Saint John Indiana, NOT gun friendly

[thebishopp]

Congrats on the win and settlement, sorry about the problems with the permit. Based on that IC that was posted you probably shouldn't even of had to go to court again. Hopefully whatever settlement you got or are going to get from the City includes all the hassle you had to deal with getting your permit back.

 

[Wild Deuce]

Bill B, PM'd you.

 

[mkbar80]

Congrats on the win and settlement, sorry about the problems with the permit. Based on that IC that was posted you probably shouldn't even of had to go to court again. Hopefully whatever settlement you got or are going to get from the City includes all the hassle you had to deal with getting your permit back.

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[jedi]

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From what I recall the criminal charges did not make it to court. I think they were dropped prior to a hearing but the SJPD still send the initial arrest to the ISP which in turn used the "not proper person" to flag Bill B's permit. Bill B then sued the town of St. John but before that went to court the town settled with him (details of settlement as far as I know were never posted on INGO & I have never asked Bill B about them). So the last step was to restore his IN LTCH and for that Bill B and his ATTY went to a hearing in INDY over the issue. At the hearing from what we read here on INGO the case had a very extremely weak case. After the hearing Bill B was told it would take a few weeks for the judge(s) to make a decision and send that decision to the ISP.

& that is where we are now at. It appears the the judges have not made a decision on the case. Not sure how long they can "sit" on not making a decision. No idea if there is anything/anyone that can push for the decision to be made or if by law there is a certain time limit before a "default" decision is made.

 

[mainjet]

Bill B -Just wondering if your wife also lost her LTCH and if she had to go through all the steps that you have had to go through.

Did she have to go before the ISP board also?

 

[snowwalker]

Bill B., I'm so sorry to read about all this junk that you went through, but some good has come out of it for all of us, or at least I've learned a few things. I was shot four times three years ago, got my LTCH in Sept of that year and now just about won't leave the house without my Kahr. I've joined Ingo to learn and have not been disappointed at the education I've received and it is ever evolving!! I owe all of you alot of thanks. This is one of the biggest reasons I don't like to OC, just not for me, I think my stress level is high enough. God bless you and all on Ingo.

p.s. Can someone pm me how to get some Ingo gear (hat, coffee cup, etc.)?

 

[mkbar80]

Thanks, I'd been following this intermittently

Won't let me rep Jediagh....can someone hook him up?

 

[Bill B]

Bill B -Just wondering if your wife also lost her LTCH and if she had to go through all the steps that you have had to go through.

Did she have to go before the ISP board also?

Ooh, touchy subject with her. Nothing happened to her at all. Nothing, nada, zip. The "officer" directed all his ire and angst against me, charges were filed against me, and I was the one arrested. I think that she was kinda disappointed that she didn't get arrested too (don't tell her I said that).

Just to be clear, I had to go to court three times before common sense prevailed and the criminal charges were dropped, and I have been to Indy once for the LTCH hearing.
I was arrested on the last Friday in May, first hearing was in July, that one was just reading the charges and me saying not guilty; next hearing was in August, which was a "status hearing" to see if I made a plea agreement of some sort, and to set a trial date (June 5, 2011), that was when my attorney made a motion to dismiss. The last hearing was in October after the prosecutor had time to look at the depositions from the vicitim, the responding "officer" and the "investigating officer." At this hearing the prosecutor moved to dismiss, which the court ordered, and we moved to have the no contact order removed, which was also ordered. In Novemeber I go the suspension letter from the ISP with a hearing date of Feb, which my lawyer had continued until Mar. 10.
So, more than a year later and all this crap still isn't finished

 

[Bill B]

@ snowwalker: From a personal standpoint, if it helps someone in the future I'm glad. From a financial standpoint I'd rather forgoe the honor.
My best suggestion, take a class that deals with firearms law in Indiana. I knew that I did nothing wrong, and would not let the "officer" bait me into an arguement. When it became clear what he was trying to do, I just shut up and wouldn't play his game; which I think really pissed him off.
TAKE A CLASS!!!

 

[jedi]

@ snowwalker: From a personal standpoint, if it helps someone in the future I'm glad. From a financial standpoint I'd rather forgoe the honor.
My best suggestion, take a class that deals with firearms law in Indiana. I knew that I did nothing wrong, and would not let the "officer" bait me into an arguement. When it became clear what he was trying to do, I just shut up and wouldn't play his game; which I think really pissed him off.
TAKE A CLASS!!!

u mean take the Comprehensive Indiana Gun Law: July 30; September 10

Tactical Firearms Training, LLC



That class BTW many of us have taken and is worth it's weight in GOLD!

 

[mainjet]

Ooh, touchy subject with her. Nothing happened to her at all. Nothing, nada, zip. The "officer" directed all his ire and angst against me, charges were filed against me, and I was the one arrested. I think that she was kinda disappointed that she didn't get arrested too (don't tell her I said that).

son-of-a-gun that is what I thought. I started thinking back and it hit me, we never really heard anything about your wife getting into trouble. Wow, I wonder how they explain that. You were both there doing the same thing and you both had guns. Yet only you get arrested and charged.

I hope whatever agreement you came to with St. John didn't end because the costs and the trouble sure are not over for you yet.

I remember after you had your hearing I predicted you would have your license back in two weeks. BOY was I ever wrong.

Well I wish you continued success in this. It's been a long hard battle for you. It's certainly always easier to read about someone elses battle than it is to go through it yourself.

 

[Bill B]

DONE, FINITO, OVER, FINISHED

I GOT MY LICENSE BACK TODAY!!!!!!!
14 months after the "incident" and arrest, 8 months after my license was suspended, 4 months after the hearing, $5000 in lawyer costs, several days off work, and tons of rolaids later.
All because somone who is friends with officers on the SJPD saw my handgun and didn't like it. If you are ever involved in drawing it or a shoot I can imagine ten times the legal bills (mine would have doubled had we gone to trial), and many years of aggrevation.

 

[Rookie]

ABOUT TIME! Congratulations.

 

[Kitty]

PARTY!!!!

Congrats Bill! Sorry you had to go through so much but it has to feel great now that everything is over.

 

[singlestacksig]

if this had happened under the new law, do you think you could sue the department or officers?

 

[Bill B]

if this had happened under the new law, do you think you could sue the department or officers?

Highly unlikely as they went to a prosecutor with their "evidence" and the proscecutor went to a judge. The NRA wouldn't touch it (nor any other group I talked to) for this reason.
And most of attorneys that I talked to (that were recommended by various groups) wanted $6-10K to really pursue it.
The US Dept of Justice civil rights division will only investigate after a pattern of complaints and the Indiana civil rights commission is more concerned about housing discrimination than anything else.

 

[singlestacksig]

it would make an interesting story for a gun mag.. how one town used prosecution to harass a lawful gun carrier...

 

[Kitty]

it would make an interesting story for a gun mag.. how one town used prosecution to harass a lawful gun carrier...

Stories like that do tend to do "well".

 

[jedi]

Congrdas Bill. Now the next time we see we are all going to report you as MWG so you can go thru this all over again. "Officer I was so SSSSRRRAACCCCEEEEEDDD for my life and he was waving that big black gun all over the place. My kid could have seen it officer!!!"

Mind you Bill B's gun is a 2 tone.

 

[Hoosierdood]

Congrats Bill!! I say we stage an open carry event in Saint Johns to celebrate! :