Remembering the Waco Massacre

[hooky]

Don't forget Elian Gonzales too.

 

[spearheadersarge]

The realization that these two disticntly related incidents were the driving factor behind Tim McVeigh really brought it home to me. McV definitely thought the govt overstepped their bounds. He was insenced with the deaths caused at each location and the resulting non-criminal actions being attributed to the feds. This hatred was his justification for Oklahoma City. Fast forward 10 years and we now have widespread SWAT style raids for miniscule amounts of marijuana. People are being gunned down in their own homes by the feds and local LE, sometimes mistakenly due to the cops incompetence! There is a growing fear of the govt all across the country. The debt and the inability of the govt to get control of its finances and the ever growing dependency of the takers in our society force those with their heads not in the sand to prepare. Add to that the constant influx of ilegals and the secular progressive movement towards socialism and even the average Joe can get an idea what the feds are capable of. Justification can be manufactured for any reason and warrants issued with the right judge everywhere. People beware! You heard it here first!

 

[J_Wales]

pacem ora para bellum

 

[Kutnupe14]

Don't forget Elian Gonzales too.

You're kidding right?
Kid is kidnapped by wife, sailed on a rickety aluminum boat across the Gulf placing him in danger, wife drowns enroute, family in the US (who your child has never met) are given custody of the child in the meantime. Father in Cuba is furious that his wife was an idiot, and demands HIS child back. Cuban American family members refuse to give the child back because they don't like Castro.
International affair that falls outside of local LE jurisdiction. And you think that raid was unjustified?

No way, the Feds got it right. Parental custody shouldn't have political overtones.

 

[hooky]

You're kidding right?
Kid is kidnapped by wife, sailed on a rickety aluminum boat across the Gulf placing him in danger, wife drowns enroute, family in the US (who your child has never met) are given custody of the child in the meantime. Father in Cuba is furious that his wife was an idiot, and demands HIS child back. Cuban American family members refuse to give the child back because they don't like Castro.
International affair that falls outside of local LE jurisdiction. And you think that raid was unjustified?

No way, the Feds got it right. Parental custody shouldn't have political overtones.

You had me up until the political overtones part.

Feds (SWAT team of 8 BP agents and another 100 plus INS agents) seized the kid at gunpoint on 4/22 after a 4/13 deadline that Reno set expired. There were negotiations going on the entire time until Reno declared there weren't any workable solutions. A court ruling from the 11th circuit on 4/19 said he could stay in the US until an Asylum hearing in May. Yet the day after that ruling on 4/20 Reno just decided to take matters into her own hands, despite the 11th's decision.

So the answer is "No, I'm not kidding."

And for the record, this isn't a diatribe against law enforcement. This is a direct reflection on Federal Leadership and their blatant disregard for the system as it was set up by our founders.

 

[rambone]

Sonny Bono grills Janet Reno about Waco

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hswcbvx2Z8c

 

[jedi]

Don't forget Elian Gonzales too.

Hey at least the fed has good trigger finger control on this one. Look where his finger is at.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hswcbvx2Z8c

& again NOTHING became of it. Just like all the other hearings before and after that one on every topic at hand.

 

[Kutnupe14]

You had me up until the political overtones part.

Feds (SWAT team of 8 BP agents and another 100 plus INS agents) seized the kid at gunpoint on 4/22 after a 4/13 deadline that Reno set expired. There were negotiations going on the entire time until Reno declared there weren't any workable solutions. A court ruling from the 11th circuit on 4/19 said he could stay in the US until an Asylum hearing in May. Yet the day after that ruling on 4/20 Reno just decided to take matters into her own hands, despite the 11th's decision.

So the answer is "No, I'm not kidding."

And for the record, this isn't a diatribe against law enforcement. This is a direct reflection on Federal Leadership and their blatant disregard for the system as it was set up by our founders.

Dude, someone kidnaps my child, and Im going to DEMAND that someone puts a gun in their face pronto.

Honestly, that whole situation goes above politics. A surviving parent, dare I say, has the God give right (if fit), to keep possession of their child, regardless of the what borders they reside.

We have a father in Cuba who wanted his child back; a child that he has 100% more claim over any other person on the planet. And you have a group of people that are intent on denying him custody. IMO, they could have broke down the door day and I wouldn't have had an issue with it.

 

[Lex Concord]

Dude, someone kidnaps my child, and Im going to DEMAND that someone puts a gun in their face pronto.

Honestly, that whole situation goes above politics. A surviving parent, dare I say, has the God give right (if fit), to keep possession of their child, regardless of the what borders they reside.

We have a father in Cuba who wanted his child back; a child that he has 100% more claim over any other person on the planet. And you have a group of people that are intent on denying him custody. IMO, they could have broke down the door day and I wouldn't have had an issue with it.

Can you cite a source for his being "kidnapped" by his mother? I just searched (my Google-fu is generally strong) and I couldn't find an indication one way or another.

If she had custody in Cuba, it is not a kidnapping, but I can't confirm or refute. Can you?

 

[rambone]

Ken Fawcett: "The ATF Injured It's Own Men At Waco, TX"

More on the subject of WACO, TEXAS.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I9-BFVNPoHc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4HChgWakdI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rfktjHAdUog

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-hw4geqxtgA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mnN4sP2O9ok

 

[Lex Concord]

I "met" Reno once. Chose to stand to the side holding purses and coats rather than be in the picture..this event is why...watched her SS agent fall asleep behind her while she spoke on stage....priceless...need to transfer that VHS to digital.

 

[rambone]

David Koresh's video message to police after the shootout

www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbQFB8crxok

 

[John Galt]

We have the government our Founding Fathers tried to protect us from.

 

[level.eleven]

Here is a novel idea. Don't start a death cult that diddles kids and sells full auto weapons and you don't have to worry about tanks.

 

[The Bubba Effect]

Here is a novel idea. Don't start a death cult that diddles kids and sells full auto weapons and you don't have to worry about tanks.

Here's a novel idea, Lon Horiuchi can burn in hell.

 

[level.eleven]

Here's a novel idea, Lon Horiuchi can burn in hell.

Lon answered the call when asked by his nation. You aren't besmirching an American hero, are you? Crime was afoot and he responded. He is a proud member of the brotherhood. He does bad things while you sleep to assure your freedom.

 

[drillsgt]

Yep, they did. Legal warrant, legally attempted to be served. After being tipped off that the Feds were coming to serve said legal warrant, the Davidians began arming themselves.

I certainly think the ATF botched the raid, but there was going to be bloodshed of some sort anyway you look at how it could have unfolded. psychopaths and pedophiles, with guns, don't like it when the Feds come knockin.

The Feds certainly saved those 20 children from having to worry about pedophiles ever again.

 

[The Bubba Effect]

Lon answered the call when asked by his nation. You aren't besmirching an American hero, are you? Crime was afoot and he responded. He is a proud member of the brotherhood. He does bad things while you sleep to assure your freedom.

I'm not besmirching any hero. I don't know what bad things he's doing in my sleep, but if I catch him doing it in my house you'll see it on the news.

 

[CarmelHP]

Lon answered the call when asked by his nation. You aren't besmirching an American hero, are you? Crime was afoot and he responded. He is a proud member of the brotherhood. He does bad things while you sleep to assure your freedom.

That's why the Feds had to keep him under wraps when Idaho indicted him, because he was such a big hero. Who called him to shoot mothers out from under their babies?

 

[CarmelHP]

The Feds certainly saved those 20 children from having to worry about pedophiles ever again.

They had to destroy them in order to save them.