Anyone thought of becoming a sovereign citizen?

[buckstopshere]

So what's the deal with the UD from sovereign citizens? I assume it's Under Deeznuts but I'm sure that's wrong. Whats it really mean?

No, I've never really considered joining the movement.

 

[indyjack]

At the time of the writing of the Constitution the King was the Sovereign of England. In any Monarchy a King (or at times a Queen) is Sovereign. In a Republican form of government the people are sovereign. If we are to assume that we have a Republican form of government throughout the Nation, as the Constitution requires, We The People are Sovereign.

As the sovereign entity in the United States, if the President has any authority at all it is because we gave it to him; If the Congress has any authority at all it is because we gave it to them; If the Judiciary has any authority at all it is because we gave it to them. All authority is a grant from We The People and is spelled out in the Constitution.

In short, being sovereign means we're in charge of them, not the other way around. That is the way the United States General Government, as described in the Constitution, is actually designed.

I had no idea there was a "Sovereign Citizen" movement, and the fact that the terminology has been co-opted by tin foil hatters is as disturbing as the current situation with private Militias. Real sovereignty has nothing to do with dodging taxes, any more than the Militia is a rag tag bunch of guys in funny clothes playing guns in the woods. We The People granted the General Government authority to tax for a list of specific things. We The People are all a part of the Militia. They're not clubs of crazies, it's the way the Nation is supposed to work.

It isn't a club. It's not about tax evasion. It's the way our Nation was formed.

i'm glad to see some people can still read. well put sir.

 

[Denny347]

At the time of the writing of the Constitution the King was the Sovereign of England. In any Monarchy a King (or at times a Queen) is Sovereign. In a Republican form of government the people are sovereign. If we are to assume that we have a Republican form of government throughout the Nation, as the Constitution requires, We The People are Sovereign.

As the sovereign entity in the United States, if the President has any authority at all it is because we gave it to him; If the Congress has any authority at all it is because we gave it to them; If the Judiciary has any authority at all it is because we gave it to them. All authority is a grant from We The People and is spelled out in the Constitution.

In short, being sovereign means we're in charge of them, not the other way around. That is the way the United States General Government, as described in the Constitution, is actually designed.

I had no idea there was a "Sovereign Citizen" movement, and the fact that the terminology has been co-opted by tin foil hatters is as disturbing as the current situation with private Militias. Real sovereignty has nothing to do with dodging taxes, any more than the Militia is a rag tag bunch of guys in funny clothes playing guns in the woods. We The People granted the General Government authority to tax for a list of specific things. We The People are all a part of the Militia. They're not clubs of crazies, it's the way the Nation is supposed to work.

It isn't a club. It's not about tax evasion. It's the way our Nation was formed.

Yup but criminals have hijacked the term and now it's ruined. Any name even CLOSE to "Sovereign Citizens" will forever be blacked as a result.

 

[Frank_N_Stein]

So what's the deal with the UD from sovereign citizens? I assume it's Under Deeznuts but I'm sure that's wrong. Whats it really mean?

No, I've never really considered joining the movement.

Under Duress

 

[Bummer]

Yup but criminals have hijacked the term and now it's ruined. Any name even CLOSE to "Sovereign Citizens" will forever be blacked as a result.

I hate to step into the shadow of paranoia, but I've had the question "Did someone do this intentionally to destroy the original intent?" pop into my head more than once. Both Sovereign Citizen and Militia have received black eyes as a result of their respective crazy movements. The problem is I fear we need these terms in their original forms to survive as a Constitutional Republic since they are key to who we are supposed to be.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

I have seen "TDC" as well as UD. It is very Alice in Wonderland.

Ohio Attorney General Mike DeWine - Sovereign Citizen Encounters: What Officers Should Know

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Sovereign Citizens are crazy, delusional. It is a scam perpetrated on the unknowing or those wanting a vehicle for grifting.

Using the terms in the Constitutions (federal and state) is not crazy.

 

[rambone]

If all Sovereign Citizens are to be characterized by two guys in West Memphis then all police officers should be characterized by the ones on Danziger Bridge. Seems fair right?

 

[buckstopshere]

Sovereign Citizens are crazy, delusional. It is a scam perpetrated on the unknowing or those wanting a vehicle for grifting.

Using the terms in the Constitutions (federal and state) is not crazy.

so UD is under duress and not under Deeznuts? Disappointing

 

[atvdave]

Terry Nichols was one who helped murder 168 lives. No thank you...

Police in Vegas say 'sovereign citizen' plot to kill officers thwarted | Fox News


Sovereign Citizen Movement -- Extremism in America

Sovereign citizen movement - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Titanium_Frost]

I was accused of it once, back when I had no idea what it was. But no, I never considered joining a cause that undermines the very fabric of what I hold dear to in this country. Law and Order is not a crappy TV show, it is what makes America what it is. Law and Order allow us to be free, not the lack of rules and procedures.

