Total abortion ban proposed in Indiana

[actaeon277]

I thought "hold a man accountable" was another way of saying... get married first.

 

[ghuns]

I thought "hold a man accountable" was another way of saying... get married first.

Nah, getting married is, "hold a man hostage".

 

[Thor]

Do the deed pay the feed. If you don't want to be responsible for the outcome of your actions put your wanker away until you are. That whole 'free love' thing turned out to be pretty expensive for everybody else not involved.

 

[NKBJ]

Decades ago there was a round sponge called a birth control pill. The girl was supposed to place the sponge on her left knee and hold it in place by crossing her right knee over it.

But this will all work out. We've had our latter day version of the roaring twenties. Next we'll have a nice depression and a nice world war and then people will get some values back. If the nation is still here. And that's up for grabs.

 

[ArcadiaGP]

Interesting NPR/PBS/Marist poll question with six-point scale on abortion views:

1. Any time in pregnancy - 18%
2. Only first two trimesters - 11%
3. Only the first trimester - 23%
4. Only rape/incest/mother - 29%
5. Only for life of mother - 9%
6. Never for any reason - 9%


I know you're not supposed to make it "black and white", but this would be about 47% against and 52% for, when you generalize it to reflect modern "accepted" ranges. Though the 1st trimester one could probably float a few percentages into the "against" category, in some circumstances.

 

[BugI02]

So 'the people' are always right (in aggregate). "Give us Barrabas"?

 

[Libertarian01]

Interesting NPR/PBS/Marist poll question with six-point scale on abortion views:

1. Any time in pregnancy - 18%
2. Only first two trimesters - 11%
3. Only the first trimester - 23%
4. Only rape/incest/mother - 29%
5. Only for life of mother - 9%
6. Never for any reason - 9%


I know you're not supposed to make it "black and white", but this would be about 47% against and 52% for, when you generalize it to reflect modern "accepted" ranges. Though the 1st trimester one could probably float a few percentages into the "against" category, in some circumstances.

This here is the problem with this issue. We are split as a nation, damn near down the middle. We will never, ever get consensus in the near or foreseeable future.

So how do we solve an issue that we cannot agree upon? The best way, in my opinion, would be to ignore the far ends because they will never be pleased unless it is exactly their way, and go with the huge middle.

That would boil it down to the first trimester, rape, or the life of the the mother. That will get 62% of the people on board. This is not a good way to do it, but pragmatically may be the "best" of many lousy solutions that most folks could live with.

C. Everett Koop was right when he said, (Paraphrasing here), "the problem with abortion is unwanted pregnancy. When we solve the unwanted pregnancy issue we won't have an abortion issue."

Regards,

Doug

 

[historian]

This here is the problem with this issue. We are split as a nation, damn near down the middle. We will never, ever get consensus in the near or foreseeable future.

So how do we solve an issue that we cannot agree upon? The best way, in my opinion, would be to ignore the far ends because they will never be pleased unless it is exactly their way, and go with the huge middle.

That would boil it down to the first trimester, rape, or the life of the the mother. That will get 62% of the people on board. This is not a good way to do it, but pragmatically may be the "best" of many lousy solutions that most folks could live with.

C. Everett Koop was right when he said, (Paraphrasing here), "the problem with abortion is unwanted pregnancy. When we solve the unwanted pregnancy issue we won't have an abortion issue."

Regards,

Doug

Or...Novel Idea here (that existed up until Roe), we let the states do what they want and give people in each state their own say without an overriding national rule.

 

[Libertarian01]

Or...Novel Idea here (that existed up until Roe), we let the states do what they want and give people in each state their own say without an overriding national rule.

This is a good point. Is your right to privacy (ie. what happens between you and your doctor) protected under the Constitution or not? If it is, then it should be incorporated into the states. If it is not, then each and every state may well decide.

However, the supreme court did decide that the right to privacy does exist under the Constitution in Griswold v Connecticut (1965) and referred to same in Roe v Wade, covered under the 9th Amendment.

So, are you arguing that your right to privacy does not exist under the Constitution and that only Indiana protects it? I believe that I should have the "right" to privacy protected no matter where I go in the USA.

Regards,

Doug

 

[jamil]

If abortion is a right to privacy issue, then Doctors should get to pay patients to blow them. Or I suppose the other way around.

Patients should get to pay doctors for whatever meds they want.

