No Finger Needed, Holster Warning

[Kirk Freeman]

a gun with a 'proper safety' would have never discharged.

Perhaps less likely but it CAN happen.

Clint Smith of Thunder Ranch tells of a detective at ACSD when he was there that shot himself through the arm with a P-35. The shoulder rig took off the safety and discharged the weapon.

Eez gon, eez not safe.

 

[Roadie]

Perhaps less likely but it CAN happen.

Clint Smith of Thunder Ranch tells of a detective at ACSD when he was there that shot himself through the arm with a P-35. The shoulder rig took off the safety and discharged the weapon.

Eez gon, eez not safe.

Not to mention any mechanical device can fail, even a manual safety...

 

[revance]

Remember, every time you load, every time you unload, and everytime you sit down or move, the weapon can discharge.

Wow, that sounds just like the argument all the anti-gun people make as to why we shouldn't be allowed to carry guns.

I have to say that I have ZERO fear of my weapon discharging while I move around when it is properly holstered.

 

[revance]

As much as I dislike Glocks, I agree it was NOT the gun's fault. I also don't feel that a gun needs a silly switch on it to be safe.

I think it was a bad holster design and neglect of the user for not replacing it when it got worn out.

I use Crossbreed holsters and I don't see how they could possibly catch the trigger. One side is kydex and the leather side starts so far up the trigger never passes by the edge of the leather. I am still careful while reholstering and keep my thumb on the hammer so I will notice if something starts pulling it back.

 

[Bill of Rights]

I'm not personally a fan of Glocks for this reason, but that it was a Glock was only partly responsible for the events occurring. I think it's possible but far less likely that a pistol with an external safety would have fired in this situation. The bottom line however, is that it was negligence on the part of the owner that was the root cause.

Not to mention any mechanical device can fail, even a manual safety...

Exactly this. Your brain is the safety, the lever on the side of the gun is just a backup to that.

Blessings,
Bill

 

[BlueEagle]

I think if you ask most people how they carry their weapons, many of them respond with "Round in the chamber, safety off," if they have a weapon with a safety. The fact that its a Glock doesn't really make a difference; it could've been anybody who carries with a round in the chamber.

From the way that he talked about the incident, even if it had been an XD or 1911, something with a grip safety, who's to say that he wouldn't have been pushing it back up against the seat, and disengaging the grip safety at the same time all of this happened?

Safeties can fail, and they can be disengaged unintentionally. They can also fail in a manner that STOPS the firearm from working, or become engaged when you don't want them.

Reason I like Glocks; its not there to get in my way. In addition, I KNOW that every time I pull the trigger, its going to go BANG. It places all of the safety and all of the responsibility squarely on my shoulders; I don't have to trust in a manual safety. Because even if you don't intend to USE a manual safety, you still have to trust that it will operate correctly in order to use the firearm.

Yes, Glocks have internal safeties, but they cannot be manipulated as easily, (if at all,) by external forces, which is really what this rant is about.

Case in point; my father left his pistol sitting on the counter the other day while I was visiting. I knew that my little sister, (who is 7, I think,) was walking around the house. Now, I don't THINK that she would touch it, but you never know. So I picked it up, dropped the mag, and went to pull the slide back to check it. Slide wouldn't come back. Took me about 2 seconds to realize that the safety was on, which prevented the slide from moving. Flicked it off, and checked the chamber; empty.

If that had been a survival situation, with zombie ninja robbers busting in through the kitchen windows, I don't know if I would've made it, (if I hadn't had my own gun on me.) That safety would've prevented me from operating the weapon in a time-efficient manner. Carrying a gun with safety is accepting the fact that the safety MIGHT engage itself when you don't want it to, or that it might DISENGAGE itself when you don't want it to. It may be rare, but it happens.

I'd rather not have to worry about that. My finger stays alongside the frame until I am ready to shoot, and my gun stays holstered in a good quality holster where the trigger is adequately protected until I think that I need the weapon.

 

[.45 Dave]

Seems to me that the backstrap saftey on the xd series seems like a great idea now

That's why I chose the XD over the Glock...I didn't want this very thing to happen. I don't particularly like manual safeties because in a harry situation it is very easy to forget to disengage them and then, at the very least, you'll look stupid if you're lucky enough to not end up dead.

 

[Roadie]

That's why I chose the XD over the Glock...I didn't want this very thing to happen. I don't particularly like manual safeties because in a harry situation it is very easy to forget to disengage them and then, at the very least, you'll look stupid if you're lucky enough to not end up dead.

Agreed.
I make it a habit to holster without pressure on the backstrap myself. Just in case say, my shirt gets in the trigger guard..

 

[bigcraig]

That's why I chose the XD over the Glock...I didn't want this very thing to happen. I don't particularly like manual safeties because in a harry situation it is very easy to forget to disengage them and then, at the very least, you'll look stupid if you're lucky enough to not end up dead.

I can understand your reasoning, however, I have personally seen many, many guns with grip safeties give shooters issues. A good example is with folks who shoot 1911's that get a good high grip on the gun, sometimes they will actually engage the grip safety by putting to much pressure on the beavertail portion of the safety, it is a hinged component. I have seen this issue even with grip safeties that have the so-called "speed-bump" employed as well.

As far as some of the newer polymer guns that also employ a grip safety, again, I have seen issues with the shooters grip give them problems.

The moral of Kirks story, is this.
Know your equipment.
Test/check your equipment periodically.
Repair/replace gear as and when necessary.

