Let's taser our kids

[phylodog]

Here's a question: would the officers have tased their own children for the same behavior?

I don't like the thought of using a Taser on a child. The reality is that I never liked being called to deal with anyone else's child. The main reason is that nothing I do will not be complained about. God forbid they grab her and put a bruise on her wrist, they're screwed. Hit her with pepper spray and she'd have been screaming for an hour. Raise your voice and you get complained on. It's a no win situation.

That said, I've been waiting for a legitimate reason to Tase my daughter for years.

 

[Rookie]

I don't like the thought of using a Taser on a child. The reality is that I never liked being called to deal with anyone else's child. The main reason is that nothing I do will not be complained about. God forbid they grab her and put a bruise on her wrist, they're screwed. Hit her with pepper spray and she'd have been screaming for an hour. Raise your voice and you get complained on. It's a no win situation.

That said, I've been waiting for a legitimate reason to Tase my daughter for years.

If I have to call you because I can't handle my child, you have my permission to tase me!

You're her dad, that's legitimate enough in my book.

 

[IndyGunworks]

I don't like the thought of using a Taser on a child. The reality is that I never liked being called to deal with anyone else's child. The main reason is that nothing I do will not be complained about. God forbid they grab her and put a bruise on her wrist, they're screwed. Hit her with pepper spray and she'd have been screaming for an hour. Raise your voice and you get complained on. It's a no win situation.

That said, I've been waiting for a legitimate reason to Tase my daughter for years.

Does that mean you have been tasing them for years w/out a legitimate reason?

 

[Lectric102002]

You can get about 15A at a standard lighting outlet and 20A through an appliance outlet....but you would never get that flow through the human body. It's a lousy conductor.

Except when wet. Then it's a great conductor. Current tends to flow on the surface of a conductor. Hence the term "skin effect".

The amount of current that will flow through the body is a math problem: Current (amperes) = voltage divided by resistance. I=E/R

 

[phylodog]

Does that mean you have been tasing them for years w/out a legitimate reason?

Nah, I don't even have one. I've never had a use for them. The primary selling point of the Taser to police administrators is to prevent injury to officers when going hands on. I was always a bit partial to going hands on (when required/justified), never had much interest in shocking anyone. I had one issued to me for 9 years and never even thought about using it.

 

[88GT]

I don't like the thought of using a Taser on a child. The reality is that I never liked being called to deal with anyone else's child. The main reason is that nothing I do will not be complained about. God forbid they grab her and put a bruise on her wrist, they're screwed. Hit her with pepper spray and she'd have been screaming for an hour. Raise your voice and you get complained on. It's a no win situation.

That said, I've been waiting for a legitimate reason to Tase my daughter for years.

I understand there's no winning. But that stems largely from the fact that this is a parenting issue and LE shouldn't be called in. For the situation in this thread, it's a bit different since it's a babysitter involved. I think LE being called in this case is acceptable as the babysitter doesn't have all the permissions a parent does to deal with the situation.

But I return to the fact that it seems that the taser was the solution of first choice. I would think a child of that age would warrant just a little bit more than 2 minutes attempt to disarm her or she faces the Taser. I am perfectly willing to backtrack and change my opinion if it can be shown that they exhausted all other means and gave those efforts more than the obligatory try for try's sake before resorting to the Taser, or if there was some specific behavior on the part of the girl that warranted it. I'm sure it was the easiest solution. I'm not sure it was called for.

 

[phylodog]

I think the perception of the Taser to many is different than the way the law looks at it. It is considered a relatively low scale use of force; no lasting affects other than two small puncture wounds if probes are used. Physical strikes and kicks as well as baton strikes cause real damage and pepper spray causes pretty substantial discomfort for a considerable length of time. All of these could be construed as a form of punishment.

A Taser is literally like a light switch, pain is on then pain is off. It's not an electrocution and barring chemicals in the system or significant medical issues it has an extremely low chance of real damage (when used appropriately). It gains compliance immediately in well over 90% of those who experience it. I don't like being Tased, it hurts like hell but once it's off the pain is gone immediately.

Not saying it was used appropriately in this case because I don't know enough about the situation. I will say that given the choice of taking a chance of being cut open with a knife or using a Taser I'd use a Taser, even on an 8 year old if it came down to that. Infections, biohazards, stitches and scars are not things I signed up to willingly accept. I have as much of a right to avoid them as anyone else.

 

[88GT]

I think the perception of the Taser to many is different than the way the law looks at it. It is considered a relatively low scale use of force; no lasting affects other than two small puncture wounds if probes are used. Physical strikes and kicks as well as baton strikes cause real damage and pepper spray causes pretty substantial discomfort for a considerable length of time. All of these could be construed as a form of punishment.