They should be able to conspire with patients to cheat insurance companies.

Of course that’s absurd. The right to privacy doesn’t give people the right to do illegal things with or without one’s own body.

 

[BugI02]

View attachment 77706

 

[ArcadiaGP]

Ted Cruz offers to team up with AOC to make birth control available over-the-counter

I mean, ignore that the GOP already tried to do this... but hey, if it causes some progress via actual bi-partisanship... Go for it.

I think Cruz is doing well taking advantage of her tenacity and ignorance on politics. If he offers her reasonable things like what they've started so far, and she's willing to do it... that's not a bad thing.

 

[hoosierdoc]

If abortion is a right to privacy issue, then Doctors should get to pay patients to blow them. Or I suppose the other way around.

Patients should get to pay doctors for whatever meds they want.

They should be able to conspire with patients to cheat insurance companies.

Of course that’s absurd. The right to privacy doesn’t give people the right to do illegal things with or without one’s own body.

right? the lawsuit suing to block a conscience clause saying docs can't refuse to do an abortion for religious reasons...

It's my body and I can force you to do to me whatever it is I want. I have freedom over my body, you are my slave.

 

[hoosierdoc]

Interesting NPR/PBS/Marist poll

4. Only rape/incest/mother - 29%

why not father too?

5. Only for life of mother - 9%

False answer. There is NEVER a reason to perform an "abortion" for the life of the mother. None. Never. Ectopic pregnancies can threaten mom's life, but there is a zero chance that pregnancy will result in a living child and may kill mom. Treating an ectopic is not an elective abortion.

 

[spec4]

Seeing what the lowlife politicians in Illinois are doing makes me wonder. What is it about Dems that they are so ecstatic about killing people? I know Stalin killed millions, is there a connection? Just idle thinking trying to figure out the liberal mentality.

 

[rvb]

False answer. There is NEVER a reason to perform an "abortion" for the life of the mother. None. Never. Ectopic pregnancies can threaten mom's life, but there is a zero chance that pregnancy will result in a living child and may kill mom. Treating an ectopic is not an elective abortion.

maybe Im not understanding what you are saying....
in my experience, wife had HELLP and at 26 weeks the only way she would have lived another few hours was for the baby to be removed, or so we were told by a couple of doctors. Fortunately 26 weeks was old enough that modern NICU practices were able to save the baby; a couple weeks earlier and he likely wouldn't have made it or had life-long disabilities. A consult recommended abortion and our OB said time to deliver....

I'm in the #5 camp.... not because it's "ok" but because in life or death situations I don't think you should criminalize the very hard choices that have to be made in those scenarios, and I was oh-so-close to being in that scenario.

So either I'm mis-understanding your post or we were misled at the time by Drs...

-rvb

 

[ATOMonkey]

maybe Im not understanding what you are saying....
in my experience, wife had HELLP and at 26 weeks the only way she would have lived another few hours was for the baby to be removed, or so we were told by a couple of doctors. Fortunately 26 weeks was old enough that modern NICU practices were able to save the baby; a couple weeks earlier and he likely wouldn't have made it or had life-long disabilities. A consult recommended abortion and our OB said time to deliver....

I'm in the #5 camp.... not because it's "ok" but because in life or death situations I don't think you should criminalize the very hard choices that have to be made in those scenarios, and I was oh-so-close to being in that scenario.

So either I'm mis-understanding your post or we were misled at the time by Drs...

-rvb

I think I touched on this earlier. D&C, is not an abortion, treating an ectopic, not an abortion, inducing labor or have a pre-term C-section, not an abortion.

Intentionally killing a fetus - abortion.

 

[ATOMonkey]

right? the lawsuit suing to block a conscience clause saying docs can't refuse to do an abortion for religious reasons...

It's my body and I can force you to do to me whatever it is I want. I have freedom over my body, you are my slave.

This has always been my issue. Service providers should be allowed to refuse service for things they consider to be wrong.

If people don't like it, they're more than welcome to shop around.

 

[oze]

This is yuge. Too bad this would never happen worldwide with the current pretender at the Vatican in charge.

https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/i...cians-from-communion-something-had-to-be-done

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[Ruger_Ronin]

Ectopic pregnancies can threaten mom's life, but there is a zero chance that pregnancy will result in a living child and may kill mom. Treating an ectopic is not an elective abortion.

My wife and I unanimously agree having experienced this ourselves.

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