Another problem as I see it is that there is no severe penalty for..............

[jamil]

People who go to a restaurant and order a big, beautiful rib-eye... Well done.
And when it shows up, a burned cinder of its former glorious self, the person asks the server; uh, miss, could you please bring me some ketchup?

I'd say the two sins cancel.

 

[Jag3212323]

Thanks. I was not aware that this was associated with the "equal time" thing.

Yeah, it’s not that big of a deal anymore because candidates don’t rely on the old broadcasting stations like they used to to reach people. With so much money going to outside groups, they often times can produce and put their own responses out fairly quickly and can go to cable stations, social media, etc.


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[jamil]

I think there should be more prosecution for knowingly lying. Too many men, for starters, have had their lives ruined by false allegations of sexual misconduct that, while proven to be false, continued to cast a shadow over their lives and livelihoods while the person who accused them walked free.

How about just making the issue about causing harm? And, rather than legislating more subjective morality, why not just let civil courts handle that kind of justice. Say someone lies about me and it causes no harm or loss, big deal. No one needs fined or jailed. If it causes me harm, I should be able to sue for whatever harm it caused. But I don't see that as a criminal justice issue.

 

[Ggreen]

I worked for a scumbag that actively pursed libel and defamation in civil courts. His best "friends" were lawyers, and he made them a lot of money. So yes lots of people use the courts to right their unjusts when it comes to speech. Stormy has sued the president now for a tweet. If she can do it, anyone can do it. If someone seriously hurt my reputation with unjust statements that could live on and grow to haunt future generations or my income I would seek satisfaction against them. I would not toss libel around like my former employer, and if he reads this...you sir are the lowest of humans, a scum sucking parasite feeding off of the people who trust and labor for you. Anyway it is already unlawful to spread lies with intent to unjustly harm another person.

 

[IndyTom]

How about just making the issue about causing harm? And, rather than legislating more subjective morality, why not just let civil courts handle that kind of justice. Say someone lies about me and it causes no harm or loss, big deal. No one needs fined or jailed. If it causes me harm, I should be able to sue for whatever harm it caused. But I don't see that as a criminal justice issue.

The initial lie is already against the law, isn't it? Lying to the police in order to have charges brought up against someone is already illegal but is rarely prosecuted. I think we just saw some woman (finally) get penalized for making such claims against a couple of guys but it was mostly made light of due to her appearance. If the prosecution of the liars was as public as the problems for the accused they caused, it would cut back on false claims and, hopefully, be newsworthy enough (reported on sufficiently) to clear the falsely-accused's name, as well.

 

[jamil]

The initial lie is already against the law, isn't it? Lying to the police in order to have charges brought up against someone is already illegal but is rarely prosecuted. I think we just saw some woman (finally) get penalized for making such claims against a couple of guys but it was mostly made light of due to her appearance. If the prosecution of the liars was as public as the problems for the accused they caused, it would cut back on false claims and, hopefully, be newsworthy enough (reported on sufficiently) to clear the falsely-accused's name, as well.

Again, as I said to the OP, I think we need to define the scope of what the problem is that we're discussing, and what should be done about it in terms of legislation. If there's already a problem that an unenforced law addresses, more laws isn't going to solve that.

The topic was just strict penalties needed for lying. Not really a lot of context beyond that.

 

[Itchytriggerfinger]

I lied to my kids and told them Santa was real. Do I deserve jail time?

 

[Kutnupe14]

I worked for a scumbag that actively pursed libel and defamation in civil courts. His best "friends" were lawyers, and he made them a lot of money. So yes lots of people use the courts to right their unjusts when it comes to speech. Stormy has sued the president now for a tweet. If she can do it, anyone can do it. If someone seriously hurt my reputation with unjust statements that could live on and grow to haunt future generations or my income I would seek satisfaction against them. I would not toss libel around like my former employer, and if he reads this...you sir are the lowest of humans, a scum sucking parasite feeding off of the people who trust and labor for you. Anyway it is already unlawful to spread lies with intent to unjustly harm another person.

It's not libel, if its true.... and something tells me that you really believe this, lol.

 

[Ggreen]

I lied to my kids and told them Santa was real. Do I deserve jail time?

I think it is up to Santa

 

[Ggreen]

It's not libel, if its true.... and something tells me that you really believe this, lol.

You'll never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy than the general aviation community... lol... but it is true, kinda.

 

[jamil]

I lied to my kids and told them Santa was real. Do I deserve jail time?

No. It's okay to lie to your kids as long as it's for your own amusement.

 

[Kutnupe14]

You'll never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy than the general aviation community... lol... but it is true, kinda.

Lol, you sound like my dad. He works in that business.

 

[Jag3212323]

It's not libel, if its true.... and something tells me that you really believe this, lol.

You have to also be able to show intent to harm and the harm that you suffered as a result of the claim. That’s not easy to do. This standard is so high thanks to the First Amendment.


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[Jag3212323]

It's not libel, if its true.... and something tells me that you really believe this, lol.

Also, the same standard applies for slander as libel. The difference between them is the method that a harmful statement was initiated. Slander-spoken word and libel-written


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[DoggyDaddy]

I lied to my kids and told them Santa was real. Do I deserve jail time?

Jail time? No. But you're getting a lump of coal in your stocking mister!

 

[Ggreen]

Jail time? No. But you're getting a lump of coal in your stocking mister!

I would imagine ITF would paint it up like a baseball and put it in reach of children.

 

[russc2542]

If we started burying all the liars under the jail, Indy would have a new, tallest building.

dwarfed by the one 200 miles Northwest, that one only dwarfed by the one 900 miles East.

Well, logically it’s an unfalsafiable claim, and thus is abandoning the rational conversation. And that’s fine as long as the claimants understand that they’ve shifted the conversation from reason to metaphysical. Just don’t be surprised when the rationals leave the conversation.

well put and with that I'm out.

 

[Tombs]

Lying!

You can ruin and innocent persons life with a lie or false accusation and there is little or no penalty or repercussion for doing so.

God's own word is very explesit, no lier shall ever inter into Heaven. That sounds pretty severe to me.
There is even a vary severe penalty for lying to the FBI. But when it comes to trashing someones life or reputation it would seem that, that's fair game if it is for a good or no good reason.

This even goes for people who pass along lies without bothering to check to see if it is true or not. At the least it deserves jail time.

And all the liars in government would put loopholes into every single section of the bill to exempt themselves, while corporate donors would make sure to put the screws to every normal citizen so that a negative product review would put us in jail.

Good luck.

 

[indiucky]

I don't think I'm what you're looking for sir. I appreciate your always generous and kind words but whatever it is you think I am or will potentially be, I assure you, I'm not.

Maybe...Maybe not...Still love chatting at you....You remind me of...Me.....

None of us are who we think we are and rarely get to who we can potentially be.....I surprise myself daily....