A Taser is literally like a light switch, pain is on then pain is off. It's not an electrocution and barring chemicals in the system or significant medical issues it has an extremely low chance of real damage (when used appropriately). It gains compliance immediately in well over 90% of those who experience it. I don't like being Tased, it hurts like hell but once it's off the pain is gone immediately.

Not saying it was used appropriately in this case because I don't know enough about the situation. I will say that given the choice of taking a chance of being cut open with a knife or using a Taser I'd use a Taser, even on an 8 year old if it came down to that. Infections, biohazards, stitches and scars are not things I signed up to willingly accept. I have as much of a right to avoid them as anyone else.

As would I, but it doesn't seem like that was the case. And the girl simply having the knife in hand doesn't really make it necessary to go to that choice.

 

[Timjoebillybob]

False dilemma. Are you telling me that's the only other option?

Nope. You're the one that stated there were better options.

I wouldn't care if the tasing were a last resort option. Pretty sure it wasn't.


Anything but the taser and the firearm, for starters.

I can handle my 8 year old son and there's far less disparity of size and force between us than there was between this girl and the FOUR grown men who responded.

Here's a question: would the officers have tased their own children for the same behavior?

Other than a taser or firearms, what options would you do?

I think the perception of the Taser to many is different than the way the law looks at it. It is considered a relatively low scale use of force; no lasting affects other than two small puncture wounds if probes are used. Physical strikes and kicks as well as baton strikes cause real damage and pepper spray causes pretty substantial discomfort for a considerable length of time. All of these could be construed as a form of punishment.

A Taser is literally like a light switch, pain is on then pain is off. It's not an electrocution and barring chemicals in the system or significant medical issues it has an extremely low chance of real damage (when used appropriately). It gains compliance immediately in well over 90% of those who experience it. I don't like being Tased, it hurts like hell but once it's off the pain is gone immediately.

Not saying it was used appropriately in this case because I don't know enough about the situation. I will say that given the choice of taking a chance of being cut open with a knife or using a Taser I'd use a Taser, even on an 8 year old if it came down to that. Infections, biohazards, stitches and scars are not things I signed up to willingly accept. I have as much of a right to avoid them as anyone else.

I'm not saying it was appropriate or not in this case. Just saying that it may not have been a bad choice.

As would I, but it doesn't seem like that was the case. And the girl simply having the knife in hand doesn't really make it necessary to go to that choice.

You would prefer to be tased rather than cut open, but when the cops used one on a girl with a knife and was threatening to do just that to herself you state it was a poor option.

 

[GlockRock]

I'd like to know how the "negotiations" went as well between the officers and child.

 

[88GT]

Other than a taser or firearms, what options would you do?

Asked and answered.

You would prefer to be tased rather than cut open, but when the cops used one on a girl with a knife and was threatening to do just that to herself you state it was a poor option.

No, I said I would rather use the Taser than risk being cut by someone else.

When LE can show that they were at risk of imminent bodily harm, I will be the first to accept the use of the Taser. The girl having the knife does not inherently create that risk, and I have not read any details that said she made threatening moves or attempt to cut the LEOs.

 

[mrjarrell]

Mom sues after cops tased her 8-year-old - CNN.com

 

[Rookie]

It was a 70 pound, 8 year old, Indian girl. Well, that changes everything! She was Indian! Hang the cops!

 

[HoughMade]

It was a 70 pound, 8 year old, Indian girl. Well, that changes everything! She was Indian! Hang the cops!

Dot or feather?

 

[Timjoebillybob]

I can't say I think it was an appropriate response. Four grown adult men and a taser is the best solution? I don't think so.

False dilemma. Are you telling me that's the only other option?

Do you really need someone to tell you what all the options are for dealing with an 8-year-old girl?

Are you a parent?

I wouldn't care if the tasing were a last resort option. Pretty sure it wasn't.


Anything but the taser and the firearm, for starters.

I can handle my 8 year old son and there's far less disparity of size and force between us than there was between this girl and the FOUR grown men who responded.

Here's a question: would the officers have tased their own children for the same behavior?

I understand there's no winning. But that stems largely from the fact that this is a parenting issue and LE shouldn't be called in. For the situation in this thread, it's a bit different since it's a babysitter involved. I think LE being called in this case is acceptable as the babysitter doesn't have all the permissions a parent does to deal with the situation.

