Indiana Constitutional Carry - HB1022 (2018)

[brotherbill3]

Bitter news comes with a small consolation -

but 1424 - passed 3rd reading in the house and will move to the Senate. ... I don't know how they work out the
HB 1424 - SB 237 conflicts - either silliness of it all

The consolation is - I just saw that our Charlie Brown and Linda Lawson - are retiring after this session.
This is good as they are 2 of the biggest pains on 2A issues we've had.

Oh and Jim L. voted NO on principal on 1424 ... Good.

Link on the "departees" - so I say yeah parteez for us maybe.

Retiring Region lawmakers see top priorities thwarted at Indiana House | Government and Politics | nwitimes.com

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

Bitter news comes with a small consolation -

but 1424 - passed 3rd reading in the house and will move to the Senate. ... I don't know how they work out the
HB 1424 - SB 237 conflicts - either silliness of it all

The consolation is - I just saw that our Charlie Brown and Linda Lawson - are retiring after this session.
This is good as they are 2 of the biggest pains on 2A issues we've had.

Oh and Jim L. voted NO on principal on 1424 ... Good.

Link on the "departees" - so I say yeah parteez for us maybe.

Retiring Region lawmakers see top priorities thwarted at Indiana House | Government and Politics | nwitimes.com

I would have too. I'm guessing this will be the last we seriously hear about constitutional carry for awhile.

 

[Hawkeye]

I would have too. I'm guessing this will be the last we seriously hear about constitutional carry for awhile.

Why try when it gets undone in backroom deals.

 

[brotherbill3]

I would have too. I'm guessing this will be the last we seriously hear about constitutional carry for awhile.

I don't think Jim is done - unless gets ousted - but its absurd - on several levels


STILL - WE - you reading this - ME (as a page/group admin elsewhere) - we need to change more of "the collective Peoples" mind(s) ... and educate them ...
on the facts and how this issue works ... more gun owners to wake up and get it - and care - beyond their own pocketbook, their "Refund"
(I WANT TO SCREAM this like the dad in "Breaking Away" ... )

and someone else's semblance of a perception of "SAFETY" ...

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

I don't think Jim is done - unless gets ousted - but its absurd - on several levels


STILL - WE - you reading this - ME (as a page/group admin elsewhere) - we need to change more of "the collective Peoples" mind(s) ... and educate them ...
on the facts and how this issue works ... more gun owners to wake up and get it - and care - beyond their own pocketbook, their "Refund"
(I WANT TO SCREAM this like the dad in "Breaking Away" ... )

and someone else's semblance of a perception of "SAFETY" ...

You know we're on the same page here. And I don't disagree with what you said here. However, I said what I said for a couple reasons. First, republican leadership gave us a solid *****-slap this session. A 'shut up and we don't want to hear about this anymore' message. Secondly, as getting a LTCH gets cheaper and now free, the impetus to remove the constitutional infringement lessens. If it's free it doesn't feel much like an infringement anymore. Many people, many gun people feel the LTCH program has value, as an example, they believe that that license sets the good guys apart from the bad guys.

I am more convinced that had we never created the lifetime LTCH and folks were still having to go jump through hoops and pay money every 4 years, this would have been a lot easier. 1424 kicks this particular can down the road for a long time. Cynical? Yeah, it is...

 

[d.kaufman]

You know we're on the same page here. And I don't disagree with what you said here. However, I said what I said for a couple reasons. First, republican leadership gave us a solid *****-slap this session. A 'shut up and we don't want to hear about this anymore' message. Secondly, as getting a LTCH gets cheaper and now free, the impetus to remove the constitutional infringement lessens. If it's free it doesn't feel much like an infringement anymore. Many people, many gun people feel the LTCH program has value, as an example, they believe that that license sets the good guys apart from the bad guys.

I am more convinced that had we never created the lifetime LTCH and folks were still having to go jump through hoops and pay money every 4 years, this would have been a lot easier. 1424 kicks this particular can down the road for a long time. Cynical? Yeah, it is...

