The massacre at Fort Hood and Muslim soldiers with attitude

[cce1302]

How many are waiting? We won't know until they do it. If people are not disallowed the lawful ability to exercise their right of self-defense, the extent of damage will be minimized.

Micropercentage, in my post, referred to the millions worldwide who follow that religion. Of those millions, it takes 10,000 to make a single percentage point. I don't think there have been 10,000 of every million who have committed these radical acts, certainly not within our country.

In fairness, I should say I do not have data to support that hypothesis, it's just a guess.

Blessings,
Bill

Bill,
I believe you are grasping at straws throughout this thread.
For instance, do you believe that less than 1 percent of muslims are violent radicals? You would not have counted this murdering soldier as a violent radical until yesterday, but I'm sure he didn't become radical when he woke up yesterday morning. Just because they haven't yet gone to their 72 virgins doesn't make them normal.
Wasn't there a survey taken just a year or two ago, that pointed out that something like 25% of American muslims respected the radicals that waged war on the US?
The number of muslims that follow the Koran's extreme teachings of violence against us infidels is much higher than I think you are willing to admit.

-This post is in no way intended to discriminate against individual persons based on their race; color; ethnicity; country, state, or region of origin; religion; sexual preference; education or lack thereof; gender, trans-gender, intergender; integer, fraction, decimal, or whole number; choice to wear and/or not wear objects resembling and/or not resembling rags or towels upon their head; age; experience or inexperience; handicap; ability or disability; documented or undocumented status; legal residence; taxpayer status; emancipation status; or any other factor which might be found offensive.

 

[Bill of Rights]

Except we know this is absolutely false. Substantial percentages of Muslims in non-Arab countries, nearing majorities, and majorities in Arab countries, answer surveys in which they espouse approval of suicide bombing and violence against non-Muslims. Those percentages add up to hundreds of millions of people. To pretend otherwise is ridiculous.

OK... So what do you propose? How do you plan to address this problem without becoming that which we despise and decry?

Blessings,
Bill

 

[CarmelHP]

OK... So what do you propose? How do you plan to address this problem without becoming that which we despise and decry?

Blessings,
Bill

Well, I'd start by throwing out of the Army any crazy-a@@ed loon who started saying he thought suicide bombing was a good idea. That might be too 'radical" for you, but it's a good start IMO. Burying your head in the sand, shouting nananananana and hoping it all goes away is not a sound strategy.

 

[Bill of Rights]

Bill,
I believe you are grasping at straws throughout this thread.
For instance, do you believe that less than 1 percent of muslims are violent radicals? You would not have counted this murdering soldier as a violent radical until yesterday, but I'm sure he didn't become radical when he woke up yesterday morning. Just because they haven't yet gone to their 72 virgins doesn't make them normal.
Wasn't there a survey taken just a year or two ago, that pointed out that something like 25% of American muslims respected the radicals that waged war on the US?
The number of muslims that follow the Koran's extreme teachings of violence against us infidels is much higher than I think you are willing to admit.

-This post is in no way intended to discriminate against individual persons based on their race; color; ethnicity; country, state, or region of origin; religion; sexual preference; education or lack thereof; gender, trans-gender, intergender; integer, fraction, decimal, or whole number; choice to wear and/or not wear objects resembling and/or not resembling rags or towels upon their head; age; experience or inexperience; handicap; ability or disability; documented or undocumented status; legal residence; taxpayer status; emancipation status; or any other factor which might be found offensive.

You have every right to think that. The facts you posted may well be true, I don't know. I've not made specific study of anti-Muslim (or Muslim anti-American) surveys or publications. I'll ask you the same question I just asked CarmelHP: What is your proposed solution?

Oh, and your disclaimer made me laugh. However sarcastic/snarky, it was funny. Thanks.

Blessings,
Bill

 

[greg]

IMO...

From the reports I am hearing now he was a Freakin Coward, He did his time at Wally Reed and in the Army's infinite Wisdom he was one of the Muslim Head shrinkers that they have that are supposed to talk us back down.... He was a COWARD and killed and wounded good people because he was scared he may have to go do what soldiers are paid to do.

Here's what's been reported and it is rather interesting............read what you want into it, but remember....extremists are patient...

Lee said Hasan had hoped Obama would pull troops out of Afghanistan and Iraq and got into frequent arguments with others in the military who supported the wars.........Hasan was single with no children. He graduated from Virginia Tech, where he was a member of the ROTC and earned a bachelor's degree in biochemistry in 1997. He received his medical degree from the military's Uniformed Services University of the Health Sciences in Bethesda, Md., in 2001 and was at Walter Reed for six years for his internship, residency and a fellowship.

 

[Bill of Rights]

Well, I'd start by throwing out of the Army any crazy-a@@ed loon who started saying he thought suicide bombing was a good idea. That might be too 'radical" for you, but it's a good start IMO.

