones were terrible.

 

[bwframe]

But somehow...I just can't NOT want a 1911. May not carry it ever, or would sparingly, but you can't deny that gun has an eternal bit of class

I got a couple to c-c-c-c-c-clean up and list in the classifieds soon. Keep an eye out. Good deals...

 

[SSGSAD]

Nancy Pelosi. Thanks. I didn't have quite enough coffee on my tee shirt and all up in my sinuses.

If you didn't get it on your screen, and keyboard, you're not doing it RIGHT !!!!!

 

[88E30M50]

Not quite.

Looks like someone that recently shaved. I'm sure that there was a beard and man-bun there just before the photo was taken.

 

[Leo]

Owned a few Para's when they were OK built pieces.
The newer ones were terrible.

I didn't have any experience with the new ones. Like pretty much everything in my life, mine are old. Both are the higher tier "Limited" models. Both have been great shooters right out of the box. The 16.40 Limited was a games gun and spent its life hammering boxes and boxes of ammo as fast as possible. It is well worn but continues to be a dependable. The 14.45 was better cared for but has had no problems.

 

[churchmouse]

I didn't have any experience with the new ones. Like pretty much everything in my life, mine are old. Both are the higher tier "Limited" models. Both have been great shooters right out of the box. The 16.40 Limited was a games gun and spent its life hammering boxes and boxes of ammo as fast as possible. It is well worn but continues to be a dependable. The 14.45 was better cared for but has had no problems.

Had 3 all in .45 ACP (surprise) that were early 90's built.
The P-12 ran through well north of 10K before the recoil spring plug launched down range. Fitting a reverse plug fixed that issue.
The stainless Limited was really a flawless runner. Friend has it now and he beats it.
The P-14 was also a good piece.

We went totally single stack 1911's.

 

[Expat]

So we are all in agreement that the 1911 doesn't have enough firepower so we need to carry a G43 or Shield.

 

[churchmouse]

So we are all in agreement that the 1911 doesn't have enough firepower so we need to carry a G43 or Shield.

"NO"

Carry what you like.

 

[rhino]

No one can predict how many rounds it will take to stop an attacker.

Nothing you can hold in your hands is guaranteed to stop a human with one shot.

If an attacker is stopped immediately by a gunshot and it's not a hit to the central nervous system (the spine and some parts of the brain), then it's most likely a psychological stop. It takes a lot longer than most people realize to incapacitate a human via blood pressure drop.

The difference in terminal effects on a human among modern JHP 9mm, .40S&W, and .45ACP are negligible. Autopsy results and research by people like Gary Roberts confirm this. Handguns are puny.

Shot placement is vitally important, but:

• Most people overestimate their marksmanship abilities, especially under the kind of stress they probably have never experienced.
• Anyone can miss.
• Unless you hit and damage the medulla oblongata, there are no guaranteed "one shot stops" regardless of caliber. Most people don't know what the medulla is. Fewer still know where it's located, especially at different angles. Fewer still can hit a target that small on a moving adversary, especially if they have to get past skull.
• Just because someone is dying due to bullets wounds doesn't mean they do not have plenty of time and ability to kill you as well.

 

[lovemachine]

1. I carry a 9mm because it's cheap, and I want a caliber that my wife can shoot as well.
2. I carry a Glock because it's the superior platform. .
3. I need to train more. Seriously, my training is really lacking. I miss, and it's a lot.

So, for me, I want a carry gun that gives me every advantage to survive. I'd rather have more rounds. I highly doubt I'd encounter more than one threat. My concern is getting accurate hits under stress. Even if I trained more than I do now, I doubt I'll be as accurate. So, I want more rounds to bring the threat down.

 

[88E30M50]

No one can predict how many rounds it will take to stop an attacker.

Nothing you can hold in your hands is guaranteed to stop a human with one shot.

If an attacker is stopped immediately by a gunshot and it's not a hit to the central nervous system (the spine and some parts of the brain), then it's most likely a psychological stop. It takes a lot longer than most people realize to incapacitate a human via blood pressure drop.

The difference in terminal effects on a human among modern JHP 9mm, .40S&W, and .45ACP are negligible. Autopsy results and research by people like Gary Roberts confirm this. Handguns are puny.

Shot placement is vitally important, but:

• Most people overestimate their marksmanship abilities, especially under the kind of stress they probably have never experienced.
• Anyone can miss.
• Unless you hit and damage the medulla oblongata, there are no guaranteed "one shot stops" regardless of caliber. Most people don't know what the medulla is. Fewer still know where it's located, especially at different angles. Fewer still can hit a target that small on a moving adversary, especially if they have to get past skull.
• Just because someone is dying due to bullets wounds doesn't mean they do not have plenty of time and ability to kill you as well.

My personal beliefs are that there is a difference in calibers effectiveness. Autopsy reports can show how a person died, but they do little to show how much fight was left between the injury and the resulting death. It's usually impossible to know what the impact would have been of a different caliber based on the autopsy results. Would that nicked artery have been severed? Or, would that severed artery have just been nicked with a smaller caliber? I don't think that there's any way to know except that the volume of material that a bullet passes through increases with size and penetration. Calculate the total volume of a round's expansion and penetration and you'll see just how different some calibers are from others.

I highlighted the last sentence because that's really the key. How quickly can you stop the attack? Does caliber change that time? The answer is an individual one and depends on how well any platform is shot. I've taken to carry a 9mm lately because I believe I shoot it very well in a couple of select guns. Not because I think it has the same capability to damage, but because in the balance, it would work for me. There are tradeoffs that we have to make with handguns that include caliber, capacity and shootability of the platform. Where we end up is as individual decision as who we marry.

 

[88E30M50]

1. I carry a 9mm because it's cheap, and I want a caliber that my wife can shoot as well.
2. I carry a Glock because it's the superior platform. .
3. I need to train more. Seriously, my training is really lacking. I miss, and it's a lot.

So, for me, I want a carry gun that gives me every advantage to survive. I'd rather have more rounds. I highly doubt I'd encounter more than one threat. My concern is getting accurate hits under stress. Even if I trained more than I do now, I doubt I'll be as accurate. So, I want more rounds to bring the threat down.

Good to see that you stopped using the 'P' word to describe the Glock. Since CZ improved on perfection, Glocks can just claim to be superior to others but are no longer perfect.

 

[churchmouse]

My personal beliefs are that there is a difference in calibers effectiveness. Autopsy reports can show how a person died, but they do little to show how much fight was left between the injury and the resulting death. It's usually impossible to know what the impact would have been of a different caliber based on the autopsy results. Would that nicked artery have been severed? Or, would that severed artery have just been nicked with a smaller caliber? I don't think that there's any way to know except that the volume of material that a bullet passes through increases with size and penetration. Calculate the total volume of a round's expansion and penetration and you'll see just how different some calibers are from others.

I highlighted the last sentence because that's really the key. How quickly can you stop the attack? Does caliber change that time? The answer is an individual one and depends on how well any platform is shot. I've taken to carry a 9mm lately because I believe I shoot it very well in a couple of select guns. Not because I think it has the same capability to damage, but because in the balance, it would work for me. There are tradeoffs that we have to make with handguns that include caliber, capacity and shootability of the platform. Where we end up is as individual decision as who we marry.

Well said.

 

[lovemachine]

Good to see that you stopped using the 'P' word to describe the Glock. Since CZ improved on perfection, Glocks can just claim to be superior to others but are no longer perfect.

Lol. I want to shoot a CZ. And I'd still like to own a 1911. Actually, it would be nice to handle some as well.