Army's new SIGs ejecting live rounds, can't handle standard ball ammo.

[Trigger Time]

I may have read the report wrong but I thought it said the pistols were running well with the "special" ammo which was a hollow point but were having issues with the ball ammo. That seems really bizarre to me and the opposite of what I would have expected.

One report I read was saying some special units that tested with hollow point ammo had like 70% reliable feed. I might have been half asleep or something though and its possible I'm wrong.
I'm truly interested in having the truth come out on these tests. I want our military to have the best chance to kill the enemy and complete the mission and come home.
My faith in Sig and the Army having the same desire has been broken

 

[phylodog]

One report I read was saying some special units that tested with hollow point ammo had like 70% reliable feed. I might have been half asleep or something though and its possible I'm wrong.
I'm truly interested in having the truth come out on these tests. I want our military to have the best chance to kill the enemy and complete the mission and come home.
My faith in Sig and the Army having the same desire has been broken

I'm with you 100%.

 

[Dean C.]

WTH is going on with Sig and the M17? Supposedly the M17 was "immune" to the whole dropping thing (because if you look at early photos it had a slimmer and presumably lighter weight trigger than the commercial variant). Now they are ejecting live rounds and feeding hollow points better than ball ammo?? I really really hope this is limited to just a few pistols and not the entire batch, both P320's I had were flawless shooting and reliable, I am very interested to see how Sig screwed the pooch and what they will do to fix the situation.

 

[aaron580]

Never call a Sig to do a Glocks job

Color me not shocked, they didn't even go through the entire MHS trial, go look back on the history of this whole new batch of crap we call the army's new pistol

 

[Vigilant]

Never call a Sig to do a Glocks job

Color me not shocked, they didn't even go through the entire MHS trial, go look back on the history of this whole new batch of crap we call the army's new pistol

The fix was in with Big Green before the “trials” started me thinks?

 

[Leadeye]

We could always go back to revolvers, long live the Colt SAA!

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Was t Sig awarded the contract before all the tests were completed? I thought that was what Glock was protesting.

What I read was there was another "optional" round, sort of a semi-finals, and the Army elected to skip the "optional" round. Glock protested, but since it was "optional" it was ruled the Army didn't HAVE to do that round and could make their selection based on the mandatory first round of testing.

 

[Dean C.]

We could always go back to revolvers, long live the Colt SAA!

I would be happy issuing 1911's again

 

[halfmileharry]

I would be happy issuing 1911's again

That's a big "You betcha"

 

[mark40sw]

All those interested in this topic, should watch this.
He goes into detail of the military selection process. He states testing was not well done and that he was hearing word of p320 problems already coming up.

Sounds like it was selected primarily because sig came in very low priced. Sig is not making much off each gun.

Also a potential big headache is sig was hit with patent violation Steyr had on the chassis concept sig used (that can be googled). Video touches upon that at 7:20 in the video. Sig losses that on a gun they are not making much on to begin with.... not a good thing.


The Failure of the XM17 Modular Handgun Program
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGI2H0EjDTw

 

[DeadeyeChrista'sdad]

If I had a known good one, I'd not be in a big rush to dispose of it, but I personally wouldn't hop on the polymer Sig bandwagon any time soon. Which pains me to say, I *want* Sig to succeed and to be what they once were. Now what the excel at is life style marketing, not pistol making.

I pretty much agree with this. I WANT Sig to win. I've got a row of them running down the safe door, and love 'em. Like any other manufacturer, though, I let others be the guinea pigs on any new model that interests me.

 

[Woobie]

Sig's bid was almost $100M less than Glock's. I don't see the big mystery or conspiracy.


If you handed me a Glock, PPQ, VP9, P320, XD, and an M&P, and told me I could keep all but one, there's a good chance I would dump the Glock. I would rather see the Army and Sig sort out the bugs on a pistol that could be really nice than to settle for the least common denominator of plastic handguns. But Sig didn't leave themselves much wiggle room, and if they can't get this mess fixed quickly, they'll likely find themselves in bankruptcy court.

 

[churchmouse]

Sig's bid was almost $100M less than Glock's. I don't see the big mystery or conspiracy.


If you handed me a Glock, PPQ, VP9, P320, XD, and an M&P, and told me I could keep all but one, there's a good chance I would dump the Glock. I would rather see the Army and Sig sort out the bugs on a pistol that could be really nice than to settle for the least common denominator of plastic handguns. But Sig didn't leave themselves much wiggle room, and if they can't get this mess fixed quickly, they'll likely find themselves in bankruptcy court.

This is usually the end result of buying into the process with a less than stellar piece of gear/equipment.
This will be worked out.

 

[snowwalker]

I would be happy issuing 1911's again

Which one? lol

 

[Expat]

https://www.sofmag.com/its-a-great-...n-system-but-problems-exist-according-to-dod/

 

[Kirk Freeman]

No, Ron Cohen, no!

SIG has announced that they are fixing the Army's problem by adding rainbow glitter and an action pose of Ron Cohen doing Krav Maga to each pistol.

 

[Bapak2ja]

Sig Sauer, the Taurus of the North!

I had the exact same thought.

 

[halfmileharry]

Is the same guy that destroyed Kimber's quality? What a legacy to leave. Just askin' and thinkin' aloud.

 

[aaron580]

The fix was in with Big Green before the “trials” started me thinks?

Pretty much. It looks like a good case of somebody high up knew somebody else high up. If research is done into how this "trial" was performed, they did not perform even a real torture test, and the amount of rounds if I remember correctly should have been in the neighborhood of 25K with different trials, which was not even close to how many were actually run through each pistol. To date, the Beretta M9 is still the only gun between it and the M17 that truly completed the trial and gave the Army a truly reliable sidearm. There is also no way that sig made any money on this deal whatsoever, judging if they came in 100mil less than GLOCK, does that not seem a bit strange, considering GLOCK is typically a low bidder? When I get some free time, Ill dig up the data on the subject and post some. In all reality, its a super LOW probability the GLOCK would be having these issues currently, even if they were the "low bidder". Sig cut corners, the Army cut corners, and they have a crappy replacement to the now vastly superior M9, and I'm not even a large fan of the M9 platform.

 

[Vigilant]

Is the same guy that destroyed Kimber's quality? What a legacy to leave. Just askin' and thinkin' aloud.

The very same!