Intermittent Fasting

[gregkl]

Wearing the same size pants, when I wear pants when I was 18. I am so fortunate.

I have fluctuated 10 lbs since my freshman year in college. I was 130 during high school, used weight lifting to get to 165 my freshman year and now at age 57 I weigh 172.

I have no formal education but I have been an ardent student of health, exercise and wellness, my wife has worked for a chiropractor where we both learned a lot, I have hired sports trainers, gone to human performance labs, worked with nutritionists, did an Ironman at age 40 and am now doing CrossFit knocking on 60 years old. And I am able to be near the top of the leader board competing against college students.

I may not have that formal education but I'm living proof that what I know works.

 

[gregkl]

I appreciate your input. I don't want to be dismissive, but I completely agree with this doc. He spent years dealing with injuries and health problems and based his advice on scientific grounds mixed with personal experience trying to put fat people back together after they did damage. He never said not to exercise, he said to exercise to be healthy not to lose weight. Injuries are generally counterproductive to weightloss and overall health. I plan to start a low impact physical fitness program as I go along, but i'm taking things a step at a time, nail the diet work in the exercise. Im not sedentary tho.

I worked with a guy who lost over 100 lbs in two years doing nothing but monitoring and adjusting his food intake. It will work.

 

[thunderchicken]

I appreciate your input. I don't want to be dismissive, but I completely agree with this doc. He spent years dealing with injuries and health problems and based his advice on scientific grounds mixed with personal experience trying to put fat people back together after they did damage. He never said not to exercise, he said to exercise to be healthy not to lose weight. Injuries are generally counterproductive to weightloss and overall health. I plan to start a low impact physical fitness program as I go along, but i'm taking things a step at a time, nail the diet work in the exercise. Im not sedentary tho.

Oh I fully understand, and can only imagine some of what the Dr has had to put back together. And yes injuries are counterproductive to weight loss. I just know that scientifically it all ties in together. I truly believe that even as a fat *** as I am, so long as I don't try to lift more than I can handle and use proper form and technique and not worry so much about how much weight I throw around, strength training will build more muscle mass while burning fat. But in large part I too agree with what your Dr has said. Fat loss is by and large done with proper diet.

I really think we are on the same page. Keep up the good work it sounds like it is working for you

 

[Ggreen]

Oh I fully understand, and can only imagine some of what the Dr has had to put back together. And yes injuries are counterproductive to weight loss. I just know that scientifically it all ties in together. I truly believe that even as a fat *** as I am, so long as I don't try to lift more than I can handle and use proper form and technique and not worry so much about how much weight I throw around, strength training will build more muscle mass while burning fat. But in large part I too agree with what your Dr has said. Fat loss is by and large done with proper diet.

I really think we are on the same page. Keep up the good work it sounds like it is working for you

I agree lots of paths along the same road. I'm actually thinking yoga will be the direction I go in. Weight works for you to work against it lol.

 

[jfed85]

Ive been doing a very basic attempt at the keto diet. I don't count fat or protiens. Simply aim for under 20G carbs per day. Since April I've gone from 231 Lbs to 190 Lbs. I throw in a "Cheat day" maybe every month. If I would not drink beer I would probably lose even more, but beer is good. I did switch to Michelob Ultra for lower carbs from my beer. Sometimes if I'm in a social setting where I want to drink I will mix sprite zero, Mio water flavoring, and clear rum.

Everyone's bodies are different, but I have had outstanding results just from cutting carbs. Good Luck.

 

[seedubs1]

I was a professional track and field athlete. Still train and compete in other events 8 years later. I'm not a doctor, but I've lived it. Health and fitness was how I made a living for a period of time. A lot of the people I train with currently (and previously) are physical therapists, physiologists, dieticians, and other sports related doctors. We all pretty well geek out on this kind of stuff.

If you're actively essentially seeking professional coaching on dieting, exercise, etc... and especially if they're well reputed to get good results, then trust the process and do it 110%. With the diet he has you on, I'd bet the diet will shift once the pounds come off. I'm thinking that looks pretty typical for a diet early on in the process with as much weight as it sounds like you want to lose. He's essentially just cutting your carbs back an extreme amount. It's not long term sustainable, but it's what you need right now from your doctors assessment.

Keep up the good work! Remember, it's a lifestyle change. You need changes in the kitchen and you need changes in exercise. Get healthy and then continue to live healthy!

