Woman, with child, bumps gate at/near White House, police chase, shoot, kill her

[Destro]

Again...this could have been finished the first time they had her stopped if they had not allowed her an escape route. Very poor job at that point and from there on. Epic fail.

Wow, that easy?!, you should go be a trainer! obviously they have no clue what they are doing.

Employment ? Federal Law Enforcement Training Center



I'll help you pack

 

[rambone]

Official reports of whom?

New York Times via Senate Sergeant at Arms Terrance Gainer:
"The woman who was shot to death after a taut, high-speed car chase through the streets between the White House and Capitol Hill was still in her car, snagged on the curb of a grass-covered median, when the police fired at her, a Senate official said on Friday."


Washington Post:
"The end came outside the Hart Senate Office Building, at Maryland Avenue and Second Street NE. The woman’s car got stuck. Officers fired another volley. Then, moments later, an officer emerged with the girl and carried the toddler quickly away as new waves of officers arrived."

Alex Jones and Cop Block?

This stopped being clever about a bazillion repetitions ago.

how is the car immobilized in this picture?

How was it an immediate threat?

 

[Kirk Freeman]

So, the media is now official on INGO?

This stopped being clever about a bazillion repetitions ago.

The truth is not clever, it is simply the truth. Mouthing the Alex Jones line is just silly.

How was it an immediate threat?

You are asking how a motor vehicle is a threat?

Well, usually I am history professor around here, but I can do physics too: Momentum - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Destro]

So, the media is now official on INGO?



The truth is not clever, it is simply the truth. Mouthing the Alex Jones line is just silly.



You are asking how a motor vehicle is a threat?

Well, usually I am history professor around here, but I can do physics too: Momentum - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

common, law enforcement had several seconds to check and see to what extent the vehicle was stuck, if it could be unstuck....they were probably wasting time focusing on the driver

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Just to remind the Alex Jones wing of INGO, the car became unstuck once before. The standard for self defense is what is reasonable under those circumstances.

Cops see car get loose once, do not have to wait to be run over again.

Police do not possess Jedi powers which allow omniscience. Or, maybe, just maybe they do thanks to Haliburton and BushHitler is suppressing that information.

 

[JettaKnight]

INGO seems rather mercurial about police shooting a driver.
If it's in DC then it's horrible. If it's in Iowa then it's commendable.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Dude, same old story. The reaction to a self-defense shooting depends on who the dead perp is.

Here it is a woman, with a child, so you get lots of gnashing of teeth and "police state".

In Iowa it was a 19 year old male. Not a frickin' mousefart of "police state", "tyrannnnnyyyyy".

 

[j706]

Just to remind the Alex Jones wing of INGO, the car became unstuck once before. The standard for self defense is what is reasonable under those circumstances.

Cops see car get loose once, do not have to wait to be run over again.

Police do not possess Jedi powers which allow omniscience. Or, maybe, just maybe they do thanks to Haliburton and BushHitler is suppressing that information.

Alex Jones of INGO! Good one!

 

[churchmouse]

Wow, that easy?!, you should go be a trainer! obviously they have no clue what they are doing.

Employment ? Federal Law Enforcement Training Center



I'll help you pack

Sweet...you can come along.

Watch the video when they had the car against the fence. No one pulled up to totally block her in. They stepped in her way putting themselves at risk. Simply using the cars as a blockade she would have been unable to run again.

Yes, that simple.

When are we leaving ??????????

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Watch the video when they had the car against the fence. No one pulled up to totally block her in. They stepped in her way putting themselves at risk. Simply using the cars as a blockade she would have been unable to run again

Question, wouldn't that put the officers in danger? Why should the officers subject themselves to serious bodily injury or death? Is that not the purpose of self-defense?

 

[2ADMNLOVER]

That sounds too much like the BS that Miah and the Cop Block put out.

No , it sounds too much like the BS a prosecutor would do to the average citizen of this country if they shot somebody that was no longer a threat .

Well, usually I am history professor around here, but I can do physics too: Momentum - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I would think self preservation and common sense wouldn't be over ruled by the urge to kill someone so bad that that you put yourself in harm's way when it's not truly needed .

Cops see car get loose once, do not have to wait to be run over again..

Did ANY cops get ran over ?

Or did they put themselves in a position of personal jeopardy when it wasn't needed ?

How many agencies , officers and vehicles were involved ? And they still couldn't find a non lethal way to stop ONE PERSON .

All the tacticool training and tools money can buy and the guns still got used , SAD .
.

 

[KLB]

Question, wouldn't that put the officers in danger? Why should the officers subject themselves to serious bodily injury or death? Is that not the purpose of self-defense?

Using a car to block another car so that it can not escape is putting the officer in danger, but putting his body in the path does not?

 

[j706]

Sweet...you can come along.

Watch the video when they had the car against the fence. No one pulled up to totally block her in. They stepped in her way putting themselves at risk. Simply using the cars as a blockade she would have been unable to run again.

Yes, that simple.

When are we leaving ??????????

