open carry stopped by hobart pd while pumping gas

[bradmedic04]

Was the OP arrested?
It wasn't clear in the video.
I think the officer said the OP was "detained for now" or something like that.

He wasn't. I should have said "grounds for legal search" instead.

 

[dansgotguns]

No I wasnt arrested hw put my gun in my car told mw not to load it until he left and then tme I had old ammo....which my ammo is fine I sarcastically agreed woth him and I left

 

[actaeon277]

Once the LTCH was presented, why the driver's license? He was not driving, and he had already presented an ID.

Confiscate the gun? No threatening gestures, no threats made, voice not raised....

Pointing the gun at the OP, great weapons handling there Mr 20+ years Officer.

 

[Sylvain]

No I wasnt arrested hw put my gun in my car told mw not to load it until he left and then tme I had old ammo....which my ammo is fine I sarcastically agreed woth him and I left

Did he remove the mag and the chambered round or emptied the entire mag?

 

[dansgotguns]

Thanks for all the support guys, actually thought there would be more negative comments, wait...did I see a negative comment yet? I honestly didn't think I did so well. Looking back there's so much I wouldve said, I was just trying to get done with it cuz I was in a hurry thats why I gave my DL when I knew I didnt have to, then when he grabbed my gun...well im sure you can giess the feelings.

 

[Sylvain]

Once the LTCH was presented, why the driver's license? He was not driving, and he had already presented an ID.

Confiscate the gun? No threatening gestures, no threats made, voice not raised....

Pointing the gun at the OP, great weapons handling there Mr 20+ years Officer.

Good thing it's not illegal for LEOs to point loaded guns at people.

 

[dansgotguns]

Did he remove the mag and the chambered round or emptied the entire mag?

Didnt empty mag just chamber and removed mag

 

[JMoses]

Yeah, I thought this wasn't the case. Solely carrying a firearm doesn't, as far as I know, provide just cause for an officer to arrest in Indiana, correct? I thought there had to be mitigating circumstances, like an actual crime being involved.

It's criminal offense to carry a firearm in Indiana without a license to carry, Indiana isn't an "open carry" state like others that allow it without a LTCH. So, an officer can ask and you can be arrested for carrying without a LTCH if you don't either provide the LTCH or info for the officer to check.

 

[Sylvain]

Thanks for all the support guys, actually thought there would be more negative comments, wait...did I see a negative comment yet? I honestly didn't think I did so well. Looking back there's so much I wouldve said, I was just trying to get done with it cuz I was in a hurry thats why I gave my DL when I knew I didnt have to, then when he grabbed my gun...well im sure you can giess the feelings.

I guess there is not much you can do if a cop wants to grab your gun besides saying that you dont agree or whatever.

Oh and the negative comments will probably come later."If you didn't OC you would not have been stopped!".

 

[Roadie]

It's criminal offense to carry a firearm in Indiana without a license to carry, Indiana isn't an "open carry" state like others that allow it without a LTCH. So, an officer can ask and you can be arrested for carrying without a LTCH if you don't either provide the LTCH or info for the officer to check.

Again.. No, you can't... or should I say.. "No, that is not LEGALLY correct"? CAN they? Sure. Is it legal? Not according to precedent.

United States v. Black, 707 F.3d 531, 540 (4th Cir. 2013) (“Where a
state permits individuals to openly carry firearms, the exercise of this right, without more, cannot justify
an investigatory detention.”). Thus, officers stopping an individual for carrying a firearm must be able to
point to additional suspect behavior that led them to believe criminal activity was afoot. There is NO
Indiana statutory authority that permits an officer to stop an individual carrying a handgun
solely for the purpose of verifying the existence of a valid handgun license.


Unless you think the Courts, IMPD, and the lawyers here on INGO are ALL wrong, but YOU are right?

You really think IMPD did this without LEGAL precedent? Without running it by their lawyers? Seriously?

 

[Roadie]

IC does discuss seizure of a handgun, BTW. If I understand correctly.. Suspect must be dangerous, and a warrant must be obtained. If no warrant was obtained, the Officer must be able to provide to articulate to the court, IN WRITING, why the suspect was dangerous, and a seizure was performed..

 

[sadclownwp]

I would love to hear what some Lawyers think of this whole thing, hoping one will chime in soon.

 

[dansgotguns]

I would love to hear what some Lawyers think of this whole thing, hoping one will chime in soon.

This^

and holy cow the video is at like 600 views already. And it isnt a public video. Im thinking about making it public now.

 

[cbhausen]

This^

and holy cow the video is at like 600 views already. And it isnt a public video. Im thinking about making it public now.

You should have seen a lawyer first. Before posting ANYTHING. Just stop now. And get a lawyer.

Edit: I'd even take the private video down until reviewed by an attorney. But that's me erring on the side of caution. Let 'em see it in discovery.

 

[sig-guy]

I really hope you contact a lawyer.

Backwards cap?

 

[sadclownwp]

Just to be clear, you had a military ID, so you either were or currently are enlisted in some branch of the armed forces? Would that not make a delicious title for the video, "Hobart Officer Harasses Soldier (or Former Soldier) for Exercising Freedom He Fought to Protect".

 

[Frank_N_Stein]

Roadie, for some reason my computer won't let me quote your post. You are correct that Indiana Code does discuss the seizure of firearms from an individual, but that applies to situations involving individuals deemed dangerous as a result of mental illness or defect. It does not apply to run-of-the-mill interactions between LE and an armed citizen.

 

[cobber]

IC does discuss seizure of a handgun, BTW. If I understand correctly.. Suspect must be dangerous, and a warrant must be obtained. If no warrant was obtained, the Officer must be able to provide to articulate to the court, IN WRITING, why the suspect was dangerous, and a seizure was performed..

Dangerous to themselves or others.

An officer may seek a warrant to seize, or responding to a call, an officer may seize. Need a court hearing in either case, or the guns go back. These are non-criminal seizures. The standard at hearing is clear and convincing, as opposed to BRD.

W/ re to the writing, officer can use a fill in the blank affidavit. Doesn't have to write an essay. But the subject (not suspect) is always entitled to a hearing. And judges DO return firearms. The form affidavit wouldn't work well for a warrant.

If there's an allegation of a criminal offense involving the gun, it is simply collected as evidence and stays there until the case is settled. No court hearing required for that one.

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

 

[JMoses]

Again.. No, you can't... or should I say.. "No, that is not LEGALLY correct"? CAN they? Sure. Is it legal? Not according to precedent.

United States v. Black, 707 F.3d 531, 540 (4th Cir. 2013) (“Where a
state permits individuals to openly carry firearms, the exercise of this right, without more, cannot justify
an investigatory detention.”). Thus, officers stopping an individual for carrying a firearm must be able to
point to additional suspect behavior that led them to believe criminal activity was afoot. There is NO
Indiana statutory authority that permits an officer to stop an individual carrying a handgun
solely for the purpose of verifying the existence of a valid handgun license.


Unless you think the Courts, IMPD, and the lawyers here on INGO are ALL wrong, but YOU are right?

You really think IMPD did this without LEGAL precedent? Without running it by their lawyers? Seriously?

Well, since you're playing bar stool attorney, hopefully someone here will take your advice and refuse to show their LTCH or give any info and get locked up, maybe you can go bond them out.