Seedubs- so far I agree with the info yo have shared. I don't mean to sound like a jerk but, you have shared a fair amount of info as fact (again I agree based on what I have been taught) but I have to ask where do you get your info? Do you work in the fitness industry (trainer or nutritionist) or just very involved in fitness?

I'm one of those fat guys. Yes I have failed to get my tail in the gym and haven't made it a priority for a few years. But, I'm working on it (again) now. I'm working with a personal trainer and a sports nutritionist to get the excess lbs off (I have a long way to go). They both seem to be ok with having 1 or 2 diet sodas a day with meals. But primarily want to see just water intake for hydration. They don't even want to see Gatorade or any of the other sports drinks. There has been talk of using a salt water solution as a meal replacement if I decide to try fasting. But right now they have me following a Macro diet. 5 days a week I get 322g protein, 115g CHO, 35g fat. Then twice a week I get as refeed days and am allowed 200g CHO. So far there have been some challenges. The biggest for me is getting enough Protein and keeping the fat down to just 35g. I only know how to cook chicken and fish so many ways. I am thinking about talking with my nutritionist about lowering the Protein intake a few grams and increasing the fat to allow for a bit more protein source options. I would think it would be ok so long as it doesn't change the calorie balance. But Idk if that is good or not.

 

[seedubs1]

And to those saying extremely obese people can't exercise and burn the same smaller people can.....BS. Pure BS.

Now.....someone who's over 300 lbs and hasn't ever exercised can't expect to burn 1000-2000 calories per day running on concrete or doing something like that without getting injured. But they absolutely can (and should) burn 1k calories or more per day exercising.

Bike, elliptical, rowing machine, pool, weights, etc... Don't overdo any single one and you won't get injured. If you don't know proper form and technique, seek out a trainer and learn it. There's LOTS of low impact options to get you trimmed down and fit.

Balance a healthy diet and exercise, and you will get there.

 

[Ggreen]

Nobody said not to exercise, simply stated that exercise is not a replacement for diet. A lot of people think exercise will lead to weight loss, when the only truly effective way to lose weight is to adjust calorie intake. This doc warned against the exercise to lose weight mindset, because people tend to get extreme and heavier people have a higher chance of damaging themselves trying to keep up with a misinformed gym trainer. Exercise is important from a total health standpoint, much less from a weight loss standpoint.

 

[thunderchicken]

Seedubs- Thanks for sharing a bit of your background. Based on info you have shared it sounded exactly like the people who have been advising me along my journey to change my lifestyle.

As you speculated, yes my Macros will change as the weight comes off. I will be having all measurements checked every 8 weeks and my Macros will be tweaked accordingly.

And yes I fully agree that even obese people can burn 1k calories a day in the gym. In large part my trainer has me doing much of the same exercises that any of his leaner clients are doing. Sure a few have to be modified but not much. And we keep rest periods between sets to roughly 1 minute.
It may not be the most accurate in the world but, I also wear a heart rate monitor (with chest sensor) and it calculates calories burned. Even if it isn't the most accurate, it helps motivate me. As I reach the point where I am ready to call it a day and head for home it pushes me to go just a bit more to end when I get to the next hundred mark (if I'm at 950 dig a bit deeper and hit 1000).

Just this week I have started experimenting with some juicing to get some of my healthy CHO's down.
My favorite so far is what I call swamp water. Its. 100g baby spinach, 50g red seedless grapes, 50g strawberries. Add ice and water as needed in a smoothie maker to get the desired consistency. Sometimes it needs to be a bit sweeter and I will add 1 teaspoon of either splenda or stevia. Only bad parts are A- it looks like swamp water...or my wife calls it pond scum.and B- those tiny strawberry seeds can make it taste a little gritty.

 

[thunderchicken]

Nobody said not to exercise, simply stated that exercise is not a replacement for diet. A lot of people think exercise will lead to weight loss, when the only truly effective way to lose weight is to adjust calorie intake. This doc warned against the exercise to lose weight mindset, because people tend to get extreme and heavier people have a higher chance of damaging themselves trying to keep up with a misinformed gym trainer. Exercise is important from a total health standpoint, much less from a weight loss standpoint.