I, unfortunately, have to agree with your assessment

 

[brotherbill3]

You know we're on the same page here. And I don't disagree with what you said here. However, I said what I said for a couple reasons. First, republican leadership gave us a solid *****-slap this session. A 'shut up and we don't want to hear about this anymore' message. Secondly, as getting a LTCH gets cheaper and now free, the impetus to remove the constitutional infringement lessens. If it's free it doesn't feel much like an infringement anymore. Many people, many gun people feel the LTCH program has value, as an example, they believe that that license sets the good guys apart from the bad guys.

I am more convinced that had we never created the lifetime LTCH and folks were still having to go jump through hoops and pay money every 4 years, this would have been a lot easier. 1424 kicks this particular can down the road for a long time. Cynical? Yeah, it is...

I, unfortunately, have to agree with your assessment

Oh - I completely agree.

I just am tired of the people that don't show up and only gripe on the internet - and will yell - for a refund or to throw people out;
and then you never see them again ... and they won't or don't talk to their neighbor or stranger or anyone (except a few other gun owners MAYBE)
or let anyone know their position at all in anyway.

And I want to scream at the people that say - well they have to vote the will of the majority of their constituents ... NO
The Oath is to uphold the Constitution;
they are supposed vote within the confines of the limits placed by that to represent the best interest (we're not simple majority rule) of their constituents. ....
They serve the constituents a by leading - and that should include openly educating and standing up for truths and the constitution.
not slaves to near mob rule.

I don't think the 1424 / 237 issue is settled yet though - they are too similar - and both alive. ...
at this point - best I hope for is perhaps we end up with just a 5 yr NICS exempt LTCH and you can hold both at the same time.
Sad we're arguing against ourselves. but that's clean bill that lets the ConC argument stay stronger -

Because all of the arguments against ConC are bogus.

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

Oh - I completely agree.

I just am tired of the people that don't show up and only gripe on the internet - and will yell - for a refund or to throw people out;
and then you never see them again ... and they won't or don't talk to their neighbor or stranger or anyone (except a few other gun owners MAYBE)
or let anyone know their position at all in anyway.

And I want to scream at the people that say - well they have to vote the will of the majority of their constituents ... NO
The Oath is to uphold the Constitution;
they are supposed vote within the confines of the limits placed by that to represent the best interest (we're not simple majority rule) of their constituents. ....
They serve the constituents a by leading - and that should include openly educating and standing up for truths and the constitution.
not slaves to near mob rule.

I don't think the 1424 / 237 issue is settled yet though - they are too similar - and both alive. ...
at this point - best I hope for is perhaps we end up with just a 5 yr NICS exempt LTCH and you can hold both at the same time.
Sad we're arguing against ourselves. but that's clean bill that lets the ConC argument stay stronger -

Because all of the arguments against ConC are bogus.

I think creating this special license might have some unintended consequences we might not like. I'm not a fan.

 

[jamil]

Why try when it gets undone in backroom deals.

The way it should go, the bill gets a vote. If constituents want their rep to vote no, so be it, but they don't get it both ways. If that means they get a ding on their precious NRA rating, well, that's the accurate way.

 

[ATM]

Constitutional carry in Indiana = long guns only.

Support for maintaining this unconstitutional infringement prohibiting handgun carry in Indiana doesn't make any sense at any level.

It's completely indefensible.

 

[d.kaufman]

Constitutional carry in Indiana = long guns only.

Support for maintaining this unconstitutional infringement prohibiting handgun carry in Indiana doesn't make any sense at any level.

It's completely indefensible.

Exactly. Whats more scary to the uninformed? People exercising their God given rights with a ar slung over their back or someone with a handgun on their hip. Makes zero sense whatsoever to me

 

[KellyinAvon]

Gonna go read some amendments, and I agree with the cynicism I just read.

 

[Mgderf]

I'm tired of hearing all the demands for refunds too.
My lifetime license was issued a whopping 2 months after they were first offered.
Not only do I not expect a refund, I've stated before that I would be willing to pay for my lifetime license AGAIN if it would guarantee constitutional carry for the rest of the state.
I'm thinking of my nieces and nephews who are not yet old enough to obtain a license.

