CNN: Children should get vaccinated. Period.

[Lex Concord]

And that matters to me why?

All for the overall benefit of the hive. It's utilitarian. For some folks, the alleged social contract is a suicide pact for things they like, and not for things they don't.

 

[Double T]

Is your employer one who mandates flu vaccine as a condition of employment?

They cannot mandate it, have been told so from my employer though they "highly recommend it."

 

[IndyDave1776]

They cannot mandate it, have been told so from my employer though they "highly recommend it."

Is that 'highly recommended' as in they find it a really good idea for your own benefit or 'highly recommended' as in it is not required but declining could stunt your growth in the organization?

 

[Lex Concord]

They cannot mandate it, have been told so from my employer though they "highly recommend it."

Fair enough...mixed legal meanings (mandate vs. condition of employment). That said, employers can make things conditions of employment (i.e. we can't force you, but if you choose not to, you are choosing to seek employment elsewhere).

Just curious if it was a condition of employment, as a lot of hospitals have done that recently.

 

[Mad Macs]

We don't do flu shots, and guess what, we don't get the flu. We take care of ourselves naturally but not eating garbage, washing hands, and we stay healthy. With 3 kids 12 and under that have missed MAYBE 2 days of school in the past year this is pretty impressive.

We are also on a delayed vaccine schedule and anybody who says that vaccines are "fine" should watch one of my kids when they get a shot. You couldn't tell me they're harmless.

 

[Dean C.]

Flu shots I am totally hit or miss on but vital vaccines like for Polio, Whooping Cough, Rubella and Measles are very very important. The diseases listed are terrible and I would never wish them upon anyone ever especially polio. Being anti vaccine at this point I liken to people saying Led Zeppelin played backwards is devil worship music. It is just plain uninformed. And I brought links lots and lots of links.

CDC - Vaccines: Vac-Gen/What Would Happen If We Stopped Vaccinations
CDC Vaccine List (shows aweful symptoms of easily preventable diseases) http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/who/teens/downloads/parent-version-schedule-7-18yrs.pdf
Washington Post Article - How the anti-vaccine movement is endangering lives - The Washington Post
Health Line . com - Anti-Vaccination Movement Causes a Deadly Year in the U.S.
Time - Vaccine-Preventable Diseases Emerging Thanks to Anti-Vaxxers - TIME
Nature.com Run down on start of Anti Vaccine issue - A case of junk science, conflict and hype : Article : Nature Immunology
Scumbag I personally blame for all of this misinformed **** - Andrew Wakefield - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Mad Macs]

Flu shots I am totally hit or miss on but vital vaccines like for Polio, Whooping Cough, Rubella and Measles are very very important. The diseases listed are terrible and I would never wish them upon anyone ever especially polio. Being anti vaccine at this point I liken to people saying Led Zeppelin played backwards is devil worship music. It is just plain uninformed. And I brought links lots and lots of links.

Thank you for your opinion. Good thing I didn't consider yours when we made our "uninformed" decisions about my children's medical care. And yes, we did a LOT of research into vaccines before deciding to not flood our children with toxic garbage all at once.

 

[findingZzero]

Which brings to mind the expression "I can explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you." Undeterred by the facts we move forward into the future.
The night is dark and full of terror.

 

[steveh_131]

Flu shots I am totally hit or miss on but vital vaccines like for Polio, Whooping Cough, Rubella and Measles are very very important. The diseases listed are terrible and I would never wish them upon anyone ever especially polio. Being anti vaccine at this point I liken to people saying Led Zeppelin played backwards is devil worship music. It is just plain uninformed. And I brought links lots and lots of links.

CDC - Vaccines: Vac-Gen/What Would Happen If We Stopped Vaccinations
CDC Vaccine List (shows aweful symptoms of easily preventable diseases) http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/who/teens/downloads/parent-version-schedule-7-18yrs.pdf
Washington Post Article - How the anti-vaccine movement is endangering lives - The Washington Post
Health Line . com - Anti-Vaccination Movement Causes a Deadly Year in the U.S.
Time - Vaccine-Preventable Diseases Emerging Thanks to Anti-Vaxxers - TIME
Nature.com Run down on start of Anti Vaccine issue - A case of junk science, conflict and hype : Article : Nature Immunology
Scumbag I personally blame for all of this misinformed **** - Andrew Wakefield - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

You swallow every bit of propaganda from the mainstream media and you think that makes makes you "informed"?

You have a kindergarten level of understanding of the subject compared to most folks I know who don't fully vaccinate, and your post demonstrates it.

 

[avboiler11]

You have a kindergarten level of understanding of the subject compared to most folks I know who don't fully vaccinate, and your post demonstrates it.

Don't mean this toward you specifically, but I have to ask:

Why don't we see more (any?) microbiologists, infectious disease experts, and medical doctors in the anti-vaxxer camp?