Again mostly agree. I would say make sure any trainer you may choose to work with is Certified and ask about their credentials. There are some seriously awesome trainers who know their stuff...some are like walking fitness encyclopedias

 

[seedubs1]

Keep it up. Sounds like you are seriously going down the right path.

Make sure you have a plan once you get done with the weight loss portion. I'd liken it to rehab or something along those lines. Once you're done, you need a support group and a plan if you are actually going to keep the weight off and stay healthy long term. In my opinion, you need to find 2 main critical things:

1) Make friends that are healthy active people. It's a lot easier to stay fit when you're doing fun active things all the time. It's a hell of a lot harder to stay fit if all of your friends are sitting on the couch eating pizza and badgering you about why you're never hanging out with them.

2) Decide healthy things that you want to do and find things that you think are fun. I struggled a lot with this when I retired from running professionally. I didn't know what made me happy, and I put on about 20 pounds before realizing I needed to figure something out. I hate being inside in the gym.....You really have to figure out what you like to do. I now run, hike (back country multi day), canoe/kayak, and rock climb because those are things I actually enjoy doing.....and I have groups of people I do those things with (refer to #1).

Like I said.....It really is a lifestyle change.

 

[Bigtanker]

It’s a fantastic way to drop A1c.

Chez, I am not a coffee man. Can I put that stuff in Diet Coke?

If you don't like coffee, try Crio-bru. They use the cocoa bean instead of a coffee bean. It's caffeine free but has theobromine as a milder stimulant.

It's kinda like chocolate tea. Hard to explain but I like it and so does my wife. It's not as bitter as regular coffee or a dark chocolate bar.
I mix it 50/50 with coffee most days. I use to to make my bulletproof coffee with butter and coconut oil.

 

[CindyE]

Ive been doing a very basic attempt at the keto diet. I don't count fat or protiens. Simply aim for under 20G carbs per day. Since April I've gone from 231 Lbs to 190 Lbs. I throw in a "Cheat day" maybe every month. If I would not drink beer I would probably lose even more, but beer is good. I did switch to Michelob Ultra for lower carbs from my beer. Sometimes if I'm in a social setting where I want to drink I will mix sprite zero, Mio water flavoring, and clear rum.

Everyone's bodies are different, but I have had outstanding results just from cutting carbs. Good Luck.

That's pretty much what i do aka "Lazy Keto". Beer and wine are my weaknesses. My goal is to lose 15 more lbs. I lost about 10 lbs since starting last year. I have gained muscle though, as I have been working out with kettlebells. I've always been pretty active, but my body wasn't really showing it. Cheating too much this week, we were gifted lots of excellent sweet corn, and my FIL bought Chinese food Sunday. Other than that, I've been staying low carb and eating pretty clean. I kinda like the Mich Ultra Cactus Lime. Recently discovered that Omission has a low carb Ale. I only drink dry wines, mostly red. Drink lots of water. For me, low carb is the most sustainable. I feel better, my stomach doesn't bloat. Carbs don't do much for me, i only miss the convenience of grabbing a sandwich or pizza when i don't have much time to cook. I've tried lots of different ways of eating. I did have success on Weight Watchers, but I felt like I was sacrificing healthy fats to stay under my allowed points. South Beach and Mediterranean Diet were good for me too, but I lost very little weight.

 

[Ggreen]

Finished another "2" day yesterday. I'm not going to say I finished strong, I was craving food before bed. I wasn't hungry, no pains, headaches or weakness, just a powerful craving. I ended up eating a spoonful of raw chia seeds at around 10pm. About 45 calories worth. It was enough to knock the edge off.

Woke up at 745 this morning to take my shift watching the baby. Stayed strong and held out until noon to have my first meal of technically a free day. 80cals worth of Venison jerky, 24 almonds, and a mini babybel, it surprised me how full I felt. It was like I had to try to finish the almonds. My snack is 2 tbsp. of chia gel.

I've got an appointment with a nutritionist to try and help meal plan my "5" days. I would like to keep balanced.

 

[gregkl]

It's interesting that this thread made me realize that I kinda fell off part of my diet. I was consuming 2 protein smoothies per day. Along with the 60+ grams of protein I was missing, I also had omitted the Glutamine, Creatine, BCAA's and the fiber, carbs, etc. of the fruit. I quit doing that about 3 weeks ago or so.

And last week and a little the week before I noticed that my workouts were kicking my butt and I could not recover well from workout to workout. This week I actually took a couple days off to try to feel better. I was thinking that I need to scale back as obviously I'm over training.