But I return to the fact that it seems that the taser was the solution of first choice. I would think a child of that age would warrant just a little bit more than 2 minutes attempt to disarm her or she faces the Taser. I am perfectly willing to backtrack and change my opinion if it can be shown that they exhausted all other means and gave those efforts more than the obligatory try for try's sake before resorting to the Taser, or if there was some specific behavior on the part of the girl that warranted it. I'm sure it was the easiest solution. I'm not sure it was called for.

As would I, but it doesn't seem like that was the case. And the girl simply having the knife in hand doesn't really make it necessary to go to that choice.

Asked and answered.

No, I said I would rather use the Taser than risk being cut by someone else.

When LE can show that they were at risk of imminent bodily harm, I will be the first to accept the use of the Taser. The girl having the knife does not inherently create that risk, and I have not read any details that said she made threatening moves or attempt to cut the LEOs.

It was answered? Can you show me where you answered? Other than saying that you don't think it was justified and you can handle your son without a taser?
And actualy the quote you responded to was that he would rather be tasered than cut open, you replied "so would I", no mention of it being done by another person.

 

[Denny347]

Here's a question: would the officers have tased their own children for the same behavior?

Plenty would. Look, I'm not arguing that tazing the kid was the most appropriate response but the lawsuit is based on lies.

 

[88GT]

It was answered? Can you show me where you answered? Other than saying that you don't think it was justified and you can handle your son without a taser?

The part where I said anything but the taser or a firearm. Talking, singing, asking her to put it down. You are either too daft to put 2 and 2 together to make 4 or your are being deliberately obtuse. Since I rather doubt the former, it must be the latter.

And actualy the quote you responded to was that he would rather be tasered than cut open, you replied "so would I", no mention of it being done by another person.

Here is the quote as I quoted it. It may have been edited since I quoted it.

I will say that given the choice of taking a chance of being cut open with a knife or using a Taser I'd use a Taser,

So you mis-read the comment if you thought he was saying he would rather be Tased than knifed.

Plenty would. Look, I'm not arguing that tazing the kid was the most appropriate response but the lawsuit is based on lies.

What are the lies? Not arguing, honestly wondering. The information I've read is sketchy, at best.

 

[Timjoebillybob]

Plenty would. Look, I'm not arguing that tazing the kid was the most appropriate response but the lawsuit is based on lies.

I just remembered, iirc there was a cop that was discussed on here that used one on his (step?)son for discipline and I think but not sure pepper sprayed him also.

The part where I said anything but the taser or a firearm. Talking, singing, asking her to put it down. You are either too daft to put 2 and 2 together to make 4 or your are being deliberately obtuse. Since I rather doubt the former, it must be the latter.

Here is the quote as I quoted it. It may have been edited since I quoted it.

So you mis-read the comment if you thought he was saying he would rather be Tased than knifed. Perhaps a bit more specific than talking/singing/asking her to put it down, or what you would do if those didn't work.


What are the lies? Not arguing, honestly wondering. The information I've read is sketchy, at best.

Neither one actually. I'm asking for more specific answers, other than anything but a gun/taser. Perhaps a bit more specific than talk/sing/anything, or what would you do if talking didn't work?

And yes I misread or misremembered the comment. I may have gotten it confused with the one where they said they would rather be tased than hit with 110 household current.

And I'd say this one for starters in regards to the lies, "The force of the electricity shot through her body, lifted her, and threw her against a wall." And quite a few of the comments were while possibly not lies, were imo extreme hyperbole. ETA Oh and the "paring knife" that the attorney was talking about was actually according to the babysitter and the officer a steak knife, and the "emergency medical care" was band aids.

Here is report from the investigation by the state DCI on the incident.
http://www.drgnews.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/Report-on-2013-Tasing-Incident.pdf

 

[88GT]

Neither one actually. I'm asking for more specific answers, other than anything but a gun/taser. Perhaps a bit more specific than talk/sing/anything, or what would you do if talking didn't work?

Why? It's not rocket science. Ideally, she could be convinced to put the knife down on her own, without someone sending jolts of electricity through her body. How, you ask? Any ****ing way they can to avoid physical force. Why does this have to be so difficult?

 

[Timjoebillybob]

Why? It's not rocket science. Ideally, she could be convinced to put the knife down on her own, without someone sending jolts of electricity through her body. How, you ask? Any ****ing way they can to avoid physical force. Why does this have to be so difficult?

It doesn't have to be that difficult. Simply answer what would you do if talking/singing doesn't work? Read the report I linked. They asked/they told/they told her everything would be alright. This was after the babysitter had already tried the same. What they got in response was her thrusting the knife at one of the officers, shaking her head, and trying to get away by going down a hallway. So what would you do in that situation? You did state you would use a taser instead of being cut by someone else. So I'm assuming you wouldn't be going hands on. Pepper spray?