 

[steveh_131]

Don't mean this toward you specifically, but I have to ask:

Why don't we see more (any?) microbiologists, infectious disease experts, and medical doctors in the anti-vaxxer camp?

Because they are widely ignored and/or silenced. There is no shortage of research out there that calls into question the safety and efficacy of vaccines. I suspect that you just haven't been looking.

 

[steveh_131]

Don't mean this toward you specifically, but I have to ask:

Why don't we see more (any?) microbiologists, infectious disease experts, and medical doctors in the anti-vaxxer camp?

Dupe.

 

[avboiler11]

Because they are widely ignored and/or silenced. There is no shortage of research out there that calls into question the safety and efficacy of vaccines. I suspect that you just haven't been looking.

You're right, I haven't been looking.

I would love to read some academic/medical research on the topic if you could link to them, especially if it is peer reviewed.

 

[steveh_131]

You're right, I haven't been looking.

I would love to read some academic/medical research on the topic if you could link to them, especially if it is peer reviewed.

You can start with the links in this thread that essentially vindicate Wakefields research.

Google the 50,000 or so kids in India who were maimed or killed by the polio vaccine.

Then search this forum for my posts about vaccines. I supply research to back up pretty much every point I make.

When I get to a computer I'll provide more.

 

[Dean C.]

166 Independent studies this was published yesterday and should be the final nail in the dangerous vaccine idea coffin I hope. But I will let everyone read it and decide for themselves.
http://effectivehealthcare.ahrq.gov/ehc/products/468/1930/vaccine-safety-report-140701.pdf

 

[steveh_131]

166 Independent studies this was published yesterday and should be the final nail in the dangerous vaccine idea coffin I hope. But I will let everyone read it and decide for themselves.
http://effectivehealthcare.ahrq.gov/ehc/products/468/1930/vaccine-safety-report-140701.pdf

So a government-sponsored panel selects their 166 favorite studies, out of thousands, and aggregates the data?

I'll quote Dr. David Wheldon, of the U.S. House of Representatives regarding the government's bias towards vaccines. This occurred during the Thimerosal controversy, while the government was doing their best to cover it up.

Letter

It appears to me not only as a Member of Congress but also as a physician that some officials within the CDC’s NIP may be more interested in a public
relations campaign than getting to the truth about thimerosal. At present, I
have lost confidence in the ability of officials at the CDC to give an honest
evaluation of the matters at hand. It is not just me raising these concerns
about public confidence, but also Dr. Neal Halsey who in his letter conveys
his concerns about loss of confidence in the NIP.

Another complaint with this study: They purposely exclude vaccines that are no longer in use. After many years of use, a widely used vaccine turns out to be very harmful. This is the nature of medicine. It takes time to establish these sorts of links. Should we assume that more links won't be established for any of the vaccines we're filling our kids with right now? I think that would be very foolish. If we really want to know the probability of harmful effects of vaccines, does it really make sense to exclude the documented harmful effects? Those thousands of damaged kids don't count because that particular formula of the vaccine was abandoned? And when we find the next damaging formula and it is abandoned, we won't count that one either?

 

[stephen87]

I get the ones required for my job, TDAP, HepB, and flu. Other than that, I haven't found any that truly worry me enough to warrant a vaccination.

 

[The Drifter]

I read every post,because your opinions all matter to me. Thank you all for your input. I don,t think any one,s mind has been changed by these posts. It amazes me how diverse INGO is , as a group . No one gets left out ,and there is nothing held back . All I can say on this subject is , as a little boy I got my shots . I got mumps and measles as a small boy ,had the flu a few times when I was younger. Maybe the vaccines worked ,and then again , maybe not. They did not injure me ***to the best of my knowledge .I am 63 ,so all of this was long ago. No vaccines received since age 18 . save or not they scare me [IE ] side effects. I will not take them , instead I take pro-biotics , a good one , and I never even get a cold, not in 12 years.

 

[steveh_131]

I read every post,because your opinions all matter to me. Thank you all for your input. I don,t think any one,s mind has been changed by these posts.

You might be surprised. I've altered my opinions on many subjects based on discussions with folks here on INGO.

Vaccines are a complicated issue. I would never say that I know the correct answer for every family. I have a strong reaction to pieces such as the one posted in the OP because I feel they are purposely telling half of the story. It is propaganda, plain and simple.

Vaccines are no different than any other medical intervention. There are possible risks and there are possible benefits. You will have to decide for yourself whether the benefits outweigh the risks. That equation will be different for each individual and family. I don't much care what choice any individual makes, but I do care that folks at least have the opportunity to become informed beyond the propaganda that we are inundated with on a daily basis.

 

[ArcadiaGP]

Measles outbreak prompts introduction of bill that would ban personal exemptions to vaccines