The gun is ALWAYS loaded.

[Titanium_Frost]

Generally, illogical seems useless to me, but Rule #1 does help many (who I can only imagine must reconcile the illogical notion as a beneficial reminder).

It is redundant. Rules 2, 3 and 4 are action items. Rule 1, at most, is simply a general thought to lend extra significance to these 3 action items.
We could add another rule in front of it which reads: SERIOUSLY, PAY ATTENTION TO THIS NEXT ONE - YOU MIGHT BE WRONG.

That is exactly what I was trying to say.

 

[Zoub]

The gun is always loaded. The gun is ALWAYS loaded. Even if you just watched someone clear it, THE FREAKING GUN IS ALWAYS LOADED.

The Reindeer is in the Chimney.

Opps I thought this was like a secret code words and phrases thread.

 

[MTC]

Absolutely. I believe that we all want everyone to arrive at the same destination - safe gun handling .

Yes. Best left at that. KISS principle is good. Taking something apart and putting it back together is fine, too. Sometimes in the process of doing so, especially in written form, there is a chance of something getting crossed up.

Heck, you and I agree on so many things, this was a rather rare opportunity to just argue a bit.

Yes, much agreement. We can talk of such things - and more - at length one day in person. Although even when for a legitimate reason arguing is not pleasant for me, direct verbal communication is (IMO) still far superior to this medium.

 

[Smokepole]

Perhaps.



Most definitely.

IIIIIIII thought so.

 

[rugertoter]

I have always been told that the reason for each of the Four Rules is that for a gun to be used to cause negligent injury to someone or something, the violation of only one rule is insufficient. At least two must be broken to do that.

If the gun is always loaded, but never pointed in an unsafe direction, never with a finger in a position to pull the trigger, and always with a safe backstop, it will cause no injury.
If you remove that rule (#1), a hunter climbing a tree (up or down) could experience a discharge of his firearm by a twig (that is, not his finger) catching his trigger. Where's his safe direction? Up could be pointed at himself, down could be at a buddy.

A finger on the trigger isn't a problem as long as it's in a safe direction, right? Until your safe direction is no longer safe, by someone or something moving in front of your target.

Know your target and your backstop... Good thinking. These won't affect your firearm's ability to discharge, but they do address the possibility of unexpected/unwanted "targets" that could be hit by a ND.

I like the whole "belt and suspenders" idea. I told someone in a PM the other day, when I was asked about my preference for external safeties on a handgun, the same thing. *I* am the safety, but I neither rely totally on myself nor on the mechanical safety on my gun. Should it fail, my actions are still going to be safe. Should I slip in my obsessive awareness of my muzzle direction for a moment, I want the mechanical backup.
The same logic applies: If I have a gun on me that, fired, could have fatal effect, I want as many things between "safe" and ND as I can put there, without compromising my ability to use it as it was intended to be used. The only time I want to look down a gun barrel is when I have the gun disassembled. I won't even do it with a chamber flag in place, and I'm leery of doing it even with the gun apart... It just feels wrong to me. So far, that has stood me in good stead. Every day I break my personal record of consecutive days alive and unshot.

For those who don't like Rule #1, that's your choice. Some people don't like external safeties... that also is your choice, if you don't. I hope and pray that your choices do not ever come back and bite you by causing injury to anyone, including yourselves.

Blessings,
Bill

I agree with you 100%. Looking down the barrel of a gun, that is not disassembled, is like a pilot saying "hey, lets practice how to get out of a flat spin".

 

[Archbishop]

The only time I consider a gun unloaded is if it is disassembled in some where where it is impossible to fire. If I want to check the bore of a revolver, the cylinder is out and my finger is in the gap. A rifle, the bolt is out and my finger is in the receiver. A semiauto pistol, the barrel is out of the slide.

I know others have already said it, but this.....

 

[Archbishop]

Schrodinger's magazine?

I see what you did there.....

 

[Smokepole]

I agree with you 100%. Looking down the barrel of a gun, that is not disassembled, is like a pilot saying "hey, lets practice how to get out of a flat spin".

Interesting analogy. I like it.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Rule 1, at most, is simply a general thought to lend extra significance to these 3 action items.

Rule 1 was first. It was the only rule, general and action.

People continued to do "common sense", aka stupid things with guns and thus the Four Rules were born.

Read what happened at an Indiana gun shop today: https://www.indianagunowners.com/forums/general_firearms_discussion/173830-uh_oh_moment_today.html

 

[ATM]

Rule 1 was first. It was the only rule, general and action.

It obviously didn't work, people know that guns aren't always loaded.

People continued to do "common sense", aka stupid things with guns and thus the Four Rules were born.

They should have ditched that first one which didn't work and simply replaced it with the three more specific ones which do.

Read what happened at an Indiana gun shop today:

I'll guarantee you that the gun being loaded didn't prevented a ND.
It was following the other rules - the ones that actually prevent NDs.

Most people will never truly consider all guns loaded, that's a lost cause.

If they just follow those last three rules, it will be enough. They work.