 

[thompal]

Wow, that sounds just like the argument all the anti-gun people make as to why we shouldn't be allowed to carry guns.

I have to say that I have ZERO fear of my weapon discharging while I move around when it is properly holstered.

I don't think it's anti-gun, or even unrealistic. It merely recognizes that things made by people break. They are more likely to break while being moved or bounced around, or handled.

You ever had a shock or spring break on your car? Did it break while it was sitting in your garage, or while you were driving it? Same deal. While it's POSSIBLE that a shock or spring on your car could break while it's in the the garage, it most likely will happen when there's movement and jostles.

If you had "ZERO fear of your weapon discharging" while it's in your holster, does that mean you go around pointing the muzzle at your child's head, or wave it around in a crowded place? I would HOPE not. But, if you have ZERO fear of it going off, that means that you think it would be as safe as pointing a pad of paper at them.

It's one thing to "trust your equipment," " have faith in its design," etc. It would be foolhardy to have ZERO FEAR about something breaking or malfunctioning.

 

[.45 Dave]

I can understand your reasoning, however, I have personally seen many, many guns with grip safeties give shooters issues. A good example is with folks who shoot 1911's that get a good high grip on the gun, sometimes they will actually engage the grip safety by putting to much pressure on the beavertail portion of the safety, it is a hinged component. I have seen this issue even with grip safeties that have the so-called "speed-bump" employed as well.

As far as some of the newer polymer guns that also employ a grip safety, again, I have seen issues with the shooters grip give them problems.

The moral of Kirks story, is this.
Know your equipment.
Test/check your equipment periodically.
Repair/replace gear as and when necessary.

Absolutely agree--know your equipment. I personally have never had an issue with the back strap on my XD-40. In fact there have been a few times when I was darned glad I had it! I had the gun in my coat pocket once, reached in and quickly realized that I had my finger on the trigger. I make it a habit to remove my gun by the lower part of the grip so I am not touching the grip safety. If this had been a weapon with no grip safety it might have gone off. Scared me enough to retrain myself to be more careful, though.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Scared me enough to retrain myself to be more careful, though

. . . and to buy a holster before Kirk the Safety Nanny scolds me.

 

[avengedXT]

I have to say, not even an hour ago I made a post about how my ex-XD-fanboyness was converted to Glock-Fanboy. Well, I'm thinking the XD's are looking pretty sweet again with that Beavertail TYPE safety on the grip.

While alot of negative feedback on that grip safety exists out there, it's situations like this where it could be seen as a blessing that you could've used

 

[revance]

I don't think it's anti-gun, or even unrealistic. It merely recognizes that things made by people break. They are more likely to break while being moved or bounced around, or handled.

You ever had a shock or spring break on your car? Did it break while it was sitting in your garage, or while you were driving it? Same deal. While it's POSSIBLE that a shock or spring on your car could break while it's in the the garage, it most likely will happen when there's movement and jostles.

If you had "ZERO fear of your weapon discharging" while it's in your holster, does that mean you go around pointing the muzzle at your child's head, or wave it around in a crowded place? I would HOPE not. But, if you have ZERO fear of it going off, that means that you think it would be as safe as pointing a pad of paper at them.

It's one thing to "trust your equipment," " have faith in its design," etc. It would be foolhardy to have ZERO FEAR about something breaking or malfunctioning.

No matter how careful you are, during the course of a normal day, a holstered weapon is GOING to point at someone. That is why we carry them in holsters. Holstering and drawing is one thing, but when my DA/SA pistol is in a well functioning holster, I do have ZERO fear it is going to "just go off" like all the anti-gunners think they do. I think it is silly for someone to state that anytime you move around it could "just go off".

This guy did not have his gun properly holstered nor did he have a proper holster.

Do you not bend over while carrying unless your backside is against a backstop?

 

[GetA2J]

You opinion is yours to have even though incorrect. TRUE!

this would have occurred with an M&P, XD or any number of pistols regarded as top notch pistols by the "experts".

This would have NOT happened with my XD or my 1911. the grip safety is active and will not allow the gun to fire without a proper grip.
You can talk about flab engaging the grip safety if you want to but I still think it is rediculous to bring that argument up.

I also have to agree with Kirk that an open consciousness about the firearm and related equipment is paramount. This still would not have happened with either of the the kind of guns I trust every day. And safety is the reason I trust them.

 

[CandRFan]

I used to feel that way too, until I took an 8 hour Handgun course using a pistol with a manual safety..

Observations:
Even after hours of practice, I still occasionally "missed" the safety, imagine that in a real world situation

Thumb blisters are painful

My brain and finger are the only "manual" safety I need
---

I decided I want my firearm to be ready to go when I need it, no racking, no flicking off the safety, just... point, pull trigger, bang.

That's a good point. I have to get signed up for some training and see what my thumb thinks after eight hours.

 

[mainjet]

I believe that the 9mm can easily blow a hole in his pants. But what blew a hole in his underwear was something completely different. I believe that the holes in both the pants and underwear were caused by the same incident but different sources.

The gun has a mechanical safety and the other has a manual safety. I have seen the manual safety on the second source fail numerous times causing wide spread fear and panic to everyone on close proximity. Some feel they were lucky to have made it out alive.

 

[GetA2J]

 

[Polcat]

Interesting Article On Holstering Safety

Good article about a Glock that went off unintentionally while holstered.

SAFETY WARNING! Worn Leather Holsters Can Cause Accidental Discharges!

 

[redneckmedic]

That is a very very worn holster!!!