The problem is the ones given power by the people lost track of that.

 

[atvdave]

I was accused of it once, back when I had no idea what it was. But no, I never considered joining a cause that undermines the very fabric of what I hold dear to in this country. Law and Order is not a crappy TV show, it is what makes America what it is. Law and Order allow us to be free, not the lack of rules and procedures.

The problem is the ones given power by the people lost track of that.

I agree with this.

 

[indyjack]

If all Sovereign Citizens are to be characterized by two guys in West Memphis then all police officers should be characterized by the ones on Danziger Bridge. Seems fair right?

yeah... and all priests are pedophiles, all soldiers like to throw puppies off cliffs, all christians are kkk members, all muslims are terrorists, and all politicians are liars who say anything for a buck (oh wait... that one may actually be true...)

 

[BehindBlueI's]

It is a scam perpetrated on the unknowing or those wanting a vehicle for grifting.

Yup, Shela Amos scammed a lot of folks in Indy.

http://www.indy.gov/eGov/County/Pro...rs three separate house fraud schemes WEB.pdf

The documents were laughable if you knew anything at all about the law, and ought to have been ridiculous even if you didn't. Signed by dead presidents, appealing to the authority of the Queen to grant land patents, and multiple references to God granting souls certain lands. The folks I dealt with didn't read them too closely, they were too greedy for the "great deal" on the house they were buying. They did get great deals, too, if she'd ever actually owned the houses she was selling them.

 

[SmithGuy]

At the time of the writing of the Constitution the King was the Sovereign of England. In any Monarchy a King (or at times a Queen) is Sovereign. In a Republican form of government the people are sovereign. If we are to assume that we have a Republican form of government throughout the Nation, as the Constitution requires, We The People are Sovereign.

As the sovereign entity in the United States, if the President has any authority at all it is because we gave it to him; If the Congress has any authority at all it is because we gave it to them; If the Judiciary has any authority at all it is because we gave it to them. All authority is a grant from We The People and is spelled out in the Constitution.

In short, being sovereign means we're in charge of them, not the other way around. That is the way the United States General Government, as described in the Constitution, is actually designed.

I had no idea there was a "Sovereign Citizen" movement, and the fact that the terminology has been co-opted by tin foil hatters is as disturbing as the current situation with private Militias. Real sovereignty has nothing to do with dodging taxes, any more than the Militia is a rag tag bunch of guys in funny clothes playing guns in the woods. We The People granted the General Government authority to tax for a list of specific things. We The People are all a part of the Militia. They're not clubs of crazies, it's the way the Nation is supposed to work.

It isn't a club. It's not about tax evasion. It's the way our Nation was formed.

I enjoyed reading your excellent summary. It is so refreshing to see well thought out and well articulated opinions and ideas on this site. We need a lot more of that.

 

[qmikep]

^^THIS^^. The Sovereign Citizen movement is the number 1 threat to the United States. If you want to be one you will have to learn how to file false leans and fictitious documents against your fellow citizens that have done nothing wrong. No different than what a lot are upset about or claim is being done to them!

Good Luck with that is that's what you are wising for because like Denny stated most end up in prison at some point if they keep with their demented thought process!

Do you mean to say the SC are IRS agents?

 

[Bummer]

Do you mean to say the SC are IRS agents?

That might explain it. They certainly aren't independent judges capable of reasoned judgment.

 

[in625shooter]

Do you mean to say the SC are IRS agents?

No but one of the major Sovereign Citizens MO's is they do file false leans on folks that they have no legal right to. There has even been issues where they tied up some Federal judges bank, credit card and all other finances for in one case 90 plus days. The 2007 court reform act made that against the law to file against any federal Official if found guilty they would be subject to an additional 5 years of prison time on each count.

The 2007 court reform act mad e it a little more difficult in tying up the courts for BS. This was done due to the Sovereign Citizens increasing nature of filing false papers and universal Commercial Code's (UCC's) against not only US Judges but U.S, Marshals and Federal Bureau of Prison and other LE Officials as well.

 

[qmikep]

I just love that so many folks on what amounts to a pro liberty message board are parroting the lines of the ADL and the SPLC.

 

[HoughMade]

Everywhere I look.....flags with gold fringe.

My birth certificate- nothing more than creating a corporate alter ego. The Rothschilds are majority shareholders with the Bush family holding a fair amount. The Illuminati sold off its shares long ago.

Anyhoo....some people like to talk about how everyone else is a slave and only they are free, they are enlightened and the sheeple take what they are fed.

...but by and large, they talk big on the internet and live mild, unobtrusive lives of little risk. A very, very...very few live out their claimed principles in this regard...but to no significance on a larger scale. Mainly because they base these beliefs on legal fiction.