INGO too Harsh

[churchmouse]

INGO, while much more gentle than many other forums, is no-where near the level of kindness I see from some of the forums I frequent.

While many of the bad-apples are gone, many still remain, they've just been reigned in so many times they got the point to calm it down or get the ban-hammer. All the people on my ignore list minus one occasional poster are now gone.

ETA, that being said, good luck getting the mods to keep things civil if they happen to agree with those that are dog-piling. They seem to throw civility out the window when it benefits them (not singling anybody out). I was once the brunt of a dog-pile when questioning a rule-change, mods just let the dog-pile happen because they didn't like the rule-change being questioned.

Interesting.
People can view things in many many ways. Depending on their point of view a dog pile might seem to be allowed. I for one have never allowed a full on dog pile. At least in my point of view. If you would care to PM me a link to said dog pile I would like to take that walk down memory lane. Some good may come of it. Depending on ones point of view.

 

[2A_Tom]

Or been on a submarine.

Wow. I've never considered that aspect before.

 

[actaeon277]

Wow. I've never considered that aspect before.

Put around a hundred guys in a steel pipe, take away the stress relief from "marriage duties", work them long hours, no beer, no sunlight, no nature (dogs, woods, sunlight), add chemical and body odors, yell at them a lot, add stress from doing job that can kill you, add people from another nation trying to kill you...

 

[2A_Tom]

In the Infantry the worst enemy was boredom.

 

[actaeon277]

In the Infantry the worst enemy was boredom.

Oh, that's there also.

You're so bored you wish "something" would happen.
Then the submarine takes a 40 degree dive and the 1MC announces "JAM DIVE! Loss of hydraulics. Rig for deep submergence. Rig for flooding."
And then you go back to wishing for BORING.

 

[actaeon277]

In the Infantry the worst enemy was boredom.

"Peacetime" submariners "as a group" tend to get into "tense" situations with people more than "peacetime" soldiers.
At least in my opinion.

Foreign navies tend to get upset when they find a submarine where they no they don't have any submarines.
Upset usually involves the throwing around highly technical carriers of high explosives.
Hell, surface navies are barely tolerant of submarines they identify as their own.

 

[SnoopLoggyDog]

INGO, while much more gentle than many other forums, is no-where near the level of kindness I see from some of the forums I frequent.

While many of the bad-apples are gone, many still remain, they've just been reigned in so many times they got the point to calm it down or get the ban-hammer. All the people on my ignore list minus one occasional poster are now gone.

ETA, that being said, good luck getting the mods to keep things civil if they happen to agree with those that are dog-piling. They seem to throw civility out the window when it benefits them (not singling anybody out). I was once the brunt of a dog-pile when questioning a rule-change, mods just let the dog-pile happen because they didn't like the rule-change being questioned.

It is true that in the past, there was a tendency to dog-pile unpopular opinions or new ideas. Since then, attitudes have slowly changed and there is a lot more civility. It seems that most of the dog-piling is now gone, due to the diligence of the mods and weeding out of the trolls.

 

[BugI02]

"Peacetime" submariners "as a group" tend to get into "tense" situations with people more than "peacetime" soldiers.
At least in my opinion.

Foreign navies tend to get upset when they find a submarine where they no they don't have any submarines.
Upset usually involves the throwing around highly technical carriers of high explosives.
Hell, surface navies are barely tolerant of submarines they identify as their own.

I think it's an extension of the animosity held towards snipers

 

[actaeon277]

I think it's an extension of the animosity held towards snipers

Kinda similar. Subs are like the navy's version of a scout/sniper, except if you were to replace the sniper rifle with a knife.

 

[actaeon277]

I think it's an extension of the animosity held towards snipers

To expand on this...

Armies (generally) detect and march on each other. Officers make sure they are spotless to "instill confidence" in their men. Their men generally shoot at the "enemy", a generic mass shaped as a man. (NOT always. Just generally). At least, it was viewed that way anyway.

The sniper though, well didn't have officers and enlisted going out in a group. It was in ones and twos. Using optics, he often could see the "man" instead of a generic shape. And, there was no "detect and march on". The sniper snuck up and shot people "unawares".


The navy does it different, yet similar.
They also detect and close on, either visually or radar.
Officers are expected to be clean to set the example and "instill confidence".
Ship battles are done at "range". Even in WWII battles would be 5 to 10 miles between combatants. You barely could identify the "enemy" as a "man".