Not too radical. I'd agree with your proposal. I think I said above that it was clearly correct to address the behavior of individuals.

 

[Bill of Rights]

From the reports I am hearing now he was a Freakin Coward, He did his time at Wally Reed and in the Army's infinite Wisdom he was one of the Muslim Head shrinkers that they have that are supposed to talk us back down.... He was a COWARD and killed and wounded good people because he was scared he may have to go do what soldiers are paid to do.

Here's what's been reported and it is rather interesting............read what you want into it, but remember....extremists are patient...

Lee said Hasan had hoped Obama would pull troops out of Afghanistan and Iraq and got into frequent arguments with others in the military who supported the wars.........Hasan was single with no children. He graduated from Virginia Tech, where he was a member of the ROTC and earned a bachelor's degree in biochemistry in 1997. He received his medical degree from the military's Uniformed Services University of the Health Sciences in Bethesda, Md., in 2001 and was at Walter Reed for six years for his internship, residency and a fellowship.

No argument on his cowardice. This reminds me of the people who joined the military to get their college paid for, then when it came time to serve in-theater, they balked. Evidently, they ignored the fact that the purpose of our military is not to provide college scholarships but to defend a nation, a people, and a way of life. I hope he regains consciousness and faces justice for his actions... both in this life and the next.

Blessings,
Bill

 

[CarmelHP]

Not too radical. I'd agree with your proposal. I think I said above that it was clearly correct to address the behavior of individuals.

Islam is composed of individuals who espouse a violent ideology which is couched in religious terms. Do all of those Muslims believe it, take it seriously, or act on it, no, but enough to ask some questions, do some checking, and give a second look.

Again, during World War 2, or even anytime thereafter, do you think it would have been a good idea to allow Nazis or Nazi sympathizers into the military blindly, with no follow-up?

 

[Bill of Rights]

Islam is composed of individuals who espouse a violent ideology which is couched in religious terms. Do all of those Muslims believe it, take it seriously, or act on it, no, but enough to ask some questions, do some checking, and give a second look.

Again, during World War 2, or even anytime thereafter, do you think it would have been a good idea to allow Nazis or Nazi sympathizers into the military blindly, with no follow-up?

I do not. They joined the Nazi party voluntarily, however. I see a difference there, though I'm aware not everyone does.

Blessings,
Bill

 

[Jay]

The doors of this country need to be open to those who want to become a part of it, and are willing to put forth some effort to do so. Regardless of religion.

Those who would use our hard-won freedoms as a shield for thier subversive and anti-American activities, need to be removed from our midst. REGARDLESS OF RELIGION.

I don't give a **** what your religion is, you either positively contribute, or deal with the result of the seed/s you sow. Lightning would knock me off any pulpit, but all said and done, accountability is the answer. If one poses a threat to the United States, or it's citizens, that one needs to be gone. Please feel free to define "gone" as your concience dictates.... and my concience isn't real picky in this regard.

Deal with it.

 

[haldir]

The doors of this country need to be open to those who want to become a part of it, and are willing to put forth some effort to do so. Regarless of religion.

Those who would use our hard-won freedoms as a shield for thier subversive and anti-American activities, need to be removed from our midst. REGARDLESS OF RELIGION.

And that is exactly the position the Dutch are in right now. Their liberal Western values now are being destroyed by the immigrants that they welcomed into their country. Everyone should watch the video Fitna.

 

[CarmelHP]

I do not. They joined the Nazi party voluntarily, however. I see a difference there, though I'm aware not everyone does.

Blessings,
Bill

Not a difference, a distinction without a difference. If you continue with your espousal after you're an adult, you've volunteered. Bund members were indoctrinated by their families, would it have been A-OK to let them run loose in the Army without a care(the FBI kept a close watch on the Bund members during the '40's by the way)?

 

[cce1302]

I believe if we went to war with, let's say, Mexico, or El Salvador, or Germany, we'd surely screen all our military personnel that are either still citizens of those countries (yes, you can be a citizen of another country and be a member of the US military, though you need to renounce your other citizenship to become a commissioned officer) or were once citizens of those countries, or who have close family members that are still in those countries. We wouldn't be shy about it. We'd just do it. "Hey, we're going to war with your former country, or the country where your family lives. Do you have any apprehension whatsoever? Do you have any feelings that you would not be able to fight against that country? Can you make a combat deployment against the country where you were born?"

Why can't we do this with members of a religion that has been actively conducting war against us for nearly 30 years?

 

[Bill of Rights]

The doors of this country need to be open to those who want to become a part of it, and are willing to put forth some effort to do so. Regarless of religion.

Those who would use our hard-won freedoms as a shield for thier subversive and anti-American activities, need to be removed from our midst. REGARDLESS OF RELIGION.

I don't give a **** what your religion is, you either positively contribute, or deal with the result of the seed/s you sow. Lightning would knock me off any pulpit, but all said and done, accountability is the answer. If one poses a threat to the United States, or it's citizens, that one needs to be gone. Please feel free to define "gone" as your concience dictates.... and my concience isn't real picky in this regard.