It dawned on me after all of the input on this thread that it just may be my diet that is causing the current condition. So starting today, I'm back on the smoothies. Next week is going to be a little lighter as far as workouts since my coaches will be at the CrossFit Games and the subs keep it civil so that will be good as I build back up a little.

I'll find out the following week if I am correct in my self-assessment. If I am, it shows the power of diet. Thanks all for the lively thread.

 

[Pyro]

If you don't like coffee, try Crio-bru. They use the cocoa bean instead of a coffee bean. It's caffeine free but has theobromine as a milder stimulant.

It's kinda like chocolate tea. Hard to explain but I like it and so does my wife. It's not as bitter as regular coffee or a dark chocolate bar.
I mix it 50/50 with coffee most days. I use to to make my bulletproof coffee with butter and coconut oil.

I like coffee but I was looking for something my wife would enjoy. Thank you for posting this I'm going Crio-bru!

Ok Amazon prime free 2 day and same price as their site. Should have a new experience by Sat.

 

[Hohn]

Fasting will **** you up long term too. Going without food totaly or with very little food over time actualy changes your bodies chemical makeup. It's a fact. Your metabolism will slow. You will cram food and when your body gets it, it will store it in a bad way. You get fat.
Anyone who's done this is military training or a religious reason whatever, you will notice putting on weight fast. That's why.
I'm no doctor, and I do not know medical terminology but I know it's not good

That's not been my experience. Your metabolism slows only when you lose muscle mass. You lose muscle only when your body must break down muscle via glycolysis for energy. This means you have essentially no other energy stores available.

People put fat back on after fasting because they think that fasting lets them go back to horking out on carbs and (especially) sugar. That sudden sugar dump quickly overcomes your insulin sensitivity and goes straight to fat.

My experience with time-restricted eating with little to no sugar (I only eat between 11 and 7 most days):
-- Nighttime acid reflex is GONE. It was causing apnea-like symptoms that were just awful.
-- Insulin sensitivity much, much higher (half a can of soda will make me feel like puking)
-- I'm down about 12 lbs overall
-- I have more energy
-- I have less "mental fog" even without my morning coffee. I no longer feel like I even need morning coffee.


The bottom line is that it takes a LOT more than fasting for a day to get your body to start breaking down muscle and going catabolic. Even two days (depending what you've been eating) might not do it.

The Yo-Yo dieting phenomenon is a real thing, but it's because people try starving themselves to lose weight, which never works, and when they cant continue starving themselves, they give up and hork out on pizza donuts and beer.

None of that applies to intermittent fasting or the related (but different) time-restricted eating. Two days of fasting isn't starvation. And you don't get to eat junk and total crap as a reward for suffering for two days.

 

[thunderchicken]

Something I keep seeing people mention is a window of time when they will eat. Like the above post Hohn mentions only eating between 11 and 7 most days. What is the point in that??

Scientific research has shown that because the body is always burning calories it doesn't matter when you consume food. However, many fitness experts highly recommend consuming carbs early - mid day so the body can utilize the shorter term energy they provide. Likewise they recommend a high protein snack like cottage cheese or greek yogurt before bed.
Not bashing anyones approach just trying to understand

 

[seedubs1]

I also don't buy into the fasting or eating only 8 hours through the day.

However, I do see better results when I vary my macro nutrient intake through the day in order to take in most of my carbs early in the day and move towards more fat/protein later in the day.

My theory is that the body isn't holding onto those carbs and turning them into fat while I'm sleeping since you're essentially being sedentary while sleeping.

I do eat a LOT of carbs though. But most of the exercise I like to do is endurance and cardio based.

Something I keep seeing people mention is a window of time when they will eat. Like the above post Hohn mentions only eating between 11 and 7 most days. What is the point in that??

Scientific research has shown that because the body is always burning calories it doesn't matter when you consume food. However, many fitness experts highly recommend consuming carbs early - mid day so the body can utilize the shorter term energy they provide. Likewise they recommend a high protein snack like cottage cheese or greek yogurt before bed.
Not bashing anyones approach just trying to understand

 

[indiucky]

One of my followers on Twitter dropped 60 lbs over the past year on the Keto diet...

She used to be in a lot of romance films and then became a director/producer of romance films....