Subs aren't seen visually or on radar. They sneak up like an assassin.
Officers are generally expected to be clean, but also expected to get dirty as it also sets an example, demonstrates knowledge, and basically subs don't have the large crews other vessels have. I witnessed a new officer being reluctant to climb into and clean a torpedo tube. Told the torpedoman, he didn't have to get dirty. Well, the Captain knew there was going to be a problem (because new officers are like that) so he kinda snuck into the torpedo room behind the officer. When the officer made his statement, the Captain said he didn't remember anything in Navy regulations that said and officer couldn't get dirty. Then he asked the officer to help him out and state the regulation. The officer got a bit red faced. And then grabbed a rag and climbed into the tube.
But, whereas riflemen have approx. the same range as the sniper (maybe not effective range), the submarine closes into knife fighting range. A mile or less, often WAY less.


https://www.revolvy.com/main/index.php?s=Use of the Jolly Roger by submarines&item_type=topic
comments by First Sea Lord Admiral Sir Arthur Wilson, who complained that submarines were "underhanded, unfair, and damned un-

English" and that personnel should be hanged as pirates, Lieutenant Commander Max Horton began flying the flag after returning from successful patrols

speaking about the English flying the pirate flag.


https://www.defensemedianetwork.com/stories/submarine-development/

Leonardo da Vinci, for one, claimed to have figured out how a person could remain submerged for an extended period of time – but also claimed he would never publish the details of this information, “because of the evil nature of men who practice assassination at the bottom of the sea.”

Fulton offered to make submarines for the French – who declined, for both practical and moral reasons.

the French Ministry of the Marine considered the submarine an underhanded tactical weapon, fit for pirates.

This kind of warfare was promptly denounced by other Britons as cowardly, an attitude later summed up by John Jervis, 1st Earl of St. Vincent and admiral of the fleet

The British Royal Navy, it turned out, had no idea what a submarine was for; to the Admiralty, it remained an ungentlemanly nuisance, if not a piratical outrage.

 

[ATM]

Or never been to a steel mill.
Or actaeon's families houses during holidays.

Or been on a submarine.

...or spent time in a turkish prison.

 

[churchmouse]

...or spent time in a turkish prison.

What was the name of that movie...????

 

[actaeon277]

...or spent time in a turkish prison.

One time, and NO ONE let's you forget.
Geesh.

 

[2A_Tom]

Did you stab or get stabbed in the butt?

 

[actaeon277]

Did you stab or get stabbed in the butt?

what happens in the Turkish prison, stays in the Turkish prison.

 

[Mgderf]

WTH?
Ingo is where I come to GET my abuse!

 

[cbhausen]

...or spent time in a turkish prison.

Is that easier or harder than dragging Walton and Lanier up and down the court for 48 minutes?

 

[RobbyMaQ]

I was welcomed to INGO with open arms. I was always honest in my naivety and eager to learn, and hope to continue that trend because there are so many rabbit holes, and so much to learn. Mostly I accepted the mod position so that I could 'give back' and help others in the same way I was welcomed here.

Kill em with kindness... give them some slack for a couple of posts to get a feel for what's going on in their lives. It's not necessarily treating a 'snowflake' with kid gloves every time.... More often than not, they wouldn't be here if they were a snowflake. They may be a noob, or an elder struggling with technology. Hell they may be a regular going through a trying period in their life.

I'm a big believer in letting INGO police itself. Primarily because I've witnessed firsthand, the good that INGO has to offer to every one who is a part of this community. We've been beat down for our love for firearms, freedom, and rights by many in society. And I think on some level we all identify with that, and many prefer to take the higher road. Lead by example... keep in mind we all have our own personal demons and issues. Focus instead on our passion for our shared beliefs, instead of our miniscule differences.

It's easy to criticize. It's much more difficult to step back and figure out how to help & nurture. Even if it's a question that's been asked a gazillion times. And if it is too frustrating for you? Maybe recall what your mother always told you... if you don't have anything good to say, then don't say anything at all. Silence, can also speak volumes sometimes. Just sayin...

And INGO will continue to be better for it. My 2c anyways.

 

[Tactically Fat]

If I'm ever harsh with anyone here on INGO - someone please let me know so that I can mitigate and/or correct my behavior. Please.

Except if it's towards Rhino and/or lovemachine.

 

[Tyler-The-Piker]

INGO is a nice reprieve from other forums that are all like @#$% Jay and silent Bob, @#$% them in their stupid @#$%^&* @#$%^