Deal with it.

^^This, exactly. I don't think their religion is the important factor. I think you've made the point far better than I have, Jay.

Thanks for posting

Blessings,
Bill

 

[Bill of Rights]

Not a difference, a distinction without a difference. If you continue with your espousal after you're an adult, you've volunteered. Bund members were indoctrinated by their families, would it have been A-OK to let them run loose in the Army without a care(the FBI kept a close watch on the Bund members during the '40's by the way)?

For those adults who knowingly embrace those goals, OK. Conversely, I identify myself as a man who was raised Jewish. Judaism still is the basis of my belief. I have fundamental disagreements with organized religion, however, some would still lump me in with others who are far more observant of those religious tenets. Reform Judaism, in which I was raised, is fairly vocally in favor of "gun control".
Should I, therefore, be watched with scrutiny here? Should my loyalty to protecting the rights of American gun owners and more specifically Indiana gun owners be suspect? I don't know all the answers, but I know that to immediately suspect a whole group is not productive; while we are focusing on all the Muslims, what is to prevent a Palestinian, a Venezuelan, a Chinese, or a Korean agent from causing the next incident of mayhem? Where does it end? Suspicion of all who are not purely WASP Americans? Sounds far too similar to the Master Race to me.

Blessings,
Bill

 

[Fletch]

...including a “shout out” recognition of a conference attendee...

I think too much is being made of this one point. The guy he recognized was a Congressional Medal of Honor winner... as I understand it, the CMH isn't handed out to just anybody -- it's not the Nobel Peace Prize.

 

[Bill of Rights]

I believe if we went to war with, let's say, Mexico, or El Salvador, or Germany, we'd surely screen all our military personnel that are either still citizens of those countries (yes, you can be a citizen of another country and be a member of the US military, though you need to renounce your other citizenship to become a commissioned officer) or were once citizens of those countries, or who have close family members that are still in those countries. We wouldn't be shy about it. We'd just do it. "Hey, we're going to war with your former country, or the country where your family lives. Do you have any apprehension whatsoever? Do you have any feelings that you would not be able to fight against that country? Can you make a combat deployment against the country where you were born?"

Why can't we do this with members of a religion that has been actively conducting war against us for nearly 30 years?

So you ask. What assurance have you of truthful answers? Do you kick out anyone with objections? Do you put that person in an area where his contributions are not related to the conflict in the country where his loyalties might be conflicted? (that is, if our war is with, for example, Mexico, do you station this guy in Germany or Antarctica?) Or do you do something totally different from either of these possibilities?

Blessings,
Bill

 

[haldir]

I think the whole Jewishness thing is different. You have the Jewish religion and the Jewish ethnicity. So you may not be a religious Jew but you are still a Jew. But with myself, I was born an American and will always be an American. I was not born Christian but became one. I could at any time (skip the technical debate on this) renounce my Christianity. I suppose I could renounce my citizenship but I would still have been born an American.

Getting back to the point, I do think we should avoid excesses. There are certainly people that identify themselves as Muslims that do not follow all of its tenets. I just think we need to go in with open eyes and be vigilant. There are Muslims that would like nothing better than to kill Americans. We also seem be seeing people in this country converting to radical forms of Islam in the prisons and in some poverty stricken communities. Just like they have been seeing it occur in the UK. They are just further down this path than we are.

 

[cce1302]

For those adults who knowingly embrace those goals, OK. Conversely, I identify myself as a man who was raised Jewish. Judaism still is the basis of my belief. I have fundamental disagreements with organized religion, however, some would still lump me in with others who are far more observant of those religious tenets. Reform Judaism, in which I was raised, is fairly vocally in favor of "gun control".
Should I, therefore, be watched with scrutiny here? Should my loyalty to protecting the rights of American gun owners and more specifically Indiana gun owners be suspect? I don't know all the answers, but I know that to immediately suspect a whole group is not productive; while we are focusing on all the Muslims, what is to prevent a Palestinian, a Venezuelan, a Chinese, or a Korean agent from causing the next incident of mayhem? Where does it end? Suspicion of all who are not purely WASP Americans? Sounds far too similar to the Master Race to me.

Blessings,
Bill

I'm suspicious of everybody. Gun control proponents come in all shapes and sizes.

There is a common thread between all muslim terrorists. They're all muslims.

There is a JPFO. Is there a MFQKC (Muslims for Quit Killing Christians)?

 

[haldir]

I think too much is being made of this one point. The guy he recognized was a Congressional Medal of Honor winner... as I understand it, the CMH isn't handed out to just anybody -- it's not the Nobel Peace Prize.

I hadn't commented on this yet. I was listening on the radio during this conference. BHO did come across a little flippant at that point but I was more struck by the crowd laughing and yucking it up knowing we had soldiers dead and dying at that time...