Trusts

[Ruffnek]

School me on them.I searched a bit in here but couldn't really find a whole clear picture.

Who do I get ahold of to set one up?

How much does it cost?

How difficult is it?

What are the advantages?

Are there any disadvantages?

Who can be named on the trust?

What happens to the items if something happens to me?

 

[wsenefeld]

School me on them.I searched a bit in here but couldn't really find a whole clear picture.

Who do I get ahold of to set one up?

Grant Liston

How much does it cost?

$350.

How difficult is it?

Very simple, 3-4 emails.

What are the advantages?

Efile, no need for fingerprints or CLEO sign-off, faster turn around times, you can leave your NFA items with trustees or the beneficiary, easier to deal with in the event of your unfortunate/untimely passing.

Are there any disadvantages?

Initial cost.

Who can be named on the trust?

Any "proper person" that could legally own a firearm/NFA item.

What happens to the items if something happens to me?

They are then property of your listed beneficiary. If your beneficiary is not old enough to possess these items, they will be held by a trustee.

Trust ftw

 

[Ruffnek]

Thanks for the reply.

 

[Hop]

Once you get the documents is there any signing or motorizing that needs to be done? I had a trust written up but since efile has been so flaky I haven't tried to put an item into it yet.

 

[MontereyC6]

You need to get the trust notarized, then that is it!

 

[Yamadog35]

You need to get the trust notarized, then that is it!

Don't you usually need to have one or more witnesses sign at the time of the notarization? For those that have done this, do you just get a couple of friends or other family members to be the witnesses?

 

[Hop]

After that do you just scan the notorized documents back as a PDF file?

 

[wsenefeld]

No witnesses needed, just the notary. Do not sign the trust without the notary present. The notary needs to witness you signing it.

Yes, then upload the signed trust as a pdf.

 

[Rookie]

The notary seal must be visible on your .PDF document. I used a pencil to shade the seal.

 

[10ring]

You need to get the trust notarized, then that is it!

The notary seal must be visible on your .PDF document. I used a pencil to shade the seal.

No witnesses needed, just the notary. Do not sign the trust without the notary present. The notary needs to witness you signing it.
Yes, then upload the signed trust as a pdf.

Interesting. I have a trust set up by John Spurr over in Terra Haute and have 9 stamps so far using my trust docs with no notary stamp. It just has a couple of witness signature lines on it and has worked fine for every transfer I've done.

Where does it say you have to have it notarized?

 

[wsenefeld]

Interesting. I have a trust set up by John Spurr over in Terra Haute and have 9 stamps so far using my trust docs with no notary stamp. It just has a couple of witness signature lines on it and has worked fine for every transfer I've done.

Where does it say you have to have it notarized?

In Indiana a trust needs to be signed in front of a notary to become validated. It may have passed the NFA branch but the trust wouldn't hold up in court.

 

[Yamadog35]

Interesting. I have a trust set up by John Spurr over in Terra Haute and have 9 stamps so far using my trust docs with no notary stamp. It just has a couple of witness signature lines on it and has worked fine for every transfer I've done.

I've also seen a blank one in the last few months that had two witness signature areas right below where the "Settlor and Trustee" would sign and right above where the notary signs and notarizes. Not sure who created that form. Oh well, I guess I'll just get with Mr. Liston and go from there.

 

[10ring]

In Indiana a trust needs to be signed in front of a notary to become validated. It may have passed the NFA branch but the trust wouldn't hold up in court.

Are you a lawyer, or did you sleep in a Holiday Inn Express last night? Kidding of course...kind of...

§ 30-4-2-1. Written evidence of terms; definite terms; validity of inter vivos trust; existence of trust beneficiaries; creation of trust by exercise of power of appointment
(a) A trust in either real or personal property is enforceable only if there is written evidence of its terms bearing the signature of the settlor or the settlor's authorized agent.
(b) Except as required in the applicable probate law for the execution of wills, no formal language is required to create a trust, but its terms must be sufficiently definite so that the trust property, the identity of the trustee, the nature of the trustee's interest, the identity of the beneficiary, the nature of the beneficiary's interest and the purpose of the trust may be ascertained with reasonable certainty.
(c) It is not necessary to the validity of a trust that the trust be funded with or have a corpus that includes property other than the present or future, vested or contingent right of the trustee to receive proceeds or property, including:
(1) as beneficiary of an estate under IC 29-1-6-1 ;
(2) life insurance benefits under section 5 of this chapter;
(3) retirement plan benefits; or
(4) the proceeds of an individual retirement account.
(d) A trust created under:
(1) section 18 of this chapter for the care of an animal; or
(2) section 19 of this chapter for a noncharitable purpose;
has a beneficiary.
(e) A trust has a beneficiary if the beneficiary can be presently ascertained or ascertained in the future, subject to any applicable rule against perpetuities.
(f) A power of a trustee to select a beneficiary from an indefinite class is valid. If the power is not exercised within a reasonable time, the power fails and the property subject to the power passes to the persons who would have taken the property had the power not been conferred.
(g) A trust may be created by exercise of a power of appointment in favor of a trustee.


And according to my lawyer that has set up countless trusts in Indiana, you are incorrect.

"The Indiana code does not require that a trust be notarized."

 

[Rookie]

My lawyer said to get it notarized. Since it only cost me five minutes of my time, it wasn't an issue.

In other words, I don't know who is right or wrong, but it's too simple to not do.

 

[10ring]

My lawyer said to get it notarized. Since it only cost me five minutes of my time, it wasn't an issue.

In other words, I don't know who is right or wrong, but it's too simple to not do.

Do what you like, but nobody here needs to state things like "it is the law" and "won't stand up in court" because it simply is not factual.

 

[MontereyC6]

As mentioned above by someone else, the way my attorney drew mine up, I was told to get it notarized, so that is what I did. Is it necessary to make a trust legal? I have no idea. But, just like doctors, we all may get different advice, and its up to each and everyone of us to decide for ourselves the correct way to go.

 

[10ring]

As mentioned above by someone else, the way my attorney drew mine up, I was told to get it notarized, so that is what I did. Is it necessary to make a trust legal? I have no idea. But, just like doctors, we all may get different advice, and its up to each and everyone of us to decide for ourselves the correct way to go.

See that's the problem - it's not "advice" - it's the Indiana code as its written and there are too many people on here spewing "facts" and legal "advice" that are not correct. You want to notarize your trust docs - go for it - but don't tell people on this forum that you have to do so in order for your trust to be legit and enforceable in court.

 

[wsenefeld]

Not trying to spew anything made up, just what I was told by my attorney, Grant Liston, that it had to be notarized before being a legal document. Do as you wish, I couldn't care less.

 

[Beowulf]

My guess is that having the document notarized provides concrete evidence that the trust was indeed actually signed by the "settlor". Otherwise, the signatures validity could be challenged. So I can see why a lawyer would say it needs to be notarized (I was advised the same way as wesenefeld by Grant)

 

[Hop]

IANAL... doing some reading... 10ring is right about IN and most states. It doesn't sound like a bad idea but isn't required.