If I could guarantee THEIR 2nd amendment liberties, damn right I would pay again, and be glad to do it.

 

[actaeon277]

I'm tired of hearing all the demands for refunds too.
My lifetime license was issued a whopping 2 months after they were first offered.
Not only do I not expect a refund, I've stated before that I would be willing to pay for my lifetime license AGAIN if it would guarantee constitutional carry for the rest of the state.
I'm thinking of my nieces and nephews who are not yet old enough to obtain a license.

If I could guarantee THEIR 2nd amendment liberties, damn right I would pay again, and be glad to do it.

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

I'm tired of hearing all the demands for refunds too.
My lifetime license was issued a whopping 2 months after they were first offered.
Not only do I not expect a refund, I've stated before that I would be willing to pay for my lifetime license AGAIN if it would guarantee constitutional carry for the rest of the state.
I'm thinking of my nieces and nephews who are not yet old enough to obtain a license.

If I could guarantee THEIR 2nd amendment liberties, damn right I would pay again, and be glad to do it.

Sometimes we can't see past our narrow self interests. Awhile back, on a FB thread (I think it was), somebody was going on about getting their money back and what good CC would do them, etc. I reminded them this was not for him or me. This is for setting us up for our kids and grandkids and what kind of state we want them to live in. In that particular case, I think I made a convert.

 

[KellyinAvon]

Where do we go from here? We've gained some ground, SB 33 made a comeback today. HB 1424 (as it is now) and SB 237 seem to be tracking towards the Governor's desk.

Do they think we'll just go away? That's a big no, but where do we go from here? I still say we need someone to bring the different groups and factions together and work towards the goal of ConC as a coalition.

 

[ATM]

...I still say we need someone to bring the different groups and factions together and work towards the goal of ConC as a coalition.

I would suggest reframing the issue for starters. Ditch the notion that we are 'working towards the goal of constitutional carry' (or at least that verbiage) as it is too vague, too easily misrepresented, and much too easily dismissed.

Rather, place the onus directly upon those who wish to 'maintain this unconstitutional infringement prohibiting handgun carry in Indiana' which is the actual root.

Make them support the repugnant prohibition, watch them flail at doing so while trying to avoid the consequences of espousing such an indefensible position.

Make doing nothing less expedient for their political livelihoods.

Just sayin'.

 

[KellyinAvon]

I would suggest reframing the issue for starters. Ditch the notion that we are 'working towards the goal of constitutional carry' (or at least that verbiage) as it is too vague, too easily misrepresented, and much too easily dismissed.

Rather, place the onus directly upon those who wish to 'maintain this unconstitutional infringement prohibiting handgun carry in Indiana' which is the actual root.

Make them support the repugnant prohibition, watch them flail at doing so while trying to avoid the consequences of espousing such an indefensible position.

Make doing nothing less expedient for their political livelihoods.

Just sayin'.

Interesting. How do we move it forward?

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

I would suggest reframing the issue for starters. Ditch the notion that we are 'working towards the goal of constitutional carry' (or at least that verbiage) as it is too vague, too easily misrepresented, and much too easily dismissed.

Rather, place the onus directly upon those who wish to 'maintain this unconstitutional infringement prohibiting handgun carry in Indiana' which is the actual root.

Make them support the repugnant prohibition, watch them flail at doing so while trying to avoid the consequences of espousing such an indefensible position.

Make doing nothing less expedient for their political livelihoods.

Just sayin'.

I mentioned this in another thread but I listened to Guy's Saturday show today. He played a clip of testimony for SB33 I think it is -- the one for church/school carry. In that clip, one of the senators was asking him questions. Your assumption that they'll experience any sort of dissonance and/or epiphany while justifying their support for these sorts of infringements are...pipe dreams. This guy Guy was talking to held his ground (as bad as it was) no matter how Guy explained his error in reasoning. Some people don't use the kind or reasoning and logic to arrive at their positions that you or I might.

 

[Mgderf]

Some people don't use... reasoning and logic..

FIFY