This is not meant as a dig on you or your post but that all sounds nice and simple sitting behind the keyboard. However in reality it is VERY hard to coordinate even simple things in a rapidly changing, adrenalin filled hostile environment. When the stuff is going down even simple things can get real difficult real fast. If they could have gotten that nut blocked in the end result might have been less permanent. But IMO it is kinda hard to feel much if any sympathy for that woman. If a person has some sort of a death wish, what she did would probably be a pretty dang good way to get it taken care of.

 

[Fargo]

Sorry, I was pontificating on the point about being able to shoot a fleeing felon.
If the mall shooter guy shoots a few kids and then runs out of the door and someone follows him and caps him it's a high probability that the person shooting the guy is going to jail.

The common law rule that LEO's could shoot per se shoot fleeing felons was ruled unconstitutional in 1985 in the case of Tenn. v. Garner. I don't know why it is being brought up here has it has not been the law for going on 30 years.

The common law rule is not the rule anywhere in the U.S. today. Indiana basically codified Tenn v. Garner in its LEO use of force statute 35-41-3-3(b):

(b) A law enforcement officer is justified in using reasonable force if the officer reasonably believes that the force is necessary to effect a lawful arrest. However, an officer is justified in using deadly force only if the officer:
(1) has probable cause to believe that that deadly force is necessary:
(A) to prevent the commission of a forcible felony; or
(B) to effect an arrest of a person who the officer has probable cause to believe poses a threat of serious bodily injury to the officer or a third person; and
(2) has given a warning, if feasible, to the person against whom the deadly force is to be used.
(c) A law enforcement officer making an arrest under an invalid warrant is justified in using force as if the warrant was valid, unless the officer knows that the warrant is invalid.
(d) A law enforcement officer who has an arrested person in custody is justified in using the same force to prevent the escape of the arrested person from custody that the officer would be justified in using if the officer was arresting that person. However, an officer is justified in using deadly force only if the officer:
(1) has probable cause to believe that deadly force is necessary to prevent the escape from custody of a person who the officer has probable cause to believe poses a threat of serious bodily injury to the officer or a third person; and
(2) has given a warning, if feasible, to the person against whom the deadly force is to be used.
(e) A guard or other official in a penal facility or a law enforcement officer is justified in using reasonable force, including deadly force, if the officer has probable cause to believe that the force is necessary to prevent the escape of a person who is detained in the penal facility.
(f) Notwithstanding subsection (b), (d), or (e), a law enforcement officer who is a defendant in a criminal prosecution has the same right as a person who is not a law enforcement officer to assert self-defense under IC 35-41-3-2.
As added by Acts 1976, P.L.148, SEC.1. Amended by Acts 1977, P.L.340, SEC.9; Acts 1979, P.L.297, SEC.2; P.L.245-1993, SEC.1.

Best,

Joe

 

[j706]

The common law rule that LEO's could shoot per se shoot fleeing felons was ruled unconstitutional in 1985 in the case of Tenn. v. Garner. I don't know why it is being brought up here has it has not been the law for going on 30 years.

The common law rule is not the rule anywhere in the U.S. today. Indiana basically codified Tenn v. Garner in its LEO use of force statute 35-41-3-3(b):




Best,

Joe

Don't know about you guys but if I ever respond on a mass type shooting and see the shooter running away I will most definitely shoot him if I have a shot.

 

[Frank_N_Stein]

Don't know about you guys but if I ever respond on a mass type shooting and see the shooter running away I will most definitely shoot him if I have a shot.

You are still allowed to shoot fleeing felons. You just can't shoot them for the sole reason that they are a felon that is fleeing. Other criteria have to be met. Criteria spelled out in the statute Fargo posted.

 

[j706]

You are still allowed to shoot fleeing felons. You just can't shoot them for the sole reason that they are a felon that is fleeing. Other criteria have to be met. Criteria spelled out in the statute Fargo posted.

Yes I know. I still see a number of guys (cops included) that think Tennessee VS: Garner made it unlawful for them to shoot a fleeing felon.

 

[churchmouse]

This is not meant as a dig on you or your post but that all sounds nice and simple sitting behind the keyboard. However in reality it is VERY hard to coordinate even simple things in a rapidly changing, adrenalin filled hostile environment. When the stuff is going down even simple things can get real difficult real fast. If they could have gotten that nut blocked in the end result might have been less permanent. But IMO it is kinda hard to feel much if any sympathy for that woman. If a person has some sort of a death wish, what she did would probably be a pretty dang good way to get it taken care of.

And I agree with how you feel. Absolutely no sympathy but has any reports on her mental health been varified??
I do not know.

My statement is simple and final. They were chasing her. The boxed her in but left an escape route that was obvious and stevie wonder could see it. She saw it, bolted putting LEO in peril and then endangered so many more in her reckless attempt to escape which ended her life.

As simple as it sounds if they would have blocked her off none of this would have happened past that point.

 

[churchmouse]

Question, wouldn't that put the officers in danger? Why should the officers subject themselves to serious bodily injury or death? Is that not the purpose of self-defense?

Not if they are in the car. The LEO on scene got in front of the car....That gave her a shot at them.

Use the darn car. There were several on scene. Block her in and confine the activity to that site not the whole city.

 

[Destro]

Bad news for the Cop Block faction of INGO

No charges for officers in pursuit, shooting near Capitol