A friendly discussion of OC vs CC

[dom1104]

I am not sure I understand all this banter about stats and such.

Who cares?

If you are going to CC, CC. If you are going to OC, OC. On a given day, you may do either, or both.

I am not sure I get the issue here. Cant we all just get along?

I would also suggest, a draw from concealment can be, pretty darned fast.

YouTube - Jim Zubiena in SLOW MOTION

One of the early USPSA greats. Lightning Jim. The producers thought they would have to speed up the film to get a good draw.. but he was fast enough they didnt have to

 

[clgustaveson]

I am not sure I understand all this banter about stats and such.

Who cares?

If you are going to CC, CC. If you are going to OC, OC. On a given day, you may do either, or both.

I am not sure I get the issue here. Cant we all just get along?

I would also suggest, a draw from concealment can be, pretty darned fast.

YouTube - Jim Zubiena in SLOW MOTION

One of the early USPSA greats. Lightning Jim. The producers thought they would have to speed up the film to get a good draw.. but he was fast enough they didnt have to

I agree! 100% but I feel the argument being made is a political nightmare. When an action is thought to risk the lives of others, its a big deal...

PLUS I HATE when people on the internet are wrong...

 

[loony1]

I think you have a better chance of seeing a leprechaun riding a unicorn that has monkeys flying out of its butt than having a "friendly" conversation about OC vs CC

I lol'd

 

[.40caltrucker]

Cops wrestle with bad guys all the time, they chase them, tackle them, handcuff them, etc...so this doesn't surprise me that they lose their guns and get shot with them in these altercations.

The issue is for civilians OC-ing. I want to see 5 instances of it happening to civilians. I haven't heard about that in the news, not at all.

Businessman killed with own gun by intruder - INQUIRER.net, Philippine News for Filipinos

Watauga homeowner stabbed, shot with own gun during robbery
Home Invasion Suspect Shot, Killed by His Own Gun - WJW
Teen in Bloody Home Invasion Killed with His Own Gun - Pulse of the Bay - The Bay Citizen
Man breaking into home on Flint's north side shot and killed by homeowner | MLive.com
GUN WATCH

Those are all civilians and yes some were criminals breaking into houses shot by their own guns.

 

[clgustaveson]

Businessman killed with own gun by intruder - INQUIRER.net, Philippine News for Filipinos

Watauga homeowner stabbed, shot with own gun during robbery
Home Invasion Suspect Shot, Killed by His Own Gun - WJW
Teen in Bloody Home Invasion Killed with His Own Gun - Pulse of the Bay - The Bay Citizen
Man breaking into home on Flint's north side shot and killed by homeowner | MLive.com
GUN WATCH

Those are all civilians and yes some were criminals breaking into houses shot by their own guns.

Wait! Hold on... Were any of this people actually open carrying? Haha please tell me you realize that was the point!

You need to show a situation where someone was shot and killed by their own gun while open carrying.

 

[youngda9]

Did you read the articles you just cited...I don't see one that has anything to do with OC. Most are intruders getting their guns taken away from them and shot. One is a guy with a shotgun getting it taken away as he confronts a criminal in his house.

Which one has something to do with a good guy OC-ing and it getting used against him?

They are all instances of invasions where people had to go find their gun or fight a criminal...

 

[.40caltrucker]

Wait! Hold on... Were any of this people actually open carrying? Haha please tell me you realize that was the point!

You need to show a situation where someone was shot and killed by their own gun while open carrying.

Well yeah they were not only open carrying they were drawn and ready to use.


http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/archive/index.php/t-35197.htmlhttp://www.todaystmj4.com/news/local/95999354.html

I feel like I've accomplished 20% of your request. Open carry is pretty rare so it's hard to find a lot of stories on it. But I did find one, there was another mention of one but I couldn't find a good source for the story.

 

[clgustaveson]

Well yeah they were not only open carrying they were drawn and ready to use.


Man Legally Carrying Gun Robbed at Gunpoint | Today's TMJ4 - Milwaukee, Wisconsin News, Weather, Sports, WTMJ | Local News

I feel like I've accomplished 20% of your request. Open carry is pretty rare so it's hard to find a lot of stories on it. But I did find one, there was another mention of one but I couldn't find a good source for the story.

debunked ------

 

[.40caltrucker]

debunked ------

I was just reading that also he was charged with filing a false police report.

 

[clgustaveson]

I was just reading that also he was charged with filing a false police report.

Point is, it is not dangerous to open carry. Open carry does not escalate a situation. Open carry has been a very useful deterent in most cases.

 

[ATF Consumer]

Point is, it is not dangerous to open carry. Open carry does not escalate a situation. Open carry has been a very useful deterent in most cases.

If OC is so dangerous, makes you wonder why some states have it as the default method of carry.

 

[clgustaveson]

If OC is so dangerous, makes you wonder why some states have it as the default method of carry.

Don't go putting all your chips on the table.... sheesh

 

[ATM]

Save back some of the better points for later...

 

[.40caltrucker]

Point is, it is not dangerous to open carry. Open carry does not escalate a situation. Open carry has been a very useful deterent in most cases.

Open carry deters armed robbery in Kennesaw - Atlanta gun rights | Examiner.com

Yep and in this case OC probably saved their lives. I found more stories like this one.

For the record I never said I was against OC. Someone asked for cases and I tried to track some down.

 

[clgustaveson]

Open carry deters armed robbery in Kennesaw - Atlanta gun rights | Examiner.com

Yep and in this case OC probably saved their lives. I found more stories like this one.

For the record I never said I was against OC. Someone asked for cases and I tried to track some down.

So noted.

 

[ATM]

OC deterred criminals? I don't believe it!

They should clearly have been targeted first.


Deluded, I tell ya...

 

[clgustaveson]

OC deterred criminals? I don't believe it!

They should clearly have been targeted first.


Deluded, I tell ya...

You don't have to rub it in... sheesh this is a friendly discussion.

 

[JohnP82]

It's a personal choice. Each has it's own advantages and disadvantages. Carry OC, carry CC, do both, who cares, just carry.

 

[clgustaveson]

I think its important to point out, that we are not trying to convert people to OC... just trying to show that it is not dangerous to those involved in the situation.

 

[ATF Consumer]

I think its important to point out, that we are not trying to convert people to OC... just trying to show that it is not dangerous to those involved in the situation.

There is no changing some minds...no matter how factual of information you provide. We have a similar situation with having open carry walks...many, many people on here will tell you every reason why you shouldn't do it and what bad evil things that can happen, but everything they spew is hypothetical and speculative...no real hard cold facts worth anything. Oh, and they have been wrong in every instance so far.